Mountain and Blue Cheer. What? What'cha say?
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I had ear plugs. I won't be going to any more concerts in that venue. And, I already have damage to my left ear from drummer and lead guitar to my left in 88! Went in for a test on my ears in 98 and the doc asked if I was in heavy construction. I asked what he was talking about and he said, "well, have you ever used a jackhammer without ear protection?" I wear ear plugs every rehearsal now.
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- Jan 26, 2014
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- I teach lessons and perform live music in and around San Diego CA. Sometimes I even make money doing it!
I've been an earplug guy for quite some time, and still got completely blown away by U2 at the LA forum. It sounded great, but was insanely loud. I had recently bought those stupid Dubs earplugs to try out, since their ads looked so pretty on Facebook. I wasn't expecting a complete failure, but it was so loud at the forum that the "hearing protection" was resonating a frequency in my ear, I had to remove them as it was painful. That show took months off my ears usefulness, no doubt.
Contrast that with 87 year old Burt Bacharach (yes, you read that right) at Belly Up in San Diego. It was mixed like listening in your living room. Every detail was crystal clear, one of the tightest, most talented bands I've ever seen. And you can listen to rock music at louder, but not instantly damaging levels, there are just a handful of venues I'll buy tickets for any more. Humphrey's here is mixed and reinforced Incredibly well. The Greek and Hollywood Bowl are both impeccable and have big rock acts.
I can't wait until the stupid loud era is over. Hated it when I wasn't old too
Contrast that with 87 year old Burt Bacharach (yes, you read that right) at Belly Up in San Diego. It was mixed like listening in your living room. Every detail was crystal clear, one of the tightest, most talented bands I've ever seen. And you can listen to rock music at louder, but not instantly damaging levels, there are just a handful of venues I'll buy tickets for any more. Humphrey's here is mixed and reinforced Incredibly well. The Greek and Hollywood Bowl are both impeccable and have big rock acts.
I can't wait until the stupid loud era is over. Hated it when I wasn't old too
Yes. I would rather not have tinnitus. I wrote LONG threads on the tinnitus (T) topic (quite) a few years ago. I fielded lots of questions from younger players scared out of their wits from that "ringing." I offered some decent, hard-earned advice. I hope I rescued a few folks' sanity. The phantom noises can drive some people mad, in the clinical sense. No joke. At any rate, I somehow kept my hearing--all of it--in spite of my youthful, em, risk-taking. It appears my sanity's within normal limits, also. However, I also kept the T. I've got some very good days, in which I barely perceive it. Some days, though, the T spikes something awful. So...I'm selling mine. Any buyers? Edit: It's my tinnitus that's up for sale. My hearing, I've conserved. Not for sale
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The most uncomfortable time I had for loudness was when I saw Free in the seventies with the late Paul Kossoff and Andy Fraser.
It wasn't the bass, guitar and drums that was the problem.
It was Paul Rodgers voice that was cranked up too high. He had a strong voice in any case, but, boy, did my eardrums hurt!
I have always been 60% deaf anyway, so the damage was already done.
It wasn't the bass, guitar and drums that was the problem.
It was Paul Rodgers voice that was cranked up too high. He had a strong voice in any case, but, boy, did my eardrums hurt!
I have always been 60% deaf anyway, so the damage was already done.
Van Halen. Fair Warning tour. Wow. My first big rock concert and it was blasting. Had ringing for days. Next year was the Scorpions who were even louder and this was an outdoor gig!!
Sometime in the late 80s I got paranoid about hearing loss and ever since then I wear plugs to EVERY live gig/rehearsal I play and any bands I go to see no matter the size of venue. I always have a few extra sets in my pocket just in case. I laugh at dummies who say that it ruins the music to wear plugs as they continue to destroy their ears!
Sometime in the late 80s I got paranoid about hearing loss and ever since then I wear plugs to EVERY live gig/rehearsal I play and any bands I go to see no matter the size of venue. I always have a few extra sets in my pocket just in case. I laugh at dummies who say that it ruins the music to wear plugs as they continue to destroy their ears!
I saw Motorhead a few times. They are the LOUD standard all other bands should be measured against.
The best indoor concert 'sound-wise' for me was Tackhead & the On-U sound system. Like an audiophile home stereo system, cranked. You could easily have a conversation with the person next to you, without raising your voice. Pant legs flapping from the bass tho'!!!
The best indoor concert 'sound-wise' for me was Tackhead & the On-U sound system. Like an audiophile home stereo system, cranked. You could easily have a conversation with the person next to you, without raising your voice. Pant legs flapping from the bass tho'!!!
The Black Flag at City Gardens in Trenton, NJ circa 1986. The building was a long concrete tube and the band had a new sound system from California. The sound was crystal clear and every band on the bill got increasingly louder. Right before the Black Flag came out, the dj played "My Sharona" by the Knack. The bass in that song was a gut punch. It literally blew the air out of your lungs.
Volume and dynamics are vital to music. So many times it's used to cover up questionable musicianship. Others, it's a pissing contest. Maybe I'm just an old fart.
Volume and dynamics are vital to music. So many times it's used to cover up questionable musicianship. Others, it's a pissing contest. Maybe I'm just an old fart.
Dream Theater at the Axis in Boston in 94 (hey, I was going to Berklee, what can I say - haha). Mindblowingly loud.
To go down this road: It's stunning to me how so many musicians don't give a crap about their hearing. One super loud concert can and will damage your ears at least a tiny bit. I know this because I dated someone for a while who's father was an ear doctor and gave me the lowdown many times, and also because my friends over the years who don't use earplugs all have far worse hearing damage than I do (most of mine is just from starting to get older, though I would probably have even better hearing if I had always been 100% careful). For musicians it's so massively worth it to get a pair of high quality custom earplugs -- they sound quite great. I was lucky in that I was (fairly) smart about it from a young age, but I made some mistakes like that Dream Theater show, and all of us hearing distortion from our ears because of the volume. I'm sure I lost a tiny bit there. And some other times in college, too. Once it's gone, it's gone.
I never, ever, see or play any kind of show or rehearse without wearing them now, though...have been doing that for about 20 years straight.
And don't get me started on headphones...that is such dangerous territory because you don't realize how loud they can be when you have them on. Biiiig mistake that so many people make -- me included, in the past. I sometimes hear people at the gym with the ear buds in where I can make out the song they're listening to from 10 feet away!
To go down this road: It's stunning to me how so many musicians don't give a crap about their hearing. One super loud concert can and will damage your ears at least a tiny bit. I know this because I dated someone for a while who's father was an ear doctor and gave me the lowdown many times, and also because my friends over the years who don't use earplugs all have far worse hearing damage than I do (most of mine is just from starting to get older, though I would probably have even better hearing if I had always been 100% careful). For musicians it's so massively worth it to get a pair of high quality custom earplugs -- they sound quite great. I was lucky in that I was (fairly) smart about it from a young age, but I made some mistakes like that Dream Theater show, and all of us hearing distortion from our ears because of the volume. I'm sure I lost a tiny bit there. And some other times in college, too. Once it's gone, it's gone.
I never, ever, see or play any kind of show or rehearse without wearing them now, though...have been doing that for about 20 years straight. And don't get me started on headphones...that is such dangerous territory because you don't realize how loud they can be when you have them on. Biiiig mistake that so many people make -- me included, in the past. I sometimes hear people at the gym with the ear buds in where I can make out the song they're listening to from 10 feet away!
Saw Buddy Guy a few years back at his club Legends in Chicago. Freaking phenomenal show and I was lucky enough to have front-row, center stage seats (less than 5 feet from Buddy himself!). However, he was running two of his Chicago Blues Box amps (I think) at full volume, and with his bright maple-fretboard Strat tone...I had trouble hearing out of my left ear for several days. Not really that sorry about it but I've never been to another concert without earplugs since.
Another time I was going to a mid-week show to check out an artist who's management asked me if I'd like to play bass for him. His tracks sounded okay but when he and the band started he had his acoustic cranked so high that it was distorting like an electric guitar. Tried my best but couldn't stay longer than two songs...didn't take the gig (if he was that loud live I view that as a major red flag).
Interestingly enough, I've been to several multi-band metal festivals (local acts up to Slayer and Anthrax) and even though it does get loud it's never to the point of inducing hearing damage.
Another time I was going to a mid-week show to check out an artist who's management asked me if I'd like to play bass for him. His tracks sounded okay but when he and the band started he had his acoustic cranked so high that it was distorting like an electric guitar. Tried my best but couldn't stay longer than two songs...didn't take the gig (if he was that loud live I view that as a major red flag).
Interestingly enough, I've been to several multi-band metal festivals (local acts up to Slayer and Anthrax) and even though it does get loud it's never to the point of inducing hearing damage.
It's not, of course, but rock in particular has such a strong association with being in-your-face-anti-authority-f***-you that some sound people think that's all that matters. Saw RHCP in the 90s and thought it was too loud. The most absurdly loud shows I've ever seen were Living Colour. Saw 'em three times, each louder than the last. The last show of theirs I saw was just utterly pointless. With earplugs in, I still felt it was way too loud, and there was virtually no distinction amongst the instruments -- it was just a wash of horrible, distorted mush. Really disappointing when you actually enjoy a band's music but their live shows are just audio hell.
A 100dB 1kHz sine wave will not kill your ears as you would be heading for the door very quickly. A loud 80Hz at 100 dB will not make you run for the door and hence damage your ears after a while. Our ears are most sensitive for freq between 1 and 3.5kHz. Deep freq at 50Hz are not perceived as loud and annoying at the same volume. Thats why we boost the lows on the stereo when playing at lower volumes to compensate. Fletcher-munchen syndrome. Could be spelled wrong. This is my nitpick with some live venues. They pump out a lot of non-Musical lows. I
A lot of progress have happened in the world of live PA sound. My country Danmark has a lot of experts in the field. Today the sound is spread out and getting things in phase using delay chains etc. In the early days you would have large speakers at the stage blasting our loud so the back row would get some volume but the first 20 rows would get tinnitus.
I've had a few cases where my ears rang for 3 or more days after a show. Death Angel, Overkill, Stryper and Brujeria left me like that. I like being up front or in the pit though so, I usually leave that way for most shows lol.
Misfits played to a crowd of 300 with volume enough for 3000, my ears were not the same for half of a week. If I would have known I would have brought ear plugs for sure.
Some people just love the volume. I did when I was young, too. I can't even remember when I started using plugs but I got my fitted ones about 20 years ago.
BTW, one visit to Boston by Motorhead resulted in blowing out the PA system in the venue.
BTW, one visit to Boston by Motorhead resulted in blowing out the PA system in the venue.
