With the Mackie DL boards, even if the iPad shuts off, the mixer stays in its current state. I'm assuming that's the case with the various X32's as well, no?
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Digital Mixers. Now adding NAMM 2015 entries
- Thread starter Tunaman
- Start date
Unless you're using one of the X32 rack only versions, the X32 (full, Producer and Compact) all have knobs and faders. If your wireless control goes out, the board still functions fully. With all of the current Mackie digi mixers, if your iPad sh!ts the bed, you've lost your ability to control the mixer. Period.
Tuna, If you look at the DL boards, there are no surface controls except channel trim. W/o the iPad, there's nothing to grab. If the iPad dies (or you just lose the wifi connection), the mixer gives you whatever mix you had dialed in before you lost the iPad. That's a problem if you've got a show that jumps between lots of scenes. If you're doing a set-and-forget mix for a little self-mixed gig, it's less of a problem (unless you've crazily set your mix to live on the edge of feedback).
Jimfist, my question about the Behringer was whether they also stay in their current state if the iPad goes down.
Jimfist, my question about the Behringer was whether they also stay in their current state if the iPad goes down.
"With all of the current Mackie digi mixers, if your iPad sh!ts the bed, you've lost your ability to control the mixer. Period."
Okay, wait a minute....
This is a trait with all rack-mounted, no-knob consoles, no need to single out the Mackie for it.
And those same rack-mounted units will continue to pass audio with the settings that they were set to if the iPad fails. Including the Behringer. No audio whatsoever goes through the iPad, it's only a control device.
That's why I have two iPads. And the band I'm in bought a full-blown Behringer X32. We have several options of operating the console, including hands-on if the iPad or tablet dies.
I know it happens, but I have 4 iPads (get 3 grandkids, you'll figure that out very quickly) and none of them have ever failed. Even the iPad 2 still has a good battery, something I didn't expect.
Nonetheless, if I'm on a mission critical gig (which, in my mind, is every show that I either play or mix), I'll take an extra fully-charged iPad along.
Okay, wait a minute....
This is a trait with all rack-mounted, no-knob consoles, no need to single out the Mackie for it.
And those same rack-mounted units will continue to pass audio with the settings that they were set to if the iPad fails. Including the Behringer. No audio whatsoever goes through the iPad, it's only a control device.
That's why I have two iPads. And the band I'm in bought a full-blown Behringer X32. We have several options of operating the console, including hands-on if the iPad or tablet dies.
I know it happens, but I have 4 iPads (get 3 grandkids, you'll figure that out very quickly) and none of them have ever failed. Even the iPad 2 still has a good battery, something I didn't expect.
Nonetheless, if I'm on a mission critical gig (which, in my mind, is every show that I either play or mix), I'll take an extra fully-charged iPad along.
Yeah, I have ZERO Ipads as of now! If I have to invest in 2 just in case I might as well get the full mixer.
Quick question. If I have a soundman using the Ipad in the crowd & my guitar player controlling the knobs at the stage level. That work on x32 & Qu16 or is it control one at a time only?
Everything is this post is spot on. Trying to compare audio quality on a video with the awful audio that comes with YouTube? What a joke.
I've mixed all kinds of bands on all kinds of mixers, from the Presonus to $100,000 digital mixers. I can do nearly any show I've ever done on any console, as long as I have enough channels.
All of these little consoles can pass audio decently enough for anyone. None of them absolutely suck. There's other things such as features, bang for the buck, channel count, workflow, surface vs rack, and several other factors to consider just as well as the audio quality.
Somedays, I want to scream this stuff from the mountain tops. Fortunately, except for days like today, I make it "not my problem". I'm just thankful for the experience to know better.
Yes, you can hands-on control the surface at the same time someone else is driving the iPad.
I strongly suggest a gentleman's agreement about who is gong to have the final say and control over the house mix. Don't get into a fader-pushing match...
.I do a lot of this...With a Yamaha M7CL, a CL5, or another smaller digital desk, depending on the gig, I'm typical near the console so I can baby-sit the monitor mixes while the FOH guy handles the house mix via the iPad. Also, the phone apps for individual musicians' control works this way, too. I just wish that Yamaha and Soundcraft would allow more than one iPhone/iPad device to connect, as the Behringer and the Persons do. We can't figure out Yamaha and Soundcraft on that.
I strongly suggest a gentleman's agreement about who is gong to have the final say and control over the house mix. Don't get into a fader-pushing match...
haha. Love it. A used X32 compact just came up on CL locally. Thinking of making an offer if it sits
iPads as well as all PCs these days are very reliable. It's always mostly OS software, or mechanical hard drives, fans causing problems.
And they are really not doing much more than control surrfaces here. You don't need the latest super CPU ones to work as control surfaces. A lot of the iPad is just sitting around idle in it's use here. Used models are fine, and there are lots of bargains on used with warranty iPads from Apple.
Just wait as new B* mixers soon support Android. I expect Android platform to finally take off in the controller world. There are intel ports of Android also.
PC's still are cheap and have many uses - they're still a good option.
And they are really not doing much more than control surrfaces here. You don't need the latest super CPU ones to work as control surfaces. A lot of the iPad is just sitting around idle in it's use here. Used models are fine, and there are lots of bargains on used with warranty iPads from Apple.
Just wait as new B* mixers soon support Android. I expect Android platform to finally take off in the controller world. There are intel ports of Android also.
PC's still are cheap and have many uses - they're still a good option.
s0c9
Supporting Member
Well, the X32 Rack can be controlled from its front panel, but not something I want to "grab" at while in a hurry if the iPad died.
NO just out dated. The older ones have been replaced by the AI version. I have been using a 16.4.2 for about 3 years now. My guess is that people who jumped on the digital bandwagon early are upgrading to newer mixers. When the Presonus studiolives first came out they were sort of a game changer and about the only option in their price range. Now there are all kinds of choices.
We have a board thats 10 years old at least. Presonus on ebay sells these refurbed for $850. Pretty cheap. Almost tempting vs the QU-16 & X32 near 2 grand
If that looks daunting, maybe you ought to consider staying analog... It is just part of setting up and is something that most of us don't even think about after the third time...
In my old analog days it was unpack the board, un-box the racks, wire up the channel inserts, wire up the aux sends/returns. Not to mention 2 trips from the truck rather than 1...
Getting your iPad connected... is really not a big deal... I use a 2008 Macbook, maxed ram and a 256 G SSD - I have about $500 in it. I can control virtually every function of the board with it - while capturing 16 tracks of nice clear digital audio...
my setup process...
Unpack the board
Unpack the laptop
Connect the two with the firewire cable
Turn in the board, let it POST
Turn on the computer, let it POST
I either setup a network on the Mac or I connect the mac to a router. Dual Router means more distance. Often not necessary for me but never wrong to use it. If I'm only going 50 to 100 feet, I don't bother...
Connect to the router /mac network with my iPad.
Fire up Presonus Universal Control on the Mac.
Select the board
Toggle one of the channel mutes to be sure I'm connected - display on the Mac shows the mute on/off. Or do it on the Mac and the light on the board toggles.
Load VSL on the iPad, toggle the mute
Under 5 minutes... And I'm good to get working on the inputs from the snake
Anyone in the Northwest need a pristine 16.4.2 generation 1 (non-ai) in a flight case ? Say $1100 delivered within 150 miles of Hood River? With a 100 foot 16x4 in a trunk ? firewire cable, LED BNC flexi-light incl... Shipping we can discuss... (I'll post this in the GFS after a bit...)
I'm ready to do either the Mackie or Presonus 32 ch rackable...
As a sound guy, you seriously haven't lived until you've carried your ipad up to a mic and wrung out your 4 or 5 monitor mix EQ's all in one trip ... I've seen die hard analog guys cry... Well at least they got real misty eyed... ;-)
Oh right, I have VSL running just fine on an iPad 1, 16gig bottom of the barrel, first edition... I'm not running the latest Mac OS. I think I'm at 10.7 with no intention of moving up unless I buy another macbook.
I understand that there are folks that have been successful using Windows and Universal Control. Early on there we're folks that experienced pain due to the firewire chipset in their laptop. I waved that off in favor of the old, cheap used macbook... I would definitely do that again!
In my old analog days it was unpack the board, un-box the racks, wire up the channel inserts, wire up the aux sends/returns. Not to mention 2 trips from the truck rather than 1...
Getting your iPad connected... is really not a big deal... I use a 2008 Macbook, maxed ram and a 256 G SSD - I have about $500 in it. I can control virtually every function of the board with it - while capturing 16 tracks of nice clear digital audio...
my setup process...
Unpack the board
Unpack the laptop
Connect the two with the firewire cable
Turn in the board, let it POST
Turn on the computer, let it POST
I either setup a network on the Mac or I connect the mac to a router. Dual Router means more distance. Often not necessary for me but never wrong to use it. If I'm only going 50 to 100 feet, I don't bother...
Connect to the router /mac network with my iPad.
Fire up Presonus Universal Control on the Mac.
Select the board
Toggle one of the channel mutes to be sure I'm connected - display on the Mac shows the mute on/off. Or do it on the Mac and the light on the board toggles.
Load VSL on the iPad, toggle the mute
Under 5 minutes... And I'm good to get working on the inputs from the snake
Anyone in the Northwest need a pristine 16.4.2 generation 1 (non-ai) in a flight case ? Say $1100 delivered within 150 miles of Hood River? With a 100 foot 16x4 in a trunk ? firewire cable, LED BNC flexi-light incl... Shipping we can discuss... (I'll post this in the GFS after a bit...)
I'm ready to do either the Mackie or Presonus 32 ch rackable...
As a sound guy, you seriously haven't lived until you've carried your ipad up to a mic and wrung out your 4 or 5 monitor mix EQ's all in one trip ... I've seen die hard analog guys cry... Well at least they got real misty eyed... ;-)
Oh right, I have VSL running just fine on an iPad 1, 16gig bottom of the barrel, first edition... I'm not running the latest Mac OS. I think I'm at 10.7 with no intention of moving up unless I buy another macbook.
I understand that there are folks that have been successful using Windows and Universal Control. Early on there we're folks that experienced pain due to the firewire chipset in their laptop. I waved that off in favor of the old, cheap used macbook... I would definitely do that again!
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s0c9
Supporting Member
Not at all, they are actually very good boards!!
I have the 16.4.2 (non-AI) and for a digi-console it's very simple to use -absolutely LOVE the fat channel interface - eveything there in one simple layout. Doesn't have a lot of the built-in fancy stuff wireless/USB/recording that newer units like the AI, X32, QU, etc. have, but (it can do all of that via remote interfaces) was by far the easiest digi to move to coming from long-time analog console use.
I agree. If you are mixing from stage I don't understand why you would want an I pad anyway. Just more things to go wrong.
wait, you're thinking of the wrong thing!
you use auxes for monitors, not groups! each guy in the band gets his own aux out, and can put whatever he wants in it at any loudness level he wants, with no effect on what happens out front.
all these boards can do that easily for at least 4 players, most can do even more.
