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Did 70's Precision basses have a different pickup?

KOLAD

KOLAD

Feb 14, 2014
110
27
New England
#1
I've always wondered what the difference was from a 60's P-Bass pickup and a 70's P-Bass pickup.
Forever have I tried to get that 70's P-Bass pickup sound, and I wanted to know your opinions of whether they used different specs for the Fender P-Bass pickup in the 70's, or if it was the same thing as they were producing in the 60's and I'm crazy.
To me the 70's P-Basses have always had a "nastier" type of midrange kind of sound. Most of my favorite rock P-Bass sounds have been guys using 70's P-Basses stock. Think of the P-bass sounds of guys like Roger Waters/Pink Floyd, JJ Burnel/The Stranglers, Paul Simonon/The Clash, Denny Laine/Wings (when Paul played piano) - that P-Bass sound.

Anybody know what was different about the P-Bass pickup produced during the 1970's?
 
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#2
The pickups built in '60-'64 were wrapped by hand with heavy formvar wire, wide sand cast AlNiCo 3/4 polepieces, and around 11k winds. All that the changed in '65 when CBS took over the reigns when they decided that they need to cut costs by using machines and plain enamel wire. They also made the polepeices smaller and cut the number of winds to 9.5k to 10k winds.
 
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#3
You hit the nail right on the head. A nastier midrangey kind of sound with not as much bottom end. It's why I never got along with 70's Fenders and modded my 76 Precision to hell and back, but to each their own.
 
#4
People always blame this on CBS and its just not the case. Production pickups as early as '63 had some examples of plain enamel. Moreover the plain enamel switch was complete before CBS even owned the company. It was i'm sure a cost savings measure but people have it in their heads that CBS came in with this big accountant mentality and destroyed the company and that is nonsense. If that were the case bound necks would have been cut as they are way more labor intensive and the were the norm on all high end instruments of the CBS era (Jazzmaster, Jazz bass, Bass VI, Jaguar, Electric 12).

Any perceived negative change that happened in the mid sixties was blamed on CBS. The main thing they did wrong was to not do a better job of controlling public opinion during the early transition years as almost the entire staff including quality control stayed the same until well into late sixties by the accounts of most former employees.

BTW i like both heavy formvar and plain enamel pickups. They are different but both are cool.
 
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#5
SneakyT said:
People always blame this on CBS and its just not the case. Production pickups as early as '63 had some examples of plain enamel. Moreover the plain enamel switch was complete before CBS even owned the company. It was i'm sure a cost savings measure but people have it in their heads that CBS came in with this big accountant mentality and destroyed the company and that is nonsense. If that were the case bound necks would have been cut as they are way more labor intensive and the were the norm on all high end instruments of the CBS era (Jazzmaster, Jazz bass, Bass VI, Jaguar, Electric 12).

Any perceived negative change that happened in the mid sixties was blamed on CBS. The main thing they did wrong was to not do a better job of controlling public opinion during the early transition years as almost the entire staff including quality control stayed the same until well into late sixties by the accounts of most former employees.

BTW i like both heavy formvar and plain enamel pickups. They are different but both are cool.
Click to expand...

Thank you great post I also get tired of the CBS blah blah people think the entire company was changed overnight
 
#7
I did a lot of investigation about Leo Fender's way of production ...

I totally agree to SneakyT ...
We have so many 'strange' Fender guitars during the Leo Fender era because saving money (and time) had always been a part of Leo Fenders philosophy.

CBS also did some 'strange things' - but don't blame it all on CBS ...
 
#10
Well said Sneaky T.
There are some that say the 65 Strat that was made for maybe 6 months with the jumbo frets was the best one they made until the modern instruments came out.
I have had both 60's and 70' basses that were amazing as well as not so good.
I have found that for the most part, the 60's had more stable necks and more consistent pups which makes no sense since many were hand wound with not as much QC.

It gets down to personal minutia as even the Squires could be on a platinum record.
I think the amps are much more important assuming the instrument can play in tune with reasonable action.
Of course it's really about the player as a pro can make any brand of tool get the job done.
There's a local guy that uses a Squier with Chinese pups as his vintage Strat and Flying V are to valuable to leave the house. With a decent amp, you'd be hard pressed to hear much difference between the real 57' and the Squier.
 
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#11
"They" say that 60s jazz and P pick ups has more pronounced midrange and 70s pups has more bottom and snappy high end. For me, 70s Js and Ps sounds better, but as Jimmy said, to each their own.
For OP, sound you re talking about lies more in production and the way these bass players played, not the pick up. they played through the tube amps and with picks too...
 
#17
I believe body and fretboard woods make the main difference.

the ash/maple nitro finished '57 style Nash I used to own sounded very much like what you'll expect from a 70's P. I changed three pickups in that bass and it always kept it's character which consisted of a super punchy low end and bright high mids which made for a very muscular finger style and pick tone. slap tone was instant Freddie Washington's tone on Patrice Rushen's Forget Me Nots.

my alder/rosewood '62 AV P-bass sounds very mellow in comparison.
 
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#18
I have a 73 all original P, and its pup has a notceably 'compressed' and punchy sound. Its very suited for rock stuff as teh op suggests.
To compare, I also have a P with a '62 reissue pup - this is very full-range, with clarity, lots of clear treble and quite low output. The 70s one is much higher output, less clarity and much more punch & low end.
I 've heard the old thing about CBS cutting costs by underwinding, but my 72 basically has all the hallmarks of being *overwound* compared to the 60s style reissue...

hth
 
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#19
seinzumtode said:
The pickups built in '60-'64 were wrapped by hand with heavy formvar wire, wide sand cast AlNiCo 3/4 polepieces, and around 11k winds. All that the changed in '65 when CBS took over the reigns when they decided that they need to cut costs by using machines and plain enamel wire. They also made the polepeices smaller and cut the number of winds to 9.5k to 10k winds.
Click to expand...

Fender never used heavy Formvar wire on their bass pickups, only the guitar pickups. Certain pickups also used bondable wire, but mostly it was plain enamel.

The 70's pickups were still 10,000 turns per coil.
 
#20
SneakyT said:
People always blame this on CBS and its just not the case. Production pickups as early as '63 had some examples of plain enamel. Moreover the plain enamel switch was complete before CBS even owned the company. It was i'm sure a cost savings measure but people have it in their heads that CBS came in with this big accountant mentality and destroyed the company and that is nonsense. If that were the case bound necks would have been cut as they are way more labor intensive and the were the norm on all high end instruments of the CBS era (Jazzmaster, Jazz bass, Bass VI, Jaguar, Electric 12).

Any perceived negative change that happened in the mid sixties was blamed on CBS. The main thing they did wrong was to not do a better job of controlling public opinion during the early transition years as almost the entire staff including quality control stayed the same until well into late sixties by the accounts of most former employees.

BTW i like both heavy formvar and plain enamel pickups. They are different but both are cool.
Click to expand...

..and the terrible paint, neck pocket gaps and 7 lb. (cheaper wood) bodies all just "came together" at the right time?

PS. I love my 70's basses and I have quite a few.
 

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