Cover band using backing tracks?

[drummer5359]

I've done it as a drummer, it took the fun out of the performances if overdone. When we applied it lightly, such as adding a keyboard or horn part it was more effective and not as objectionable. (At least to me.)

Right now I'm playing a great cover band without backing tracks. Our lead guitarist uses a Roland guitar synth to cover keyboard parts. In the local scene we are playing some of the same venues as backing track bands. We have discussed adding tracks to a couple of songs, at this point we have decided not to.

I've done it, I'll likely do it again some day in the future, but it does take the spontaneity away from the performance and it is real easy to get carried away with it.

 

[Sixgunn]

Holy $h|t, this is the most depressing thread I've ever read here on TalkBass. Why is this OK? I saw a band we shared a bill with do this and it was shocking. You should sell yourself as an act and not a band if you do this. It is one step above Karaoke in my opinion. Bash me if you want, but it's not a band at this point. Ugh.

Yeah!! And my band don't cotton to that dang legtricty neither!!

 

[electracoyote]

There's a popular cover band around here that does it. Even the lead vocals are tracks. So the band just mimes to the tracks.

Last year at a concert in the park thing, the band's laptop took a dump with 20 minutes to go in the concert. When they figured out they couldn't fix it time, they tried (unsuccessfully) to just jam a 12 bar blues in E. It was beyond lame. It also the most entertaining part of the evening.

Bands using tracks to cover up lack of skills is lame, and a sizeable amount of the mainstream audience can tell.

The bands that are using tracks in my area are full of crack musicians and singers. They use tracks to augment their considerable skill level and to spread the paycheck. Not every band wants to put 8-12 musicians on a stage, and a lot of good rooms and stages are too small for that.

When I can, I go with eight musicians, and that includes a three-piece horn section. With two guitars, two keyboards, and three singers, there's not much we can't do in the Top 40 Variety format.

But if I can only get one horn to commit to a gig, we go with some supplemental tracked horns. One live horn gives most people the impression of a horn "section."

When we do a song like "Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough," the whole Jackson family laid down that percussion in the studio and there is a really complex orchestra section. We definitely track some of that.

 

[esoxhntr]

What Could Possibly Go Wrong?

One of the many reasons I give thanks daily for Talkbass...

 

[busmandan]

I did that for a couple of years. Our guitarist ran all the tracks from a laptop onstage and for the most part, it was fine. The drummer had a click in his ear and we just played to him.

The good - made a 4 piece sound freaking huge. Most lay people hear with their eyes anyway so the only people that carp on you are other musicians. It's kinda cheesy and I grew tired of it - but you usually make more $.

The bad - if the drummer gets off the click and you have prerecorded instrumentation playing along with you, the song turns into a polyrhythmic mess. The computer spews horn/string parts in seemingly random places because the song pretty much lost at that point - Ugly.

The grooves seem kinda lifeless too because every tempo is perfect. Not sure about now, but you and the drummer couldn't play with the tempo at all during the song. That drives me crazy.

And the song had to be played the same way, the same length, the same everything at every show - just to match the click. Tiresome.

BTW - I saw White Zombie get completely off the click track during an AMA show on TV. The played More Human than Human and the drummer got off the click - Holy Hell, what a mess.

But they kept mashing and no one seems to notice - quite sad, actually : )

I saw the White Zombie "performance" as well. I also noticed that the White Zombie performance was cut from the thousands of replays of that AMA show.

 

[Denniler]

I dont mind Loops but i wouldnt use tracks for guitar or keys.

 

[rogerb]

I just don't think it is needed. Find some way/arrangement to do it without. Depends what you are trying to achieve. Audience needs to be a bit flexible I guess, maybe those are hard to find these days.

 

[electracoyote]

Great post, that about sums it up. A couple of quick observations:

The bad - if the drummer gets off the click and you have prerecorded instrumentation playing along with you, the song turns into a polyrhythmic mess. The computer spews horn/string parts in seemingly random places because the song pretty much lost at that point - Ugly.

Absolutely ugly, and everyone in the room, even those who didn't care, is suddenly painfully aware. This is why, if you use tracks, someone needs to be close to the "stop" button and switch the damn thing off if it becomes a mess. Better to finish the song without the track.

The grooves seem kinda lifeless too because every tempo is perfect. Not sure about now, but you and the drummer couldn't play with the tempo at all during the song. That drives me crazy.

The songs we use tracks for were definitely recorded to a clock in the studio and are pretty much perfect in that respect, so they don't sound any more lifeless when we play them to a clock. You can inject dynamics while staying with a metronome, just not tempo-based dynamics.

And the song had to be played the same way, the same length, the same everything at every show - just to match the click. Tiresome.

This can be a serious drawback. If you've got a dance floor full of people, there is no opportunity for another guitar or sax solo, or to extend the song. It's going to end, same place every time. At least the tracked part.

I think the best thing you can do is to be judicious about the use of tracks, and try not to rely on them too much. In a typical 15-song set, we only use tracks on a few, and we remain determined to cover as much ground as possible without them.

 

[electracoyote]

I just don't think it is needed. Find some way/arrangement to do it without. Depends what you are trying to achieve. Audience needs to be a bit flexible I guess, maybe those are hard to find these days.

Depends on the client/audience needs/expectations. Once my target clients hear a couple of these other bands that use tracks, suddenly they're not as interested in the bands that don't.

But yeah, do as much as you can without tracks is a good rule.

 

[tekhedd]

I'm enjoying this discussion.

-I get the say on how much "bass synth" is in the backing tracks.

If you can play keyboards just a little, taking a compact monosynth to actually play "synth bass lines" live is really awesome. I used to use a blender pedal to avoid the complexity of yet another channel in the mix. Yes it's also one more thing to drag along for only a few songs, but very cool. There are a lot of cool mostly-analog synths available these days, as they are great for dance music.

Warning: if they discover you can play keyboards, they may want you to play keyboards all the time, and left hand bass, at which point you will also need to start looking for a new band or use that cyanide tablet you've been saving for a special occasion.

 

[jamro217]

Milli Chocolati?

 

[Hahaha]

Best quote i heard this year so far was "The problem with popular music is that its not made by musicians." Not sure who said it...

If I remember correctly that was a recording engineer who said that and he was referring to rap artists who brought records in to be sampled. Not the same thing as using backing tracks.

I don't understand why so many people think you're faking it when you play along with backing tracks. You're still playing just as much with the tracks as you would without them. If you're a good player, you can make it interesting regardless.

 

[hintz]

We use tracks in my current pop group along with IEM's, click, and it works great!! This is the 2nd group I've done the track thing with, we just have keys(or horns depending on availability of players)and some backing vocals and click added to our personal mixes! In the 1st group we didn't have a keyboardist, but we did have 2 singers so it was only keys and a click that only went to the drummer/BL!!

Both times it worked great *except*one time with a sub drummer... This is where the ability to shut off the tracks comes in *and* we keep the tracks low in the mix!! We also opened for Sam Hunt last summer and they had no bassist whatsoever so they had track bass *and* drums(I didn't dig this, but I'm biased)...

It can be done right!!

 

[s0c9]

I only ever played in one band that used "some" tracks.. I played guitar back then, not bass.
It worked fine... the pros were that we could do material we could not otherwise touch live.
The cons were that for those songs (as already mentioned) they were always the same length, same stopping point. They became TOTALLY REGIMENTED. Showboat songs..
The audience didn't care (or know?) unless something went wrong.

Funny tho'.. I never got asked where specific sounds came from.. until I started playing sax leads on my guitar, thru a GR synth.. <shrug>!

 

[Kragnorak]

What Could Possibly Go Wrong?

What I don't understand is: why is this guy who is supposed to be a great guitarist not just bending or whammying his notes into the correct pitch?

 

[s0c9]

What I don't understand is: why is this guy who is supposed to be a great guitarist not just bending or whammying his notes into the correct pitch?

If you'd ever played lead guitar when the pitch is off, you'd know it's not that simple.

 

[Dogbertday]

If used sparingly and the band creates the tracks i dont see how ANYONE can have a serious problem with this. Im in a country band (top 40) we dont use tracks but are seriously conisdering it because some of these songs have like 10 guitar parts going on. (3 part harmony leads, 2 sometimes doubled rhythm parts, banjo, mando, acoustic, etc etc) and we can create the tracks ourselves. No different than a looper pedal except you dont have to take time live creating loops and disrupt the song structure.

I was also in an originals act that used them because some organ parts were needed without hiring more people.

 

[Kragnorak]

If you'd ever played lead guitar when the pitch is off, you'd know it's not that simple.

There are long drawn out notes that he is playing out of tune. I don't see how that is different than when my bass is off and I'm bending up to pitch

 

[hintz]

What I don't understand is: why is this guy who is supposed to be a great guitarist not just bending or whammying his notes into the correct pitch?

He's probably close to deaf after 40plus years of playing arenas, he might not be hearing it!? I say this because I've read that Alex has lost quite abit of hearing, I wouldn't be surprised if they both have..

 

[Hahaha]

But yeah, do as much as you can without tracks is a good rule.

but it does take the spontaneity away from the performance and it is real easy to get carried away with it.

There was a well known Top-40 band in the Seattle area back in the seventies and eighties that had a full horn section. I went to see them in 89 and they had ditched all their instruments. The horns were replaced by female dancers, and the core players were dancing also. The whole band was doing choreographed dance steps along to full backing tracks. I thought it was ridiculous, but they were drawing bigger crowds than they ever had before. The club I saw them in had a line out the front door of people waiting to get in.

If the bands I work with now ever tried that we would have people rolling on the floor laughing hysterically at us. We would have to work comedy clubs rather than music venues. I was amazed that these guys were willing to become dancers rather than musicians. That was depressing. The band was Jonah's Whale, for anyone curious. They've been defunct for years now.