Double Bass Double Bass In A Terrible Condition

[gypsydjango]

Seeking advice. I have a acquired a 3/4 size double bass in a terrible condition--but it plays OK. Someone has attempted repairs--very badly--obviously not a luthier. (See attached photos). The photos show the bass striped to the bare wood--I did that with the hope of re-finishing. As you see the person appears to have cut the back in half (top bout)--badly replaced it. There is no beading whatsoever where the front (top) and back are connected to the ribs. The top belly appears to be spruce. The back and sides appear to be laminate. Overall, apart from the poor repairs the bass seems quite sturdy. Worth doing up? If so how would you go about putting on beading to protect the front and back of the bass? Your thoughts most welcome?

 

[GretschWretch]

I have some opinions, but I will let the real luthiers who know what they are doing weigh in. I do find those f-holes intriguing. Don't recall seeing that shape before.

 

[Pietsch]

I suggest taking your double bass to someone in your area who works on basses. Talk about getting a bridge with adjusters, new strings, and sound post.

 

[Gaolee]

I'm a complete hack, not a luthier, but I have put together a bass in much worse shape than that. Beware of an inspired amateur with some woodworking background, epoxy, and bondo.

If it sounds good, then I would probably put it together as best I could and not worry much about the flaws. Finish it dark to hid the flaws and then just play it. If you are going to play it in an amplified setting, then I would probably put a couple sound posts in, fill the gaps with bondo, and paint it some loud metallic color like electric blue or my favorite Cadillac color, burgundy mist metallic. And then just play it.

I cannot imagine trying to fit a non-adjustable bridge to it. It will be an adventure to put right again. Worth it is in the eye of the beholder.

Side note: I was in Norway in my early 20s as foreign labor in a paper pulp products factory. While I was there, I ended up at a party with a bunch of young Norwegians, and one had an old bass his grandfather had played. There was a door in the side of the bass that led to a small compartment exactly the right size for a bottle of booze. Your bass might be a candidate for something like that, too. Then you would have to hand paint all kinds of knitted sweater designs all over it.

 

[Don Hergert]

As you see the person appears to have cut the back in half (top bout)--badly replaced it.

You may be aware of this, but that back design in a double bass is known as "flat-back" and it's a valid design originating in the 16th century and still being used with some new builds. Some of the woodwork on your "flat-back" isn't right, but the design itself is a real "thing". Whether your double bass was originally made that way or not is hard to determine.

I'm not clear on how you removed the original finish, but be aware that sanding a double bass top and back can weaken the instrument enough that it may not hold up under normal string tension. It's important to tread softly with anything that removes wood.

Regarding what to do with this instrument...

If you want it repaired the right way, an experienced double bass luthier is always the best answer, but you may not like the expense.

If you can play it the way it is and don't care about how long it stays playable, sure, go for it.

If you want to make it a personal project, I'd suggest first doing some serious research about how to make proper repairs that last but can be undone if necessary -- and undoing repairs is always eventually necessary. Along with that I'd also suggest avoiding bondo, contact cement, epoxy glues, some of the other more common household yellow wood glues, and avoiding poly finishes, because they cannot be easily undone.

I wish you the best as you make these decisions. Don't lose sight of the main goal -- playing a double bass.

 

[eh_train]

You may be aware of this, but that back design in a double bass is known as "flat-back" … Some of the woodwork on your "flat-back" isn't right, but the design itself is a real "thing". Whether your double bass was originally made that way or not is hard to say…/

Very likely original, just poorly repaired.

All of what Don says is spot on. It’s made with inexpensive materials, but it has some age. The neck crack is the biggest concern. Can’t quite tell from the pics whether the top is solid, but maybe not given the lack of any cracks.
Proper repairs would probably cost more than the value of the bass. But it might be playable without all of the ‘right’ work.

Note, stripping an instrument always devalues it (unless the finish is **completely** trashed).

 

[jallenbass]

Can’t quite tell from the pics whether the top is solid, but maybe not given the lack of any cracks.

The third picture shows the grain of the wood on the edge of the top. The top's in very good condition given that it's carved.

 

[Kevin Hailey]

The top looked in good shape until I noticed all the nails!

 

[fdeck]

Lacking purfling, I wonder if it's home-made or from a non-traditional maker. But if it's already playable enough to judge its tone, It's worth a luthier talking a gander at it.

 

[JamesGrant]

what are the row of holes at the back repair doing/for…

 

[EdwardofHuncote]

I think it was an early Epiphone though admittedly I can't remember ever having seen one made gamba style. Those f-holes are a tell. Check under the pegbox edge for a stamped serial number. Look under the E-string side.

The repairs to the neck needed will likely exceed the value of the bass but it's fixable.

Are you seeing this one @Steven Ayres ?

 

[Steven Ayres]

I think it was an early Epiphone though admittedly I can't remember ever having seen one made gamba style. Those f-holes are a tell.

Are you seeing this one @Steven Ayres ?

I agree that the f-holes are very similar to Epi holes. I don't see anything else here that's particularly Epi-like, though: the body shape and neck set are quite different, with a solid top and no outer linings. (All Epis are ply-top gambas.)

 

[EdwardofHuncote]

I agree that the f-holes are very similar to Epi holes. I don't see anything else here that's particularly Epi-like, though: the body shape and neck set are quite different, with a solid top and no outer linings. (All Epis are ply-top gambas.)

Yessir, this is a strange one. I have seen carved-top Gibson basses, with the flat/bent back like this, but I don't think they had the Epiphone styled f-holes though. I would remember that detail because I've seen quite a few firsthand.

I'd like to see the pegbox and scroll of this one. OP, any chance for a picture?

 

[834federal]

If I were you I would move on from this project. Good luck!

 

[Ed S]

As I look at those pics, I'm wondering why - if it played OK, you thought that what it needed was a new finish?!

 

[Pietsch]

My first double bass was a used blond-color Kay. Looked like the previous owner striped the original finish off my Kay bass as a project.

With my blond Kay bass, I took lessons in intermediate school, played gigs, played in school orchestras and concert band, church, and so on. So, don't worry about what others think it looks like, or its value. Think about playing it.

Talk with a bass repair person about getting a bridge with adjusters, new strings, and sound post. If so, you'll have an instrument that you, or someone else could play.

 

[gypsydjango]

Thanks everybody for all your replies and knowledge--much appreciated. I think--when time allows--I will take the bass back off and see what is inside--should be interesting. As the bass being mine and being the state that it is in and of little value--'A learning curve'. I do have lutherie knowledge of banjo and guitar.

One question---has anybody knowledge of adding binding / beading to protect the top / back / ribs from damage? If so what shape binding would you use?

 

[SAlcott]

Thanks everybody for all your replies and knowledge--much appreciated. I think--when time allows--I will take the bass back off and see what is inside--should be interesting. As the bass being mine and being the state that it is in and of little value--'A learning curve'. I do have lutherie knowledge of banjo and guitar.

One question---has anybody knowledge of adding binding / beading to protect the top / back / ribs from damage? If so what shape binding would you use?

By "binding/beading" do you mean purlfing or exterior linings?

 

[eh_train]

One question---has anybody knowledge of adding binding / beading to protect the top / back / ribs from damage? If so what shape binding would you use?

Below is probably best for protecting a bass (most often applied to top and bottom bouts of the treble side of the bass). Adding a binding would be a serious time commitment, and might actually weaken the edge...

 

[unbrokenchain]

... I think--when time allows--I will take the bass back off and see what is inside--....

It's typically the top that comes off the bass for repairs rather than the back for what it's worth. I'm wondering what the nails on the top are secured into, as they don't appear to line up with where a bassbar typically resides. The neck block looks... huge. What looks to be a crack in the back also makes me wonder if the back isn't also solid wood? If it were my bass in that condition with the finish removed, I might call it a long term full-rebuild project. New fingerboard, possibly new neck block, probably many internal brace repairs and removal of metal hardware, none of it is impossible but does require fine, nuanced motor skills with quality tools. And hot hide glue, nothing else will do