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Didn't get paid for a gig :(
- Thread starter bassistjoe93
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jive1
Commercial User
If you're seeking the truth, or meaningful discussion, it's better to talk about it in PM where you can actually have a discussion. Doing it on this thread is just grandstanding or trolling, and will wind up getting the thread closed.
Hawkbone said:
Where are the mods when you need one and why is this still here? There is a thread for atheist bassists and Christian bassists. I was under the impression views of either sort were not welcome here? If I was wrong I'll take back my supporting membership fee anytime. Feel free to shoot that refund right over.
If the pastor won't/can't help you then go to the Board of Trustees/Governors/(whatever term they use).
All churches have a higher governing authority both corporate and spiritual. I suggest finding out where they are located and contacting them by certified letter.
Is there a video of the gig? I suggest getting a copy.
How about pictures with you in them?
+1` on Small Claims Court.
Don't let your money be stolen.
All churches have a higher governing authority both corporate and spiritual. I suggest finding out where they are located and contacting them by certified letter.
Is there a video of the gig? I suggest getting a copy.
How about pictures with you in them?
+1` on Small Claims Court.
Don't let your money be stolen.
Unfortunately, having a strong religious belief or at least publicly displaying strong religious beliefs doesn't always go hand in hand with morality.
If you haven't taken your case straight to the pastor, I'd do that as soon as possible. If he plays the fool (for all we know, he could be just as much responsible as the person who set the event up) than there is always a higher up for him that you can take your case to.
If the bathroom in the church has a busted toilet, they don't get to dodge the plumbing bill. Your situation should be no different.
If you haven't taken your case straight to the pastor, I'd do that as soon as possible. If he plays the fool (for all we know, he could be just as much responsible as the person who set the event up) than there is always a higher up for him that you can take your case to.
If the bathroom in the church has a busted toilet, they don't get to dodge the plumbing bill. Your situation should be no different.
+1
Get stuff in writing next time.
I'd say it's unwise to burn any bridges at your stage though.
Musicians get ****ed over all the time.
Getting things on paper or even email might help prevent that from happening in the future.
Hope it doesn't get locked. Delete any offending posts and move on. It will be of value for others to see what course(s) of action OP takes and what result(s) he gets. Good luck with it OP.
I haven't lownered this thread I promise! 
But as far as an update:
I did repeatedly call him, he never answered, I visited his house and he never came to the door. I really just wanted answers as much as cash. So instead of flying off the handle, I left him a voicemail saying basically, I regretted and hated being treated the way I have been in all this. I made my peace with the situation. He pays child support to some woman he knocked up and has no job, by his choice granted, so I can assume my money was used for that. I told him I have forgiven him for treating me that way but I have nothing further to say to him, want no more gigs from him, etc. He never replied. Go figure. This hasn't been ideal but I've made my peace and I'm gonna enjoy my Christmas regardless! Let the "you're a pansy" posts begin!
But as far as an update: I did repeatedly call him, he never answered, I visited his house and he never came to the door. I really just wanted answers as much as cash. So instead of flying off the handle, I left him a voicemail saying basically, I regretted and hated being treated the way I have been in all this. I made my peace with the situation. He pays child support to some woman he knocked up and has no job, by his choice granted, so I can assume my money was used for that. I told him I have forgiven him for treating me that way but I have nothing further to say to him, want no more gigs from him, etc. He never replied. Go figure. This hasn't been ideal but I've made my peace and I'm gonna enjoy my Christmas regardless! Let the "you're a pansy" posts begin!
I was in a similar situation- My old bandleader, who I thought was my good friend, got us a gig in the local classic car show. He is good friends with the event promoter, knows him because they are both members of a large-denomination church. Not naming the denomination, but they are a VERY fiscally conscious sect, enforced tithing etc. He told us that they have a huge entertainment budget, which makes sense because in past years the show has hosted some classic-rock casino-circuit regulars. So we were pumped to hear that we were each going to net about a grand or so conservatively, judging by the "local entertainment" portion of the budget. Us and one other local band filled that billing.
This was to be our last show together as well, due to folks moving out of state. So, we all made the sacrifices necessary to get together for rehearsals, some commuting miles to be there, bought some new equipment and so forth, and on the day gave 100% and put on a hell of a show.
Two weeks later, and no pay. I'm not hurting for it, because I have a day job, but our keybords player is in college and could use some extra cash. So I ask the drummer (who happens to be the same sect and go to the same church as the BL) He says he hasn't gotten paid either... and bad news. His wife had asked the BL's wife about payment the week before, and apparently... wait for it... the BL had made a deal with the promoter to let us play the show for FREE without telling us. This boggles my mind.
So that's it. Religion has nothing to do with it.
Did I mention that the drummer was the same religion as the BL? Yet a wonderful guy, a good guy, who got screwed just as hard as the rest of us in the deal.
Given the opportunity, human beings will screw other human beings over because whatever they get gratifies or enriches them in some way at your expense, and frankly (sadly), some times they realize that they can because you are nice enough to let them get away with it instead of dragging them into court or media-splashing them into infamy.
What I've learned: Trust, but verify. Gig fees negotiated IN ADVANCE with every venue. Split proceeds clearly delineated and understood IN ADVANCE with band members. BL gets a slightly larger cut. He's management, and owns the PA/lighting/etc; thems the rules. If a venue insists upon paying post-gig, BL (me) fronts advance payment to band members from accounts payable fund. PAYMENT IS THE BL's RESPONSIBILITY, NOT THE VENUE's. Non-paying venues will be litigated against and publicly vilified.
Color me cynical but solvent. A gigging band is a business. End rant.
This was to be our last show together as well, due to folks moving out of state. So, we all made the sacrifices necessary to get together for rehearsals, some commuting miles to be there, bought some new equipment and so forth, and on the day gave 100% and put on a hell of a show.
Two weeks later, and no pay. I'm not hurting for it, because I have a day job, but our keybords player is in college and could use some extra cash. So I ask the drummer (who happens to be the same sect and go to the same church as the BL) He says he hasn't gotten paid either... and bad news. His wife had asked the BL's wife about payment the week before, and apparently... wait for it... the BL had made a deal with the promoter to let us play the show for FREE without telling us. This boggles my mind.
So that's it. Religion has nothing to do with it.
Did I mention that the drummer was the same religion as the BL? Yet a wonderful guy, a good guy, who got screwed just as hard as the rest of us in the deal.
Given the opportunity, human beings will screw other human beings over because whatever they get gratifies or enriches them in some way at your expense, and frankly (sadly), some times they realize that they can because you are nice enough to let them get away with it instead of dragging them into court or media-splashing them into infamy.
What I've learned: Trust, but verify. Gig fees negotiated IN ADVANCE with every venue. Split proceeds clearly delineated and understood IN ADVANCE with band members. BL gets a slightly larger cut. He's management, and owns the PA/lighting/etc; thems the rules. If a venue insists upon paying post-gig, BL (me) fronts advance payment to band members from accounts payable fund. PAYMENT IS THE BL's RESPONSIBILITY, NOT THE VENUE's. Non-paying venues will be litigated against and publicly vilified.
Color me cynical but solvent. A gigging band is a business. End rant.
I haven't lownered this thread I promise!
I did repeatedly call him, he never answered, I visited his house and he never came to the door. I really just wanted answers as much as cash. So instead of flying off the handle, I left him a voicemail saying basically, I regretted and hated being treated the way I have been in all this. I made my peace with the situation. He pays child support to some woman he knocked up and has no job, by his choice granted, so I can assume my money was used for that. I told him I have forgiven him for treating me that way but I have nothing further to say to him, want no more gigs from him, etc. He never replied. Go figure. This hasn't been ideal but I've made my peace and I'm gonna enjoy my Christmas regardless! Let the "you're a pansy" posts begin!
You're a pansy!
Honestly, it sounds like you did the right thing for yourself. If you're happy then that's all that matters
Still, I'm sorry you had to put up with that nonsense. It's lame to have someone you thought you could trust destroy a friendship over something as petty as gig money that they promised you. Live and learn. From one college aged kid to another I'll just throw out my 2 cents of wisdom. Whenever possible, try to get paid before a gig. Even partial payment is better than nothing. If you can't do that, then refuse to leave the venue until payment has been made. Never be afraid to stand up for yourself because there will always be people like this.
Been there before as well. I had a trio that was scheduled to play a pregame party for a fraternity house sophomore year of college. My guitarist, who was friends with the the frat's social chair, told myself and our drummer that we'd be making $600 for the gig.
Come gig day I was making my rounds at the frat house before we were scheduled to start setting up just to meet people and to get a feel for the place. I happened to meet the social chair while I was walking around and I asked him how they were planning to pay us. He just looked at me bewildered and said, "Xxxxx said you guys would play for free."
I told the chair what the deal was and what my guitarist had said they had promised us, but the guy just looked at me and said that $600 was never part of the deal. I called my guitarist up and asked him what was going on and he tried to convince me that asking them to pay us was lame because they're 'our friends'. I told him that I didn't even know anyone in that frat and that friends would still pay each other for this kind of service. He kept trying to convince me to stay, but the drummer and I left because it wasn't worth our time to play 4 hours just for beer.
Lesson learned here, never trust a single band member to handle these sorts of things. In fact, I highly suggest setting up a band email address that everyone can access. Have whoever is setting up a date email the venue hiring you and have the venue email back what is promised to the band. This way everyone in the band can see what is promised to them and everyone can agree or disagree to the terms.
+1 At least get paid upfront. Also add in any public / private school productions, especially those that are one off shows ran by amateurs. My local sound reinforcement company does not rent services to churches / politicians or school projects unless paid in advance. All media companies sell ad time to politicians "pay as you go" per ad. All these folks that do religious/political or one off school gigs are basically a form of hucksters....and almost impossible to squeeze money out off once the gig is over because they are on to the next hustle. Sorry you got scammed but a good learning experience.
jmattbassplaya said:You're a pansy!
Honestly, it sounds like you did the right thing for yourself. If you're happy then that's all that matters
Live and learn. From one college aged kid to another I'll just throw out my 2 cents of wisdom. Whenever possible, try to get paid before a gig. Even partial payment is better than nothing. If you can't do that, then refuse to leave the venue until payment has been made. Never be afraid to stand up for yourself because there will always be people like this.
Thanks man, that is usually my policy: to either get paid before hand or refuse to leave (I have hung around hours after gigs and hunted managers down for money in the past) but unfortunately I got caught in the "he's my friend, he won't screw me over" logic, but I made a mistake, so live and learn. My world's not ending, so Im not gonna let it get me down!
OR, the BL pocketed the thousands you guys were supposed to be paid.
Just sayin'...
Actually, the atheist bassist thread was moved over to the Private section of this website many months ago, in response to mega-spamming and some amazingly nasty attacks by numerous folks who obviously do not believe in "live and let live"
Meanwhile, the P&W threads on the Public section of the forum are up to, what, number eight?
Now, run it by me one more time who is being discriminated against here...
The mods are generally waiting for reported posts to take action on, it's simply not feasible to read every new post.
On that note, I already gave a warning to keep this thread on topic and avoid the religious aspects. Since it clearly wasn't heeded, I'm closing this for now.
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