Double Bass Do tape nylon strings have a better sustain than steel strings ?

[Lionel Albert]

Hi !

I play with tape strings and yesterday I said I wanted to change the strings in order to play with the bow, the pianist is against the idea because he loves the sustain I've got my tape nylon strings.
Well, nobody use the strings I use (Pyramid black tape nylon strings) but maybe they are similar to another ones.

Thanks

 

[Don Hergert]

Many synthetic-wound and synthetic-wrapped strings do not work well with the bow, they are too smooth and often even soft rosin and a tight bow will not make them speak. Some players have found that roughing them up with light sandpaper or scrubbing pad application helps, but then there may be longevity issues.

I'm using some specially textured monofilament synthetic strings that work well with the bow, but they are specialty strings that are made to sound, feel and look very old-school and plain gut-like; while I really enjoy them, they aren't modern sounding at all, including having a noticeably fast decay (aka very little sustain).

There are numerous metal wrapped strings that do work well with pizz, arco and do have slow decay (aka lots of sustain). Some research into this type of strings should result in a good compromise. Especially if your playing requires pizz, arco and slow decay, you should be able to find what you want. TI Spiros come to mind, but there may be some other hybrid strings that are even better for arco.

Strings are a rabbit hole. I hope you can easily find something you like. It sort of bothers me that your pianist has interjected a double bass opinion, but that's up to you to work with.

 

[Papageno]

Ron Carter plays these strings:
La Bella 7710N Black Nylon

But I think I never heard him play arco...

 

[Lionel Albert]

Strings are a rabbit hole. I hope you can easily find something you like. It sort of bothers me that your pianist has interjected a double bass opinion, but that's up to you to work with.

Thanks a lot !

Well, his brother is a classical double bassist, in few words, he is a master.
He didn't say it with violence, he just found that it was quite original compared to what he's used to listening to and he really likes it.
I like it too but I'm sure I can get something better.

About strings I was thinking about the Superflexible strings.
They are cheaper than the Spirocores.
Those Spirocores are very very popular !

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Lionel Albert]

Ron Carter plays these strings:
La Bella 7710N Black Nylon

But I think I never heard him play arco...

Yes, I was thinking about them, they are not cheap. I've never heard someone on the net playing them with the bow.
They say they are bowable.
They've got them in two colours, black or white.
They say that the white ones have got a brighter sound.
Ah ! There are so many choices !

 

[lurk]

Yes, I was thinking about them, they are not cheap. I've never heard someone on the net playing them with the bow.
They say they are bowable.
They've got them in two colours, black or white.
They say that the white ones have got a brighter sound.
Ah ! There are so many choices !

Those LaBellas are not bowable if by that you mean producing a sound that would be acceptable or enjoyable to you in any kind of public or professional situation. If you are interested in just being able to produce a sound to work on intonation in your own private practice, you might be able to "squeak" by.

 

[Lionel Albert]

Those LaBellas are not bowable if by that you mean producing a sound that would be acceptable or enjoyable to you in any kind of public or professional situation. If you are interested in just being able to produce a sound to work on intonation in your own private practice, you might be able to "squeak" by.

My current strings squeak, so LaBellas are not going against physic laws.
Thanks, I'm saving money !

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I would go with the Spiros. Superflexibles have a wrap that I find irritatingly rough somehow, less sustain than Spiros, and they sound hollowed out to me. Spiros have the second smoothest wrap of any string I've tried except Dominants. They bow like bright sunlight makes your skin look, but for practice, that's a good thing.

 

[billiard]

I've got a mismatched set of Spiros and those Labella's on a bass right now. The sustain is pretty much even. Bowing isn't an issue.

 

[Lionel Albert]

I've got a mismatched set of Spiros and those Labella's on a bass right now. The sustain is pretty much even. Bowing isn't an issue.

Oh ! Now I'm lost !
How are they acoustically, which set is louder ? Which ones have got better dynamics ?

 

[Lee Moses]

I have never heard anyone say about Spiros, "They don't have enough sustain."

 

[billiard]

Oh ! Now I'm lost !
How are they acoustically, which set is louder ? Which ones have got better dynamics ?

Sonically they present the same. Both are well broken in so they have mellowed a little. Equal volume. Spiro is ever so slightly more bouncy because it a little higher tension than the Labella. If your insistent on going to a metal string, I'd look for a used set of Spiro Weichs.

 

[Lionel Albert]

Sonically they present the same. Both are well broken in so they have mellowed a little. Equal volume. Spiro is ever so slightly more bouncy because it a little higher tension than the Labella. If your insistent on going to a metal string, I'd look for a used set of Spiro Weichs.

I don't know yet, on the other hand, LaBella makes also a white tape set of strings. They say they are more bowable than the black tape set, they are also brighter.
So, the more I ask, the more I'm lost. Spirocores are popular, there might be a reason for that.
I mentioned the prices to the buddy, he was chocked and said his brother has never bought strings, he's got an endorsement with manufacturers, maybe he will ask him, maybe he won't.
Well, those strings are made for classical music but who knows ? Maybe he's got used ones but I doubt it because he's got young students and prefer giving them to his new students.
When he knows the price, I think he will probably stop giving them ! But who said he was giving his used strings ?!

 

[DoubleMIDI]

Get a few year old Spiros used.
Probably lower tension ones like 4/4 Weich or even 4/4 Solo tuned at orchestra pitch.
Cheap and already played in. They have a lot longer life than Superflexible so they are cheaper in the long run.
Have a look at my excel file in my Dropbox (link in string sticky). Maybe even your Pyramids are there.

I once played a bass with really old Superflexibles and hated them for sound and sustain. Even my over 20 year old Spiros sound better but I'm not sure if I would use them once again. Again, as you are used to lower tension get the Solos if you want to try them.
BTW, a good idea for any steel core string when used to lower tension.

New Spiros can be a bit bright and scratchy with the bow. That goes better after a year (or a bit less) when using the bow. Quicker with Weich and Solo.

Metal wrapped synthetic core strings are softer and often sound good with the bow (Evah Pirazzi Weich, Obligato, Innovation Braided) but might get dark and lifeless, stiff after one or two years or are hard to amplify.

Dominants are higher tension (perhaps use Solos instead), but might break quickly if the bass is not optimally set up for them:
no hard edges along the way of the string, mostly nut to pegbox needs to be rounded, bridge (and nut) slots wide enough and rounded and tailpiece slots rounded towards the bridge side.

Some might also break after several years due to aging of the synthetic core (Innovation Polychromes).

 

[Bruce Calin]

Down the rabbit hole is right. I played Superflexibles for many years and was happy with them for both arco and pizz. I have heard recordings I did with them years ago and I like that sound very much. The problem came when I realized I had to go with something less stiff for physical reasons. Superflexible isn't how I would describe them. I tried several others including some mentioned here, and finally went with Tempera Hybrids, which work great for me but probably not what you would want- different strokes, etc.

 

[Francois Blais]

Superflexible's name came for historic reasons.
The first T-I bass string was the Präzision, and it featured a solid steel core, so it was very stiff.
The Superflexibles came with a steel rope-core, so in comparison it was super-flexible.
Early Spirocore labels were also sporting the Super-Flexible statement, along with Spirocore.

 

[AGCurry]

I play with tape strings and yesterday I said I wanted to change the strings in order to play with the bow, the pianist is against the idea because he loves the sustain I've got my tape nylon strings.
Well, nobody use the strings I use (Pyramid black tape nylon strings) but maybe they are similar to another ones.

Thanks

I'll try to make it simple: Nylon-tape strings do NOT increase sustain. If yours sustain well, it's not because they're nylon-taped. Moreover, nylon-tape strings increase bowing difficulty.

 

[Lionel Albert]

OK, I didn't make a choice but I'll probably go for a French brand.
A bit pricey but I like believing I worth them.

 

[Francois Blais]

Savarez Corellis are the sole french bass string I know.

 

[Lee Moses]

OK, I didn't make a choice but I'll probably go for a French brand.
A bit pricey but I like believing I worth them.

It's fine to have country of origin among your criteria to consider, but you are ignoring everything everyone (including yourself) has posted in this thread if you make that your sole criterion.