Eminence Kappalite 3015

[greenboy]

Greenboy (and others) what is your experience in this regard? Is reinforcement of the baffle prudent or is the usual 3/4 inch multi-ply sufficient?

Hi Codger,

Any driver that can deliver a lot of SPL below 100 Hz as well as above will test a cab's rigidity. But the real issue you refer to involved not the 3015, but the 3015LF which is a meaner high-force driver yet, really more of a subwoofer. And it was the grille that needed more standoff points to keep from rattling on some notes, largely due to the driver having a very thick front gasket which actually would touch the grille, if I recall.

Anyway, 3015 and 3015LF are different drivers.

 

[knw]

Thanks for the very informative post Jhonny Mack.

I feel like the 15" gave me the depth that I didn't even know I was missing.

Also adding another amp + 2x15" opened up a door to more definition in sound.

The only draw back is setting up and lagging this around

I might be adding a 3rd amp/cab soon...

I'm trying to save you some grief and suggest you find a way to try them out before you buy. Good luck.

Well finding someone that has these speakers and lives in my area is way harder then actaully trying to see what people have to say on these forums.

I just wanted people to share their personal experiences and their thoughts on the speaker.

I understand opinions would vary from one person to another but I'm still interested in what they have to say hence why I started this post.

 

[Kindness]

The word is the 3015 is close, but covers up to tweeter crossover range a lot better, so you can skip the mid - just not get quite the same low end.

I'd still use a mid with the 3015. The way I'd put it is: if you can't/won't use a mid, you definitely want to avoid the 3015LF.

I guess I should probably measure my cabinet before I order

That'd be net internal space, BTW - after subtracting the space the drivers porting bracing handles crossover etc occupy inside the cab.

greenboy - this is the older Avatar 1x15 with the crappy Deltalite in it. Unless I'm mistaken the box size is appropriate and the tuning frequency is pretty damn close to perfect for the 3015.

 

[Orangeclawhammr]

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[poomwah]

I'd still use a mid with the 3015. The way I'd put it is: if you can't/won't use a mid, you definitely want to avoid the 3015LF.





greenboy - this is the older Avatar 1x15 with the crappy Deltalite in it. Unless I'm mistaken the box size is appropriate and the tuning frequency is pretty damn close to perfect for the 3015.

YAY... as soon as I get the check I'm ordering a 3015 and some t-nuts.

 

[Triad]

If I went for a 2x15" would it be better to keep the woofers separated or not?

 

[billfitzmaurice]

I'd still use a mid with the 3015.

I'd use a mid with any 15, or even any 12 for that matter. No matter how good the mids may sound directly in front of the cab no 12 or 15 can produce decent mids off-axis. You probably don't notice it, since you likely stand directly in front of your cab most of the time. The audience doesn't have that ability.
From an engineering and economic standpoint a 2x3015 makes no sense. A single 3015LF will produce nearly as much low end as a pair of 3015, while a 3015LF plus a midrange driver will have far superior midrange extension and dispersion than a 2x3015, and will do so in a smaller cab at a lower cost.

 

[joegeezer]

I had a 215 cab with two brand spankin' CB15Legends in it. Took them out and put in two 3015's. Almost exactly the same. Look at the two respective charts from Eminence. Almost the same. 3015 is lighter to carry. Thats about it, in a nutshell.

 

[Blues Bass 2]

I had a 3015 in a Dr Bass RX115. My take on the tone is about like Shane Carters. The mids are prominent and the low mids and low end are very smooth. Mine took a while to break in but the bottom end got deeper the more I used it ,notes below low E were very clear and deep. I know they don't go low as well as a 3015LF but I think the lo end of the 3015 is great.

Mine got loud enough to use stand alone but I really like the mids of tens and twelves so I mostly used it with my 310 cab on outdoor gigs.I did use it at a couple gigs by itself and also used it as my speaker at a twice a month jam at a buddys house and it was the best 15" cab I've heard yet. I just got a 112 cab with a Selenium neo to replace the 115 cab but I'd love to have that cabinet back someday,it would really work well with the 112 I just got.

 

[greenboy]

I had a 215 cab with two brand spankin' CB15Legends in it. Took them out and put in two 3015's. Almost exactly the same. Look at the two respective charts from Eminence. Almost the same. 3015 is lighter to carry. Thats about it, in a nutshell.

Not really. The 3015 is 2 to 3 dB more sensitive and has a lot more thermal and mechanical power handling among other things. Put one of each into two suitable identical cabs and fully drive each cab with a 500 watts @ 8 ohms side of a 2-channel power amp. One driver will quickly be toast, but on the way to burning it wasn't as loud in spite of farting up a burrito fog ; }

 

[Kindness]

I'd use a mid with any 15, or even any 12 for that matter. No matter how good the mids may sound directly in front of the cab no 12 or 15 can produce decent mids off-axis. You probably don't notice it, since you likely stand directly in front of your cab most of the time. The audience doesn't have that ability.
From an engineering and economic standpoint a 2x3015 makes no sense. A single 3015LF will produce nearly as much low end as a pair of 3015, while a 3015LF plus a midrange driver will have far superior midrange extension and dispersion than a 2x3015, and will do so in a smaller cab at a lower cost.

Which is the reason my cabinet uses a 3015LF with a mid.

 

[greenboy]

Which is the reason my cabinet uses a 3015LF with a mid.

Likewise.

 

[Kindness]

A couple years back I got really interested in strings and using tension as a guide for better setups and adapting tone. I see in your signature you must have had a similar interest at some point. I really should just stop doing any of my own investigations and just follow you around. It'll save me a lot of reading and experimenting.

 

[5StringPocket]

I have a few questions concerning the 3015LF with a mid.
> Is the 6.5" (crossed at 800 HZ?) the optimum mid driver vs say an 8"?
> For a 2-way system does a properly designed 2-way crossover provide noticeably better response than just putting a low pass filter on the 6.5" mid driver?
> From what I've been able to gather, a 3-way cab of about 20"x24"x18" loaded with 3015LF+6.5mid+tweeter is the optimum configuration to get the most out of a 15" speaker in terms of punch, fullness, and clarity with minimum boominess. Smaller, lighter 2-way cabs (20"x18"x18" using something like a 3015 full range with tweeter) are pretty common. I know the low end wouldn't be as full and the mids wouldn't project the same. Any other reasons to go with the 3-way and not consider this smaller option?

Thx

 

[rpsands]

I have a few questions concerning the 3015LF with a mid.
> Is the 6.5" (crossed at 800 HZ?) the optimum mid driver vs say an 8"?
> For a 2-way system does a properly designed 2-way crossover provide noticeably better response than just putting a low pass filter on the 6.5" mid driver?
> From what I've been able to gather, a 3-way cab of about 20"x24"x18" loaded with 3015LF+6.5mid+tweeter is the optimum configuration to get the most out of a 15" speaker in terms of punch, fullness, and clarity with minimum boominess. Smaller, lighter 2-way cabs (20"x18"x18" using something like a 3015 full range with tweeter) are pretty common. I know the low end wouldn't be as full and the mids wouldn't project the same. Any other reasons to go with the 3-way and not consider this smaller option?

Thx

If you look at the 3015's frequency chart you'll see a 3db boost in the mids at a certain range. Without a midrange with well-matched sensitivity, crossed over at the right point, I would think you'd see a boost of 3db at that point that you could not control without a graphic EQ given the bump is 1500-2khz. Not every bass amp is going to have an EQ dial that perfectly controls that range.

So if you want relatively even frequency response before EQ, pairing the 3015 with a mid driver with the same sensitivity seems like a good idea. The 18sound mid driver seems to be fairly even, and with a small pad would probably be just right to do a really even 1khz to 5khz coverage.

I may be speaking out of my ass, so GB correct me if I am seeing this incorrectly

Summary: It seems like "flat frequency response" is another goal suited by adding a midrange driver.

Other questions you have:
1) Most people have said you need to pad even a 6.5" driver to match its sensitivity to the 3015/3015LF. So a louder 8" driver would be unnecessary.
2) If you put a low pass filter on the 6.5" you're going to be unhappy. You mean a high pass. And yes, if you crossover the woofer so that it isn't getting the high mids that make it distort, you will probably get a slightly better sound. This is probably less noticeable with the 3015 than the 3015LF from what I've heard.
3) If you're gonna do a 2-way, I'd lean toward a midrange over a tweeter. 5khz is where I start to get bored though

 

[5StringPocket]

Thanks, that makes sense. Yes I meant hi-pass for the mid on a 2-way. That uncontrolled bump from the 15 sounds bad though - agreed, use a proper crossover. Still sounds like the 3-way is the Cadillac, especially if you slap and like some of the higher freq but for a 2-way I'd like to hear a 15+mid rather than the tweet. I'll bet the mids would have better definition and a 6.5" would get plenty high enough for bass. Most guitar players I know use 12" alone.

 

[iualum]

2-way system: KappaLite 3015 LF + 18 Sound 6ND430 (6 1/2 mid-bass)

3-way system: above + some horn or tweeter/super-tweeter

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So either of the above boxes looks to be superior to a 215 + mid and/or horn, tweeter/super-tweeter. The extra 15 just really isn't needed. Is this generally what this thread gets at?

Of the above 2-way & 3-way, does the 2-way do the job just as well as the 3-way? Is the 3-way un-needed excess for most bass applications?

If the 3-way works better, if the additional horn or tweeter/super-tweeter is going to add a lot to the mix, any good ideas on which horn or tweeter/super-tweeter?

Lastly, if someone decided to do two of these 2-ways or 3-ways, do you think 2 separate cabs is better or put it all into a single cab? If single (I know it wouldn't be light (maybe ~90-95 lbs.?), but it could have built-in casters & recessed top handles), would it be better to build two compartments (each compartment being a 2-Way or 3-Way) in the big box?

Hope I didn't word this in too confusing a way.

 

[joegeezer]

Not really. The 3015 is 2 to 3 dB more sensitive and has a lot more thermal and mechanical power handling among other things. Put one of each into two suitable identical cabs and fully drive each cab with a 500 watts @ 8 ohms side of a 2-channel power amp. One driver will quickly be toast, but on the way to burning it wasn't as loud in spite of farting up a burrito fog ; }

With two 15's it's a 4 ohm cab. I drove the cab with only 400 watts from my WT-405 Eden head. The CB15's are rated at 300 RMS @, and the 3015's at 400@. I don't care how many spec's you can spout out, I had them both firing at me, and I'm telling you, they sound exactly the same. I didn't say I cranked them up till one or the other farted out, or started to smoke, I'm just saying at 400 watts, they sound exactly the same. Both sounded good. No complaints. I still like 810's better however. Guess I always will.

 

[billfitzmaurice]

The extra 15 just really isn't needed. Is this generally what this thread gets at?

Yes. The heyday of the 2x15 was also that of the JBL E140. A JBL E140 in a 3 cu ft cab has a maximum output capability of 115dB at 60 Hz. The 3015LF will do 121dB. That 6dB difference is the equivalent of adding a second E140 cabinet.

I'm telling you, they sound exactly the same. I didn't say I cranked them up till one or the other farted out, or started to smoke, I'm just saying at 400 watts, they sound exactly the same.

You missed his point, which is how much output both options have when they are driven to full output. More germane to the conversation, one 3015LF will put out nearly as much in the low end as two 3015, and fully as much as two CB15s.

 

[rpsands]

On the flipside of the "the other 15 isn't needed" - another 3015LF in the same cab adds another 3db (6db really because of the additional wattage from going down to 4 ohms) at the cost of ~20lbs more weight. Whereas if you put it in a separate cabinet, you're getting an extra 40+lbs and having to pay for all the peripherals again (jack plates, handles, corners, porting, bracing, crossover if you go for another one with a mid). From what I can tell, a high quality mid will keep up with a pair of 3015LFs. That's why I went with that for my personal cabinet, anyway.

So if you're sure you're going to need the extra volume at least a lot of the time, it might make good sense to go with a 2x15 with a mid instead of the modular setup -- it's not much harder to move, and it saves you money and trips if you move it around a lot.