Double Bass DB bicycle thread

[turf3]

Having ridden up and down Vermont climbs on dirt roads in torrential downpour numerous time I would not have survived where it not for my disc brakes.

That's kind of a "corner case of usage", don't you think?

For most all oddball bicycle design elements there's an application where it's the right tool for the job. I still maintain, however, that the plain old diamond frame steel bike with moderate width tires (say, 32-40 mm), several gears, rim brakes, derailleur gears, fenders, rat trap pedals, and moderate frame design, is the most practical tool for the vast majority of real world bicycling applications.

Let's face it, there's an application for the Formula One race car, the 1 ton pickup with dual rear wheels crew cab and 8 foot bed, the school bus, and the microcar. But in the Western world, the vast majority of automobile uses are served by a medium sized sedan, station wagon, or small SUV. It's much the same with bikes. Somehow in the last 20 years or so, "bicycling" seems to have been redefined as one of three things:

- Extreme off-road daredevil riding
- Pretending to be a professional road racer
- Puttering around the block on a 50 lb Walmart special once a week after dinner

 

[fdeck]

Still loving my Orbea hybrid, riding mostly on paved paths, walking trails, local parks, cemeteries, etc. Really enjoying the noseless saddle, too. I have an upright handlebar, but have seem other bikes with attachments on the ends of the bars that stick up, which lets the rider change hand positions and sometimes be more upright. Does anybody have any experience with these?

I've had bikes with flat bars, and they pound the hell out of my wrists. My personal opinion is that they're a good idea for off-road where you need the control. And of course they're cheap to make. But I see a lot of flat bar hybrids on the bike paths, and you can tell they're painful because the riders are trying to cope by either cupping their hands over the ends of the bar, or with their fists on top of the bars.

Adding more positions just means you're compensating for one painful position with another one.

Instead, all of my bikes now have swept handlebars. These are all basically Dad Bikes. Like with playing bass, a seemingly small change to your physical approach can make a big difference. With my wrists at an angle, it's much more comfortable, and I can ride for hours with no discomfort.

Bar extenders are certainly a cheap and easy upgrade, but switching from flat to swept bar isn't all that bad. You have to make sure the bar fits the components that you have. In the two pictures are bars with different clamp diameters, each one fits the bike it was bought for. One is called "FSA Metropolis" and the other "Origin8 City Classic". Then they still make the old fashioned Wald steel bars that are quite inexpensive.

My spouse, on the other hand, exclusively prefers drop bars.

 

[garrett2]

I think modern disc brakes are far better for water and descents. If you live somewhere flat and dry YMMV. But if you are going down and there's water coming down they are a godsend.

 

[Ooba Tooba]

I love love love my disc brakes. They are a revelation to me after all those years of rim brakes. Of course, I also loved the really old school brakes on my single speed Schwann when I was a kid where you had to pedal backward to apply them, so maybe I’m weird.

I resemble that remark haha! I still kick it old school with my single speed 1965 Sears Spaceliner Deluxe, but wouldn’t mind adding a more modern companion for challenging treks.

 

[turf3]

I find the straight bars are highly unergonomic and put a lot of strain on the wrists and elbows.

The adjujstment position of swept bars with the ends of them pointing up is even harder for me to comprehend. Talk about stressing the wrists and arms!

Traditional North Road bars - like the ones in Fdeck's post - are good, if you're willing to adjust them for straight wrists and minimum twist of the arm. In other words, adjust them according to your arms not according to a picture.

For me, the only thing that doesn't lead to hand numbness after half an hour or so is drop bars. For some reason, they seem scary to novice riders, though.

 

[overit]

Ergonomic drops on the roadie. Love these things.

My trail bike has 12degree sweep, anything more feels twitchy on rocky downhill sections

 

[Reiska]

Nowadays, for reqular riding like commuting, it`s 100% drop bars for me. Good overall ergonomics of the bike will become harder to achieve, but when once done there`s so many more options you can use, and none of those becomes a huge problem, even on a longer haul. Also, +100 for modern hydraulic disc brakes. My bike ( drop bars, first gen Shimano Ultegra 11 ) has mechanical disc brakes, and man are they anemic when conditions are less than optimal. I`d change that in a heartbeat if it wasn`t so goddamn expensive. When this ride is dead, the next one will have modern brakes on it.

 

[Wasnex]

man are they anemic when conditions are less than optimal

Have they always been that way? In my experience water has far less impact on disc brakes than rim brakes. Oil is a different matter. In my limited experience, if a disk gets contaminated with oil, braking power becomes greatly reduced and the only long-term fix is to replace both the disks and pads.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I've had bikes with flat bars, and they pound the hell out of my wrists. My personal opinion is that they're a good idea for off-road where you need the control. And of course they're cheap to make. But I see a lot of flat bar hybrids on the bike paths, and you can tell they're painful because the riders are trying to cope by either cupping their hands over the ends of the bar, or with their fists on top of the bars.

Adding more positions just means you're compensating for one painful position with another one.

Instead, all of my bikes now have swept handlebars. These are all basically Dad Bikes. Like with playing bass, a seemingly small change to your physical approach can make a big difference. With my wrists at an angle, it's much more comfortable, and I can ride for hours with no discomfort.

Bar extenders are certainly a cheap and easy upgrade, but switching from flat to swept bar isn't all that bad. You have to make sure the bar fits the components that you have. In the two pictures are bars with different clamp diameters, each one fits the bike it was bought for. One is called "FSA Metropolis" and the other "Origin8 City Classic". Then they still make the old fashioned Wald steel bars that are quite inexpensive.

My spouse, on the other hand, exclusively prefers drop bars.

View attachment 5452633
View attachment 5452634

These look good to me! I assume you can also get them to raise the bar at the hand level? It’s hard to tell from the pics. I don’t know what “twitchy” means in the posts above, but I’m really just cruising and trying protect my back at this point. I used to ride drop bars for years, but the last few times I got on one my back and neck didn’t like it much. Would love to be a little more upright, even without the drop bars.

 

[overit]

Have they always been that way? In my experience water has far less impact on disc brakes than rim brakes. Oil is a different matter. In my limited experience, if a disk gets contaminated with oil, braking power becomes greatly reduced and the only long-term fix is to replace both the disks and pads.

I'm guessing he meant the stopping power mech vs hydraulic than disc contamination.

 

[Wasnex]

I don’t know what “twitchy” means in the posts above

Twitchy means it's hard to ride in straight line and put the front tire precisely where you want it...basically the steering is a bit too sensitive.

 

[Reiska]

Have they always been that way? In my experience water has far less impact on disc brakes than rim brakes. Oil is a different matter. In my limited experience, if a disk gets contaminated with oil, braking power becomes greatly reduced and the only long-term fix is to replace both the disks and pads.

I'm guessing he meant the stopping power mech vs hydraulic than disc contamination.

Yes, stopping power. I`ve had similar rides with rim brakes, cantilever and mini-V, and both of those options had more stopping power than the one I have now. Granted, both the cantis and mini-V`s I had were top of the line quality, but still these are Shimano mechanical brakes that I have now with Shimano Ultegra STI levers. Some guys use non-streching cable casing ( that`s the right word? ) which helps with the stopping power of mechanical disc brakes, and use higher quality brakes, but yet they`re still what they are. With hydraulic brakes it`s all different story.

Edit: I ride throughout the year, and everything but summer can and will get pretty harsh around this godforsaken part of the planet.

 

[Reiska]

These look good to me! I assume you can also get them to raise the bar at the hand level? It’s hard to tell from the pics. I don’t know what “twitchy” means in the posts above, but I’m really just cruising and trying protect my back at this point. I used to ride drop bars for years, but the last few times I got on one my back and neck didn’t like it much. Would love to be a little more upright, even without the drop bars.

Chris, if you`re about to ride a bike with drop bars one day again, get the bike from where you get a fitting by a pro. This is what I will do when the time comes.

 

[Wasnex]

In my experience riding position and how well the bike is fit to your body has more of an impact than bar style.

I have ridden drop, flat, riser, swept, etc, and IMHO they all get uncomfortable if I ride on flat ground in a straight line for very long. The only exception for me has been my Tour Easy recumbent.

Stock photo:

Since the seating position is reclined, there is very little pressure on the hands.

 

[Roland GR 88]

My solution for getting old and needing to slow down for a guy that’s been on drop bars since the ‘70’s
Gevenalle modded TRP Hylex brakes using Microshift bar end shifters. It’s the least expensive way to use drop bar shifters with mtn bike derailleurs and hydraulic discs.
Everyone laughs until they take it for a spin.

 

[Wasnex]

Would love to be a little more upright, even without the drop bars.

Finding the right bike involves a trip down the old rabbit hole.

The first part is choosing a style of bike that is designed to give you a more upright riding position. However, finding the desired comfort involves selecting a brand and model with geometry that is suited to your particular body. Next is to get the fit in the ballpark by choosing the correct size frame. After that you should be able to fine tune the fit by selecting and adjusting components such as the stem, handlebar, and seat.

I ride mostly mountain bikes. I have a long torso and short legs, which seems to complicate fit with the bike.

My older Trek bikes are size medium-large and they have 70mm stems. My new Revel bike is a large with a 40mm stem. I chose large based on the effective tube tube, reach, stack, and stem length. Revel is a fairly obscure direct-to-consumer brand and I bought the bike without ever seeing one. I was shooting for reasonably consistent fit across all three bikes. Result: On the Revel the distance to the handgrip feels slightly short seated and slightly long standing.

To improve the ergonomics over the Revel, I need a bike with shorter reach (B) but a longer effective top tube (I). The longer top tube would make the bike more comfortable and the shorter reach would make it easier to wheelie and jump.

Based on the geometry of the new Pivot Switchblade, I think the best fit would be a medium. This bike has flip chip that changes the suspension and geometry slightly. In the HI position, reach is 1mm longer and tube tube is 3mm longer than the Revel. In the LOW position, reach is 4mm shorter and effective top tube is 4mm longer. My point here is the medium Pivot has similar geometry to the large Revel, and the Pivot's geometry could potentially be slightly better fit for me.

Ideally I would have demoed a Pivot and a Revel.

 

[james condino]

In the last month I've replaced the entire shifter, cables, pistons and disc brakes on my Lynskey, PLUS the master cylinder & brakes on my old truck AND the brakes on the prius. I could have purchased a new bass for all of that $$$, but it feels good to be able to stop again!

Strangely, I only have one bicycle right now (but a very nice one), but I ride it as much as possible. 'Headed out tonight!

 

[Reiska]

My solution for getting old and needing to slow down for a guy that’s been on drop bars since the ‘70’s
Gevenalle modded TRP Hylex brakes using Microshift bar end shifters. It’s the least expensive way to use drop bar shifters with mtn bike derailleurs and hydraulic discs.
Everyone laughs until they take it for a spin. View attachment 5453550

That is one cool looking bike right there.

Edit: I`ve been actually thinking about something a bit similar with my carbon frame 29`r, a drop bar " monstercross ". The bike is a Giant XCT that had it`s front suspension swapped to ( a tad too low ) rigid carbon fork, and drivetrain converted to a fixed gear with a ENO hub. It would need a new fork though, and money`s a bit tight atm.

 

[Roland GR 88]

That is one cool looking bike right there.

Thanks, I get lots of stares but it’s super comfy, goes downhill as fast as anything else and climbs easily but slowly.
If Laz-E-Boy and Colnago got together this would be the bike.

 

[fdeck]

These look good to me! I assume you can also get them to raise the bar at the hand level? It’s hard to tell from the pics. I don’t know what “twitchy” means in the posts above, but I’m really just cruising and trying protect my back at this point. I used to ride drop bars for years, but the last few times I got on one my back and neck didn’t like it much. Would love to be a little more upright, even without the drop bars.

I'm in the same situation with drop bars: "My neck don't bend that way no more." I'm prone to tweaking some nerves in my neck, and want to avoid the danger zone while riding.

Twitchy means that the bike is highly responsive to control from the handlebars, making it much more maneuverable but also perhaps a bit unnerving to the casual rider. Two things. First you quickly get used to a twitchy bike, and second, our kinds of bikes start out with much more stable geometries (having to do with the angles of the steering tube and fork) to begin with. I've not experienced a problem with any of my bikes. One is essentially a sporty-looking hybrid, the other an old Schwinn road bike frame built up with odds and ends from the bone yard.

In addition to the wrist angle and higher posture, I also like my hands further back so I'm not reaching out as much. And further adjustments are possible. On my yellow bike, look how short the stem is -- the handlebar is barely a couple inches forward of the steer tube. Some bikes, you can flip the stem so it's pointing upward rather than downward. There are steering tube extenders. Lots of options. At some point you might find that the cables aren't long enough for further adjustment unless you install longer cables.

... adjust them according to your arms not according to a picture.

Indeed, I've noticed that the marketing pictures always show bikes with high saddles and low bars, but when you see guys my age on the same bikes, they've always raised up the cockpit.