I'd also like to know this!
Most sets of Pirastro have the A highly tensioned relatively to the other strings.
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Double Bass Evah Pirazzi strings megathread part III
- Thread starter Chris Fitzgerald
- Start date
I'd also like to know this!
Most sets of Pirastro have the A highly tensioned relatively to the other strings.
I overcame the Evah w weird tension balancing issue by switching to E.P slap A ( I have a set of those allready ) and lowering the E string slot on the bridge ( this is on top of plain guts ). E is now set app. 0.7mm lower than the A, which is great because it balances the tension difference, takes the extra growl away and makes bowing the A easier. Evah W E gives the rest of the strings volume and clarity, unlike E.P slap E, which lacks power, pizz definition and is hard to bow IME.
Hi all. I've had a set of Helicore hybrid Medium on my Kolstein Fednt for about seven months now. I like their Pizz but am about to consider trying a set of Evah Pirazzi. From the descriptions, they sound like something I'm looking for/might work. Dig the Pizz for the Helicores but I practice mostly arco. To me/my playing capabilities, the Helicore for arco can be a bit scratchy (on the g and especially the open g) and I *guess unresponsive is the word I'm looking for. I find it difficult to anything rapid when crossing strings. So....very interested in the EPs...the question becomes...do I go Medium...or Weich? My gut (pun) is to go with the Mediums.
Wondering how EP mediums compare with Helicore hybrid Mediums. A lot of folks seem to prefer the Weich but I'm concerned with transitioning to a potentially lighter feeling string...and maybe more importantly (if they aren't for me) transitioning back from a light string to something like the Helicore hybrid.
Wondering how EP mediums compare with Helicore hybrid Mediums. A lot of folks seem to prefer the Weich but I'm concerned with transitioning to a potentially lighter feeling string...and maybe more importantly (if they aren't for me) transitioning back from a light string to something like the Helicore hybrid.
I tried a recent set of Helicores on my bass after using Evah Weich. My impression was similar to yours - brighter, a bit thinner, more difficult to get a nice tone up high. My opinion, they're great strings for the right application... but I was looking for a more well-rounded string, with dimension in all registers, pizz and arco. So far, I'm back with the Evah Weiss. Because Rufus Reid swears by Animas, I'll give them a try in April when it's time to replace my Evahs. YMMV.
Thanks Tom.
The Helicores that you tried after the Evah Weich....were they also light?
Not sure that I want to go Weich for the EP....though it seem that a lot of folks are using them.
Probably pull the trigger today...but hoping to get a take on the Mediums...especially in comparison/what to expect coming from Helicore Mediums; Pizz and Arco...though especially in regards to Arco responsiveness....which is my main motivation for trying the EP's. It seems like a lot of folks are using the Weichs. Just concerned if the reported responsiveness gained would be primarily from the lighter gauge. Hoping the Medium EPs are similar in Pizz volume/growl/tension feel to the Heilicore mediums but with better arco response.
Regular Evahs can work for pizz, but more often than not they are disliked for the sound and short sustain by the player.
Evah Weich have a dynamic limit. If you pluck hard and harder, there is almost no difference in the output volume.
Innovation Braided and other Innovation strings don't have that dynamic limit (or it comes very late compared to Evah Weich).
Innovation Braided for more arco work than pizz, PolyChrome might be better as a hybrid (haven't tried them yet, only early prototypes). Also the E has more punch related to the A with the Innovations than with Evah Weich.
If you don't hit the strings a bit harder the Evah Weich will work nicely.
Evah Weich have a dynamic limit. If you pluck hard and harder, there is almost no difference in the output volume.
Innovation Braided and other Innovation strings don't have that dynamic limit (or it comes very late compared to Evah Weich).
Innovation Braided for more arco work than pizz, PolyChrome might be better as a hybrid (haven't tried them yet, only early prototypes). Also the E has more punch related to the A with the Innovations than with Evah Weich.
If you don't hit the strings a bit harder the Evah Weich will work nicely.
I've never tried the HH's, but I'm a fan of EP Orchestral/Medium gauge. I'm not sure if there's a better string out there for someone playing 50/50 pizz/arco, especially with a slight lean to the arco side. I'm presently playing about 90% arco, so I'm about to make a switch to a more exclusively arco string. But EP mediums respond very well under the bow.
That's what they are made for and what they do really well.
Evah Weich for light touch pizz players using more amp than acoustic bass output. Otherwise Innovation Braided for more arco work and a soft round pizz sound or PolyChromes for more than a bit work on the pizz side. (This is concentrating on synthetic core strings excluding steel and gut core strings.)
Thanks Tom.
The Helicores that you tried after the Evah Weich....were they also light?
Not sure that I want to go Weich for the EP....though it seem that a lot of folks are using them.
Probably pull the trigger today...but hoping to get a take on the Mediums...especially in comparison/what to expect coming from Helicore Mediums; Pizz and Arco...though especially in regards to Arco responsiveness....which is my main motivation for trying the EP's. It seems like a lot of folks are using the Weichs. Just concerned if the reported responsiveness gained would be primarily from the lighter gauge. Hoping the Medium EPs are similar in Pizz volume/growl/tension feel to the Heilicore mediums but with better arco response.
Hmmm, your question made me think. Yes, all the strings I've used have been light gauge with the exception of using a Spirocore Stark E. I've considered using medium strings in the past but the experts persuaded me otherwise. I'll probably buy a set soon just to see for myself.
The realization I had after considering your question is: I see strings along a continuum from brightness to complexity. By "brightness", I mean a sing-song quality like a violin and "complexity" is richness of tone, like a baritone singer. Both are useful depending on what you're playing and for strings, I've found a trade-off between the two: the more sing-song the strings are, the better they project at the end of the board but tend to sound dull and lifeless near the nut, and vice versa. So, on my imaginary scale, which could very well be my own delusion so take it with a cargo container of salt, I'd rank the strings I've tried from bright to complex:
- Zyex, very sing-song, violin-like, soprano, attention-getting tone under the bow at the end of the board but lacking depth at the nut
- Helicore Hybrids - more complex but still singing-like at the end of the board, a bit better pizz tone over-all than the Zyex
- Obligatos - better low-end with a darker, more cello-like, alto-ish, upper register under the bow, better pizz tone yet
- Evah Weich - better low and mid-range with a very dark cello tone at the end of the board, a bit dry, less sustain, more like that baritone singer than a soprano, but nice complex, deep tone for mids and low
- Spiros - deep complex tone, very dry at the end of the board, very powerful at the low end but anemic than the others at the end of the board, especially pizz. Good technique becomes critical to getting a good pizz tone at the end of the board, but it is doable.
There's one other aspect I notice, and that's how strings sound differently to the player versus the audience. I like the sound of Zyex and Spiros when someone else is playing them, but don't like their tone when I'm playing them.
Hope that helps.
IMO and IME Evah requlars are on par in acoustic volume with Spiro starks. No matter how Pirastro describes the feel of them, " soft feeling under the fingers ", that`s just plain ******** from propably a marketing professional who has never ever touched a double bass. They`re as stiff as Spiro starks and make your left hand scream for mercy unless you set them really low. And as people describes, they only get stiffer with age. IMO Evah weichs are on the same ballpark in left hand feel with Spiro weichs / mittels. They are very loud too ( particular bass has prolly something to do with this ) when set a little higher than say your average mittel steel string, 7-ish mm`s under the G with a reqular mensure bass. Both of them have IME sustain of steel strings, but more low end presence, which comes with high-end sizzle, huge growl and mmwwahh on the higher strings.They are often described dark sounding, but I quess this comes from people who are used to Spiro-ish steel zing, and who have never tried guts. YMMV, IMO, IME.
Hmmm, an interesting comment. Much, I agree with. I've never tried guts because all of my teachers warned me off of them.
I don't usually consider the left-hand feel when I evaluate a string but I suppose that is part of the comparison. I suppose, I never considered it because the tone was my primary concern and the feel didn't have any effect for me. I'm not sure it's the most important thing to consider about a string, but, everyone's goals are different.
I've read many, I believe valid, complaints about Obligatos tending to "roll" and I can see how that could be distracting, and I found true, but it wasn't an issue for me.
Spiros and Evahs stiff? In comparison to Zyex, I'd agree, but, not that I noticed when evaluating their tone. YMMV.
The biggest difference I really notice is that Spiros seem to last forever and the rest... 12 months; again, not that I care because I want a great tone and $60 one way or the other doesn't matter to me.
Wow, Tom, For me, how the string feels across the fingerboard with my left hand is very important. There is so much going on with the hand that stops the strings. For me, that's where lots of the tone comes from. Of course where and how you pizza the strings is equally important, but the left hand plays a big part, at least for me. YMMV, IMHO
I agree that a lot of your tone comes from the left hand. Mark Gollihur's sig says something like 30% of your tone comes from your fingers, and the other 70% comes from your other fingers. But how the strings feel to the left hand? So far, it's never been a distraction for me. I will agree that I find I have to adjust my technique for different strings, but I adjust, or at least I think so, and move on; maybe I'm fooling myself. I know folks have found Obligatos roll under the finger, and I found that true but again, not a major distraction for me. Certainly something for players to consider before they try a string.
@ Tom, I know that someone at Upton Bass Works suggests a mixed set with Oblgatos on the top (D & G). I can't remember what is supposed to be on the bottom. Maybe Spiros. Not in conflict with you about what you like. Just stating what I like and what I fins to be relevant. For me, if the strings are too stiff under the left hand, I miss some nuanced articulation options. It feels like the string is working against me. On the other hand, I know a few classical players who prefer a much stiffer feel. Possibly easier for arco.
I have used obligatos and I felt the roll. Didn't work for me. On one bass I am using Evah weichs and am pleased so far
Good feel and nice tone. So far so good
My bass is a 2008 hybrid superswing by upton. They didn't make many of these I am told
Joe
Good feel and nice tone. So far so good
My bass is a 2008 hybrid superswing by upton. They didn't make many of these I am told
Joe
I`ve found the left hand part of pizz tone very true as well. For me as someone who hasn`t played the DB for too long time, and who started playing it in adult years, the left hand feel is crucial. And as I`m looking for maximum acoustic volume with tolerable overall playability, very subtle things in the setup make all the difference. Anyhow, Evahs have become my go-to strings ( talking about E`s and A`s here ) when all else fails. I have reqùlars, weichs and slaps in the drawer or on the bass at the moment. I love the low end presence, power and smooth feel of the surface, definition in all registers. Arco is fantastic on them too.
That`s my experience with slaps too, they`re weak under the bow, unlike other Evahs. Had problems with starting the E with the bow too, but some setup tweaking took care of that.
