E#. Wait, what?

[comatosedragon]

Ok -- I am not the best bass player (yet), and I freely admit it. All the guys in my band know it, and put it up with it, because; well, I'm a bass player.

So the guitarist comes up with a new riff, and I ask him about it. He says I should play E# , C, F# over it. I point out to him that there is no E#, does he mean Eb maybe? He gives me the evil eye and tells me of course there is an E#. Just because it's not a note on the fretboard, doesn't make it not a 'real note'. He says it's when you bend an E. And everyone in the band agrees with him (they all have 20+ years experience), leaving me feeling like a dope. I tried to just forget it and move on, but seriously, this is really bugging me. Why did I get singled out and ridiculed for pointing out something I thought was an honest mistake? (I know I overanalyze things, but this has been stuck with me for like 3 days now!)

//rant

 

[fdeck]

E# is the same note on your fretboard as F. It's a perfectly legitimate notation.

 

[Clef_de_fa]

E# is at the same place you will find F in our tempered system ... just like B# exist too. Some keys require it ... or the double # and double b

 

[elgecko]

It's not super common but the notes of an A augmented chord are A-C#-E#.

 

[comatosedragon]

Wow! I seriously had no idea. Thanks guys!

 

[chungweishan]

I think the explanation, "He says it's when you bend an E." is a bit goofy. Technically, it true, there is an E# as mentioned (A augmented chord, or even the C# major scale), but I would've communicated it differently.

Invalid Link Removed

So the problem becomes: Is this riff actually "F to C to F#." Or "E, bend to F then C then F#?"
And that brings up, "How do I bend an open E if I'm supposed to play at that particular octave?" Oh well.

I would love to know the actual chord progression.

 

[comatosedragon]

Yeah, we just kind of moved on to something else. Maybe this week he'll bring it up again, and I'll try to get more answers for you!

 

[Son of Wobble]

When someone throws an H# at you, that's the time to start a-worrying you've entered a new dimension.

 

[Bob_Ross]

I think the explanation, "He says it's when you bend an E." is a bit goofy.

Yes, ^^^this is the red flag in your bandmates' explanation.

E# definitely exists, and it's definitely an enharmonic spelling of F...and it's definitely not what any articulate, intelligent, educated, and literate musician would use to describe "when you bend an E"

 

[/\/\3phist0]

smells like a snipe hunt.

 

[Icemanaroonie]

When someone throws an H# at you, that's the time to start a-worrying you've entered a new dimension.

Those dang Scandinavians!

 

[Bufalo]

It'd be more conventional to describe E# / C / F# as F / C / Gb, but either way, that is a strange progression.

 

[fdeck]

Now there's always Blues in Hoss Flat, and Bach wrote in the key of H.

 

[fakeneckplate'65]

Yes, there is such a note as an E#, however, I sort of doubt that your standard " rock band " key that would use it, unless it's a capo song.

I have a buddy, who commonly describes a I - IV - V " in the key of of "F" as "F" - "A#" - "C"....

 

[fakeneckplate'65]

Here's a wiki article that covers enharmonics & additional music theory.

Enharmonic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[bearfoot]

E# is idiotic note spelling

 

[Dojix]

Yeah, I really find that explanation a bad one. E# is just F, as people said above, but the explanation of "bending an E" makes it sound like it's between E and F, when it is just really an F.

 

[The BurgerMeister]

The 7 in the key of F# major or the 3 in the key of C# major is an E#. If the guitarist was playing in one of those keys (or playing one of those aforementioned augmented chords, etc. etc.), or just being one o' them wacky artist types who do things a certain way for whatever good reason they want, then an E# is a perfectly legitimate and wonderful note. It happens to share fret space with an F.

There are ways of explaining this without condescension, of course. That's a subject for another thread, though. If you're offended, just tell him "#dontbeadouche, bro."

I wish you fun!

 

[blastoff99]

Every major key (ok, smart people; I'll use the easy example) has to have one and only one note of each letter of the alphabet in it. In order to make a major scale, the pattern has to be

root note (scale degree 1)
whole step to next note
whole step
half step
whole step
whole step
whole step
half step (back to scale degree 1)

So (let's use a piano keyboard, sorry) a C major scale looks like this:

C (scale degree 1)
D (whole step up from C)
E (whole step up from D)
F (half step up from E)
G (whole step up from F)
A (whole step up from G)
B (whole step up from A)
C (half step up from B).

Although it would sound the same if you named the notes this way C C## Fb F Abb A Cb Dbb, that doesn't follow the rules and would be really hard to follow, period. You'd have a heck of a time reading and making sense out of that. So, in certain keys or chords within certain keys, you'll get unusual things involving enharmonic spellings we're less accustomed to in order to give you the right 'letter.' Often musicians will speak of a note being (or not being) 'in the key.' F#, for example, is not in the key of C. But it is in certain chords that can be used (maybe not a million times a day) in the key of C. Gb would be less likely, although it's the same note.

Does that help?

 

[Lowness]

Ok -- I am not the best bass player (yet), and I freely admit it. All the guys in my band know it, and put it up with it, because; well, I'm a bass player.

So the guitarist comes up with a new riff, and I ask him about it. He says I should play E# , C, F# over it. I point out to him that there is no E#, does he mean Eb maybe? He gives me the evil eye and tells me of course there is an E#. Just because it's not a note on the fretboard, doesn't make it not a 'real note'. He says it's when you bend an E. And everyone in the band agrees with him (they all have 20+ years experience), leaving me feeling like a dope. I tried to just forget it and move on, but seriously, this is really bugging me. Why did I get singled out and ridiculed for pointing out something I thought was an honest mistake? (I know I overanalyze things, but this has been stuck with me for like 3 days now!)

//rant

It sounds like the guitarist messed-up. True that E# exists, though you have to go a long long way to find the word used, particularly in a standard band rock band.

It is possible the guitarist honestly thought the scale is E, E#, F. I played with a (seemingly) good guitarist the other day. I said that a particular song was in A and he said "Which fret is that?".

The impossible happens.