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Did I handle this the wrong way? LONG RANT

If the point of this thread is whether or not the guy missed an opportunity to educate the OP and make a sale, then you and I are in complete agreement. If the question is whether or not the OP handled the situation well, then I think the situation he described makes him sound very uncool.

I respectfully disagree. The OP (sorry for calling you a kid- but if you're less than 35 years old you *are* a kid to me, haha) has every right to point out that he can get the same bass more cheaply online. It is a simple fact. Nothing uncool about that whatsoever. He also has a right to challenge the published price, to negotiate, and try to get himself a better deal. A customer does not have to somehow respect a retailer's pricing policy! Especially when it is obvious to everyone it can be had for less money elsewhere.

That's where the salesman steps in and points out the value proposition of buying exactly the bass you just spent 20 minutes checking out. To me there is a lot of value in that, especially in instruments, no two of which are ever truly identical.

As for the "it's used" argument, so what. You can look right at it, check every aspect of it out, hold it in your hands, play it through an amp, heck I even bring my rig into the store to try out new gear to see how it will work for me. If you can't tell what's wrong with it due to other customers playing it, that's on you. It is also still covered by a warranty when sold as new. A brand new completely unhandled instrument is not necessarily better, especially once UPS/FedEx get through with it.
 
I read the whole thread Ben, what post specifically are you referring to? What I am referring to is specifically this, copied from the original post:

Me: “OK. Well, the ($$$) is the same price as Musician’s Friend so if you want to compete with them then your price should be lower or there should be an advantage to buying it here.”
Him: (surprised and a little harsh) “Like what?”
Me: “Well, I don’t have to pay sales tax with them and they ship for free. If I buy it here I have to pay tax.”
Him: (starting to get angry) “Well I’m sorry but I have to collect tax there’s nothing I can do about that.”
Me: “I’m sorry, you misunderstood me. It’s not about the tax it’s about giving me an incentive to buy from you.”
Him: (really getting angry) “And what kind of incentive do you want? You know, I just can’t go around giving (explanative) away, that’s not good business and it’s not the way I do business.”

I cannot blame OP for following this course of logic. But I can say that the hard feelings could easily have been averted by the salesman/owner, right after OP said:

Me: “I’m sorry, you misunderstood me. It’s not about the tax it’s about giving me an incentive to buy from you.”

The salesman/owner should have explained the benefits of buying locally:
- Try before you buy- you know *exactly* what you are getting
- Have instrument immediately
- Not having to risk shipping of instrument via UPS or FedEx
- Easy management of warranty returns

If that didn't sway the OP, then you add new things to the deal, at reduced (but still profit-making) price: new strings, 50% off, a new strap, a free set-up (sacrifice a bit of operating cost to move a new bass).

Instead the OP got thrown out of the store. Perhaps if OP wanted to handle it differently, he could have just backed down once it was obvious the owner didn't want to haggle on the price of the bass, but for Pete's sake there is certainly no expectation that OP *should have* to do that out of propriety or some sense of politeness. He was just asking for a deal, and there's nothing wrong with that.


I am interested in what you are you talking about Ben?
 
Frankly, I don't know about all the other "ancillary" stuff because I would have been gone after 5 minutes - let alone 10 minutes.

If the store personnel don't have the time for me - screw 'em. I can buy a bass anywhere. It's THEIR sale to lose.

Now, let me be clear here. If I walk into a store and they acknowledge me and ask for a couple of minutes because they are busy, then fine. But NEVER make the mistake of ignoring me. My money spends just as well ANYWHERE.
 
This just means that they were successful at selling you on the hometown loyalty angle. And for them, as a business, it is usually their best sales angle. It is one thing they do that the big boys can't.

As a customer, you are probably right. The service they can provide might be worth the extra cash. But don't make the mistake that they have some personal loyalty to you. Their loyalty is to your wallet and making sure your wallet comes back to the store.
Pretty cynical. I'm not saying all business men are angels, but there are people who just want to do the right thing. I was in business for 15 years and I treated my customers well out of professional pride as well as to make money. I lost money on some deals because I wanted to make sure my customers were always treated fairly. There is more to life than making money. The key is finding other people that understand that too.
 
Pretty cynical. I'm not saying all business men are angels, but there are people who just want to do the right thing. I was in business for 15 years and I treated my customers well out of professional pride as well as to make money. I lost money on some deals because I wanted to make sure my customers were always treated fairly. There is more to life than making money. The key is finding other people that understand that too.

HUGE +1
 
I've owned stores and sometimes my margin is so tight on big ticket items that I can not match the big box stores. FACT 90% of the time

Customers never thanked me for a discount because they figured they deserved the lower price. FACT 90% of the time

However if I gave a $50 accessory rather than a $50 discount on the big ticket item, customers remember the gift. FACT

The markup % on accessories is much higher than big ticket items. FACT 99% of the time

So I give a $50 gift that cost me $20 . . . I am $30 dollars ahead. FACT

Customer is happy and remembers the gift . . . I engraved the stores name on the gifts I gave FACT

This is how you run a business but I find that most business owners do not understand these simple techniques and most staff have no clue on how to negotiate with a customer.
 
gordon5377 said:
Your point is well taken, and I have no reason to argue with you. Rude? I never raised my voice or swore. Did I go about it in the best possible way I could have. No. So, okay, you got me. But just to be clear: I am neither a 'kid' nor a 'deadbeat'. And the issue was not about paying the tax. And if this is the way the discussion is going from here out...I'm done. I admitted I was wrong, I've made peace with myself over it, I'm moving on. And maybe, just for the sake of pleasing those who think I was a deadbeat d-bag, I'll go back to the store and apologize.

Sorry, dude... I didn't mean to pile it on here. Sometimes these discussions can cause us (me) to stake a position for the sake of debate and cling to it pretty hard during the discussion. I do agree that it sounds like the service at this shop was not that great.
 
Originally Posted by gordon5377

Your point is well taken, and I have no reason to argue with you. Rude? I never raised my voice or swore. Did I go about it in the best possible way I could have. No. So, okay, you got me. But just to be clear: I am neither a 'kid' nor a 'deadbeat'. And the issue was not about paying the tax. And if this is the way the discussion is going from here out...I'm done. I admitted I was wrong, I've made peace with myself over it, I'm moving on. And maybe, just for the sake of pleasing those who think I was a deadbeat d-bag, I'll go back to the store and apologize.

Sorry, dude... I didn't mean to pile it on here. Sometimes these discussions can cause us (me) to stake a position for the sake of debate and cling to it pretty hard during the discussion. I do agree that it sounds like the service at this shop was not that great.

Seems like this thread is done. :help:
 
and people wonder why MF and GC took a bug chunk of business away .

A freind of mine was verbally assulted for not washing his hands before picking up a guitar .

The bathrooms in the store had big signs that read "EMPLOYEES ONLY!"

He bought somehwere else...

I don't deal with ******** and I am not a difficult customer . I work hard for my money and if you want some of it treat me like I treat you or I'll find someone who does.
 
The tax thing WILL change if it hasn't already .

States are going to require retailers to collect and deliver . I guarantee it .

In Indiana when you file your state tax return you have to disclose , under penalty of perjury and tax evasion , that you did or did not buy anything on line or out of state and if so state the price and pay the state sales tax.

enjoy it while it lasts.
 
Then let's hope MF and Sweetwater, et. al. stop crowing about customers not having to pay sales tax since that is misleading. Unfortunately tax law is such that you're liable even if someone gave you bad information.

But seriously, who has time to keep track of how much and when you purchased something online? It's hard enough to keep track of how much I earned through my day job and by gigging, and keep an accurate record of mileage and incident expenses. If states want sales tax from online businesses, then they better get their reciprocity straightened out and make the online retailers apply the sales tax based on the billing address. They have the servers to do that automatically!
 
Indiana Mike said:
The tax thing WILL change if it hasn't already .

States are going to require retailers to collect and deliver . I guarantee it .

In Indiana when you file your state tax return you have to disclose , under penalty of perjury and tax evasion , that you did or did not buy anything on line or out of state and if so state the price and pay the state sales tax.

enjoy it while it lasts.

If the state really tried to enforce those laws they would go bankrupt with legal fees. It would cost them far more to go after someone then they would recoup on some sales tax.
 
If the state really tried to enforce those laws they would go bankrupt with legal fees. It would cost them far more to go after someone then they would recoup on some sales tax.

my point being it will become automatic soon.

Computers will handle it ,they already can ,its a matter of putting it in policy and law . With tax bases being down due to the economy I would wager its going to happen

People will lose the benefit of no sales tax when purchasing items on line from another state.

Its just an assumption I think will eventually become reality.

If I order from Sweetwater I pay tax ,warehouse in state .
If in order from MF I pay tax , somehow tied to Indiana ,even though based in kansas
 

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