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Dr James Watson resigned

#2
ImaStupidBaby said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7062382.stm

Its sad that he said what he did. Its very disappointing to hear someone who I have a lot of respect and admiration for say such horrible things.

I respect James Watson the scientist, but not James Watson the person.

For those who don't know who this guy is....he and another dude discovered the 3d structure of DNA.
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Well for me, it is very disappointing to hear that he is getting in this much trouble for this. How did he say something "horrible"?

Sure, it may not have been "politically correct", but yet, no one has proved him wrong on his point. Scientific evidence is introduced, and what it states is upsetting to many people, but yet... it is still not false, so how can people throw such a big fuss, force this revered scientist to quit his job, and spit fire at the whole situation.

Just because it is not good news to some, and may be offense, does not mean it should not be acknowledged.
 
#4
Sonic_Death said:
Well for me, it is very disappointing to hear that he is getting in this much trouble for this. How did he say something "horrible"?

Sure, it may not have been "politically correct", but yet, no one has proved him wrong on his point. Scientific evidence is introduced, and what it states is upsetting to many people, but yet... it is still not false, so how can people throw such a big fuss, force this revered scientist to quit his job, and spit fire at the whole situation.

Just because it is not good news to some, and may be offense, does not mean it should not be acknowledged.
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Dude he said that blacks where somehow genetically inferior. He admitted he said this. He didn't say anyone misunderstood what he said, he said he didn't understand why he said it.

Theres a difference between politically incorrect and downright racist. And what scientific evidence are you referring to?
 
#5
Watson claimed that there was testing done to back up his assumptions.

Granted, what he said comes off as pretty racist, but this is not new for Watson, he has said similar things in the past, not specifically on race, but on different issues. He brings up good points that I think should be looked into even more.

We will be able to study these topics more and more and shed new light on it in the future as advances in genetics occur. I guess we will see eventually.
 
#6
Sonic_Death said:
Well for me, it is very disappointing to hear that he is getting in this much trouble for this. How did he say something "horrible"?

Sure, it may not have been "politically correct", but yet, no one has proved him wrong on his point. Scientific evidence is introduced, and what it states is upsetting to many people, but yet... it is still not false, so how can people throw such a big fuss, force this revered scientist to quit his job, and spit fire at the whole situation.

Just because it is not good news to some, and may be offense, does not mean it should not be acknowledged.
Click to expand...

There is about forty years of research that would suggest that IQ tests are not an unimpeachable measure of intelligence, but theat they have a strong cultural bias. As for the lack of intelligence of Africans, I can point to hundreds of examples of their genius and resourcefullness in the face of very limited options that I have witnessed personally over seven trips to Northeast, Southern, and West Africa.

Personally, I am a little worried about him resigning for his opinion because it could make him a martyr to those who think like him. I would prefer that brilliant minds call him on his statements and confront him with his words publicly repeatedly.
 
#7
Sonic_Death said:
Watson claimed that there was testing done to back up his assumptions.

Granted, what he said comes off as pretty racist, but this is not new for Watson, he has said similar things in the past, not specifically on race, but on different issues. He brings up good points that I think should be looked into even more.

We will be able to study these topics more and more and shed new light on it in the future as advances in genetics occur. I guess we will see eventually.
Click to expand...

He also claims that all testing leads to his assumption. I find that very hard to swallow.

I think its going to be extremely difficult to link IQ to genes. Due in large part to the fact that environment can affect how genes are expressed.
 
#8
At the risk of stating something that is probably almost as unpopular as what Dr. James Watson said (and it's based on similar anecdotal "evidence")... When I worked in a nursing home taking care of residents who were typically in their 80's or 90's, I heard LOTS of racist comments. The elderly tend to be far more racist than younger people today. In fact, nearly all of the elderly people I know personally have ideas that modern society would consider racist.

It really wasn't all that long ago when it was "common knowledge" that there were intellectually inferior and superior races and there were easy ways to tell the difference: head shape and size, thickness and type of hair, musculature and build and especially skin color. People who are now in their old age (as is Dr Watson) grew up in a time when such ideas were pervasive in culture, and this was universally true in cultures around the world.
 
#10
Dr. Cheese said:
There is about forty years of research that would suggest that IQ tests are not an unimpeachable measure of intelligence, but theat they have a strong cultural bias. As for the lack of intelligence of Africans, I can point to hundreds of examples of their genius and resourcefullness in the face of very limited options that I have witnessed personally over seven trips to Northeast, Southern, and West Africa.

Personally, I am a little worried about him resigning for his opinion because it could make him a martyr to those who think like him. I would prefer that brilliant minds call him on his statements and confront him with his words publicly repeatedly.
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+1

I agree with you on this. I don’t object to people stating assertions that are controversial as long as these assertions can be properly challenged and shown to be erroneous in the light of day.

I wonder if he made this statement because he truly believes it, or is it a case of age setting in and causing judgmental difficulties.
 
#11
Dave Grossman said:
They only discovered it by ripping off data from Rosalind Franklin. He then lied in a book about her after she was dead. He's always been a douchebag.

- Dave
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That's what some have claimed.

What actually happened is that Maurice Wilkins was given an X ray diffraction photograph of DNA by Franklin's PhD student. Wilkins showed it to Crick and he and Watson came up with the structure. The rest of the data used by Crick and Watson was already in the public domain. Franklin's photograph was published in the same issue of Nature.

The reason that she didn't get included in the Nobel prize is that they are not awarded posthumously.
 
#12
dlloyd said:
That's what some have claimed.

What actually happened is that Maurice Wilkins was given an X ray diffraction photograph of DNA by Franklin's PhD student. Wilkins showed it to Crick and he and Watson came up with the structure. The rest of the data used by Crick and Watson was already in the public domain. Franklin's photograph was published in the same issue of Nature.

The reason that she didn't get included in the Nobel prize is that they are not awarded posthumously.
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+1

Had Franklin lived, she most likely would have received a share of the Nobel Prize, and deservedly so.
 
#13
I heard about this guy and what his assertions were. I had never heard of him before this. Then I heard a black scientist's comments regarding what he had said. The black scientist convinced me that, regarding this, he was a silly old coot (my words, not his). This guy simply wants to believe what he said.
 
#15
After reading the morning paper, I feel this guy is major fruit loop despite the fact he is a great scientist. He has made statements in the past about aborting homosexual babies and using genetics so that "all girls can be pretty." He also said heavy Black people are more horny than skinny white people, I wonder how he gathered that data?

As I said earlier, confronting this man with his stupidity is way more effective than letting him retire and hide behind free speech.

Here is a llink:[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
#16
Dr. Cheese said:
After reading the morning paper, I feel this guy is major fruit loop despite the fact he is a great scientist. He has made statements in the past about aborting homosexual babies and using genetics so that "all girls can be pretty." He also said heavy Black people are more horny than skinny white people, I wonder how he gathered that data?
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I met him a few years ago. He's an old, confused man.

I would say he was once a great scientist, but now it's time he took a rest.
 
#17
Dr. Cheese said:
After reading the morning paper, I feel this guy is major fruit loop despite the fact he is a great scientist. He has made statements in the past about aborting homosexual babies and using genetics so that "all girls can be pretty." He also said heavy Black people are more horny than skinny white people, I wonder how he gathered that data?

As I said earlier, confronting this man with his stupidity is way more effective than letting him retire and hide behind free speech.
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LoL no way im skinny whity and get horny several times in a row (Yes i end up tired but happy :D)...

And hell no to the race determining the inteligence... I bet that if he had been so poor like most africans are no matter how brilliant his mind was he couldnt have developed his potential... and thats not genetical information thats common sense...
 
#18
GregC said:
"He said that while he hoped everyone was equal, "people who have to deal with black employees find this is not true"."

How's that for starters?
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Did he really? Wow. Well, if that's the case he deserves what he gets.

It's funny, people expect smart people to be on the level as humans beings too, and sometimes it's just not the case. I think calling him just old, confused and misguided is really just letting him off.
 
#19
Blisshead said:
Did he really? Wow. Well, if that's the case he deserves what he gets.

It's funny, people expect smart people to be on the level as humans beings too, and sometimes it's just not the case. I think calling him just old, confused and misguided is really just letting him off.
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So, let him off. Nobody's taking him seriously. He's made a complete fool of himself and in a month this will all be forgotten.
 
#20
hbarcat said:
At the risk of stating something that is probably almost as unpopular as what Dr. James Watson said (and it's based on similar anecdotal "evidence")...
When I worked in a nursing home taking care of residents who were typically in their 80's or 90's, I heard LOTS of racist comments.
The elderly tend to be far more racist than younger people today.
In fact, nearly all of the elderly people I know personally have ideas that modern society would consider racist.
People who are now in their old age (as is Dr Watson) grew up in a time when such ideas were pervasive in culture, and this was universally true in cultures around the world.
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... gee , that sounds sort of " age-ist " ,
but i'd have to agree . :ninja:

my grandparents , and sadly , to some extent my own parents ,
had some very set ideas about race and intelligence ... :hmm:

i hope i've raised my own children to know better .
 

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