Dua Lipa "Levitating" infringement lawsuit

[MrClassicMetal]

He went to school to study Jazz theory and makes a living playing a very modernized derivative of music that was very much a creation of Black America, and a lot of his videos for years have come from a conscious perspective of someone who is borrowing heavily from a culture that isn’t his.

I addressed that part in this THIS POST.

And I say this as someone who is from the Caribbean. The culture on the island where I lived is different from the other islands, and vise versa. It's just silly when this American musician talks about "black culture" as if all black folks on this planet are one monolithic group. What's up with that? It's quite ignorant if you ask me.

They do the same thing when they talk about Africa, thereby overlooking the fact that it's a continent with a long list of different cultures. When you go to for example Mozambique, I can guarantee you that they'll ask you what you're talking about when you refer to their culture as "black culture". Not in the least because they don't have the same concept of "race" as some people in the US do.

One thing I've noticed is that this "cultural appropriation" thing has become a big deal in the US. Or at least it seems that way, because it's been mentioned so much in the media during the past few years.

There's this Japanese salsa band named Orquesta de la Luz. They sing in Spanish, and became very famous in Latin America and the Caribbean. One of their albums won Best Album of the Year at the Ace Awards, presented by The Association of Latin Entertainment Critics. Now this was during the 90s. One can only imagine how some of those youtube channels would have reacted if this had occurred in the 2020s.

And then there's reggaeton, a music style that originated in Central America in the early 90s. The roots of this genre is dancehall music, a form of reggae. Is this cultural appropriation on a large scale?

 

[MrClassicMetal]

Well put.
My snarky comment was plainly intended to point him out as a hypocrite in regards to earning his income off someone else's culture. He has entire videos of him virtue signaling, I watch them too, and sometimes I turn them off. But they are full of historically accurate and interesting information. I usually agree with a most of his points, and regardless of my personal feelings about one part or another of his presentation I won't discount the whole thing.

Same here. He's a smart guy and generally his content is very solid.

 

[Nuage420]

And I say this as someone who is from the Caribbean. The culture on the island where I lived is different from other islands, and vise versa.

I am glad you brought that up. My neighbors growing up were from Kingston, Trinidad, Tabago, and Haiti. Each very unique in most aspects, from music to cuisine, to dialect, etc.

Most listeners couldn't tell if they're listening to Soca or dancehall

 

[bass12]

I addressed that part in this THIS POST.

And I say this as someone who is from the Caribbean. The culture on the island where I lived is different from the other islands, and vise versa. It's just silly when this American musician talks about "black culture" as if all black folks on this planet are one monolithic group. What's up with that? It's quite ignorant if you ask me.

They do the same thing when they talk about Africa, thereby overlooking the fact that it's a continent with a long list of different cultures. When you go to for example Mozambique, I can guarantee you that they'll ask you what you're talking about when you refer to their culture as "black culture". Not in the least because they don't have the same concept of "race" as some people in the US do.

One thing I've noticed is that this "cultural appropriation" thing has become a big deal in the US. Or at least it seems that way, because it's been mentioned so much in the media during the past few years.

There's this Japanese salsa band named Orquesta de la Luz. They sing in Spanish, and became very famous in Latin America and the Caribbean. One of their albums won Best Album of the Year at the Ace Awards, presented by The Association of Latin Entertainment Critics. Now this was during the 90s. One can only imagine how some of those youtube channels would have reacted if this had occurred in the 2020s.

And then there's reggaeton, a music style that originated in Central America in the early 90s. The roots of this genre is dancehall music, a form of reggae. Is this cultural appropriation on a large scale?

Rare that I hear Orquesta de la Luz mentioned. Nice one. Reggaeton: latino's "appropriating" Jamaican music that "appropriated" a beat from Trinidad (for Shabba's "Dem Bow"). And speaking of reggae, it's interesting to note that the whole idea of a "riddim" in that genre exists largely as a result of Jamaicans ripping each other off (made possible thanks to the lack of copyright laws covering music on the island). And so it goes.

 

[Nuage420]

... it just dawned on me.

Nobody has sued Sublime for covering endless reggae songs.

I'm sure slightly stoopid, pepper, dirty heads... 311? and numerous other "white reggae bands" could all be sued just the same as dua is.

 

[bass12]

... it just dawned on me.

Nobody has sued Sublime for covering endless reggae songs.

I'm sure slightly stoopid, pepper, dirty heads... 311? and numerous other "white reggae bands" could all be sued just the same as dua is.

I'm not sure where things stood regarding Jamaican copyright laws when Sublime's 40oz to Freedom came out. I also don't know if, for example, Half Pint was given credit and paid royalties. But, yeah, Sublime were "borrowing" very liberally from several reggae sources and certainly should have ponied up for what was used.

 

[MrClassicMetal]

Rare that I hear Orquesta de la Luz mentioned. Nice one. Reggaeton: latino's "appropriating" Jamaican music that "appropriated" a beat from Trinidad (for Shabba's "Dem Bow"). And speaking of reggae, it's interesting to note that the whole idea of a "riddim" in that genre exists largely as a result of Jamaicans ripping each other off (made possible thanks to the lack of copyright laws covering music on the island). And so it goes.

Yup, that is how reggaeton started, and subsequently became a billion dollar industry!

 

[bass12]

Yup, that is how reggaeton started, and subsequently became a billion dollar industry!

And how much credit does Trinidad receive for cultivating that beat? Zero!

 

[MrClassicMetal]

... it just dawned on me.

Nobody has sued Sublime for covering endless reggae songs.

I'm sure slightly stoopid, pepper, dirty heads... 311? and numerous other "white reggae bands" could all be sued just the same as dua is.

... including the biggest band of the early 80s; none other than The Police. They forged their sound by combining reggae, punk, jazz and rock. And the reggae influence is right there in your face.

 

[bass12]

... including the biggest band of the early 80s; none other than The Police. They forged their sound by combining reggae, punk, jazz and rock. And the reggae influence is right there in your face.

Part of what I love about the trajectory of music in the UK from the '70s onwards is the way that Jamaican music was incorporated into so much of it, from punk to two-tone to pop to "trip-hop" to jungle (not to mention all of the great reggae that came out of England).

 

[Nuage420]

to jungle

Jungle Massive Junkie since the 90s

 

[sunbeast]

Neely's entire comment about "black culture" is a bit off. By making that statement, he is making it seem as if all people with a specific skin colour share the exact same culture. And he should know better.

Reggae is Jamaican music. There is a huge difference between music from Jamaica and music from Martinique, for example. And the populations of both islands are predominantly black. Now imagine having a group of people from Martinique visiting, and you decide to play reggae music while commenting: "Check it out, music from your culture to make you feel at home!" You'd get some puzzled looks for sure!

It's like someone stating that he likes "Asian food". Ok, what exactly does he mean by that? Because Asia is a huge continent, and there are 48 countries and cultures there.

To me your issue here with Neely’s video seems intentionally distracting from his broader point and at least avoiding the context in which it was said. He mentioned “black culture” once nearly in passing, the context in this case specifically referring to American black culture that spawned the Charleston, the Jackson 5, and OutKast as the examples he gave in this video. And more specifically referring to someone spuriously profiting from a culture they are not a part of (which is of course nothing new in art/music, but also maybe not a reality that needs to be constantly debated on the internet since it is pretty hard to deny). In the US, racial/ethnic/skin-color identity has always been of inflated importance whether we like it or not, and no less so today than ever. I admit many Americans like myself and Adam Neely probably can’t help but look at most issues through an American (well US) lens, as limiting as that is ( certainly a very American tendency as I hear from many of my non-American friends). Though frankly in the context of the point he is making it doesn’t even matter.

“Culture” is just a form of categorization.
The very first definition of “culture” from Google: “the arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively”. Culture is a word that need not be regarded with such care and concern, as a “culture” is such a broad idea that he may as well just say “art” or any other word to represent a thing or idea that originated from a particular sub-section of humans. It’s not a single monolith that overshadows others, but all the collective achievements of individuals and groups that are a part of whatever group you put in front of it. Absolutely the specific cultures that are a part of broader “black culture” are vast and varied, just as all the different regional cultures that make up “US Culture” are also vastly different. Any broad culture will be full of opposing viewpoints and paradoxical ideas by nature. You get more specific and there is likely more and more pattern and similarity. It doesn’t mean that both broad and specific ideas of culture somehow can’t exist and have meaning in certain contexts, as they are just categorizations of information and not concrete nor exclusive ideologies. I could say “child culture” to encompass the collective finger paintings of the Earth’s children even as one could then sub-categorize “child culture” down to the specific culture of an individual family of children. One doesn’t need to invalidate the other. Context of use is what is important

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Rare that I hear Orquesta de la Luz mentioned. Nice one. Reggaeton: latino's "appropriating" Jamaican music that "appropriated" a beat from Trinidad (for Shabba's "Dem Bow"). And speaking of reggae, it's interesting to note that the whole idea of a "riddim" in that genre exists largely as a result of Jamaicans ripping each other off (made possible thanks to the lack of copyright laws covering music on the island). And so it goes.

Reggae itself has strong roots in American R&B.

 

[James Collins]

There is an irony where complaining about other people virtue signaling is in fact just virtue signaling.

Maybe we should move on from that topic and discuss the merits of the lawsuit or what should be copyrightable. Or not.

 

[Raoul_Duke]

I remember when people thought it was cool, and kind of flattering, when artists of any kind borrowed from other artists.

 

[bass12]

There is an irony where complaining about other people virtue signaling is in fact just virtue signaling.

Maybe we should move on from that topic and discuss the merits of the lawsuit or what should be copyrightable. Or not.

Sure, but the complaining is often simply an expression of frustration with attitudes and behaviors that many people are understandably fed up with. So how about that Don Diablo? Convincing or not?

Don Diablo - YouTube

 

[turf3]

I remember when people thought it was cool, and kind of flattering, when artists of any kind borrowed from other artists.

Well, in today's "victim at all costs" environment, all kinds of wacky stuff starts showing up.

 

[James Collins]

Sure, but the complaining is often simply an expression of frustration with attitudes and behaviors that many people are understandably fed up with. So how about that Don Diablo? Convincing or not?

Don Diablo - YouTube

I mean I'm not convinced any of the examples are copyright infringement. Don Diablo included.

 

[Nuage420]

I mean I'm not convinced any of the examples are copyright infringement. Don Diablo included.

I agree, the two bandwagoners have even less going for them.

 

[JohnNash]

"...and in other news, Due Lipa have been ordered to pay 200,000 for infringement, and have settled on a new name: 'Duo Looper'...news and weather at six!"