Extra compensation for extra work?

[WI Short Scaler]

Since I know there is such a variety of experience, knowledge, and talent on here I thought I'd pose this question to the other TB'ers.

So the "full" band I've been with for a LONG time seems to be coming full circle and may wind up this fall. I may be the one to quit first and spark that move to demise but that's not part of the question I'm getting to here.

So besides playing bass and singing at the gigs. I am responsible for connecting all the PA parts, the monitors, the leads to the board, and run sound during the gig. I usually end up with the foot switch for the LED's in front of me as well since the singer is not paying attention to the logistics.

Just a question, how do you guys feel about that division of labor and the fact that all 4 of us get paid the same? Am I within my rights to say I'm tired of doing the extra work and would like be compensated better for the effort?

I haven't done it yet, but in my mind there are two possible outcomes:

1) I'll be met with instant negative feedback because this pay division has been in place as long as this lineup has, about 11-12 years, so why change now
2) if I'm being paid more the main two complainers about everything soundwise will feel more empowered to be even more vocal

 

[ArtechnikA]

Maybe give them the opportunity to come up with it on their own...
If you said 'this is getting old (acknowledges it might have been OK in the past...) and I don't want to do sound & lights any more. We should hire a sound man.'
They may conclude that will be anywhere from a full share to a couple-hundred a show, and it might be a better idea to pay you half that...
Or not...

 

[buldog5151bass]

I don't see those things worthy of extra pay. I've seen bands that pay more to the person who books the gigs, or who brings the PA (since that is something everyone uses, and has to be unpacked alone by the owner). But everyone should be helping set up and tear down the PA and lights. In the two bands in which I play, the PA owner won't take more, so I make sure I do more than my share packing up the PA (I also buy him a drink at the gig). THAT'S what I would be discussing at rehearsal.

 

[sean_on_bass]

Since I know there is such a variety of experience, knowledge, and talent on here I thought I'd pose this question to the other TB'ers.

So the "full" band I've been with for a LONG time seems to be coming full circle and may wind up this fall. I may be the one to quit first and spark that move to demise but that's not part of the question I'm getting to here.

So besides playing bass and singing at the gigs. I am responsible for connecting all the PA parts, the monitors, the leads to the board, and run sound during the gig. I usually end up with the foot switch for the LED's in front of me as well since the singer is not paying attention to the logistics.

Just a question, how do you guys feel about that division of labor and the fact that all 4 of us get paid the same? Am I within my rights to say I'm tired of doing the extra work and would like be compensated better for the effort?

I haven't done it yet, but in my mind there are two possible outcomes:

1) I'll be met with instant negative feedback because this pay division has been in place as long as this lineup has, about 11-12 years, so why change now
2) if I'm being paid more the main two complainers about everything soundwise will feel more empowered to be even more vocal

I kind of agree that asking for more pay at this point in time might be a stretch given the long history. BUT, if this is literally a deal breaker i say it's better to ask first than just quit. I think the more likely to succeed strategy would be to just ask them to pitch in for setup/tear down. If you are running the board then i don't think it's wrong to request someone else handle the light controls completely themselves, and the band pitches in to plug in the gear during setup.

 

[gln1955]

Unless you also own the PA, I don't see your situation as that unusual or egregious. Besides, that ship sailed 11 or 12 years ago. If the band is soon to break up anyway, why create some animosity now?

 

[WI Short Scaler]

Interesting opinions, about what I expected.

 

[pcake]

why not tell the other guys that if you have to be the sound man, they have to set up the PA?

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

I play with a three piece. I do all the PA work, own the PA, and run the board from the stage. I don't get any more than anyone else. I do it because neither of the other 2 know how. I'm not crazy about the extra work, but I'm happier with the sound. The band is good. There is no drama, and we seldom get a weekend off.
Balance. It's just a matter of balance.
Why do your bandmates not help out a bit? If they don't know how to hook everything up, at least they could schelp a cab or monitor.

 

[RustyAxe]

I don't get it ... you're leaving the band within months and after 12 years you want to renegotiate your pay? It sounds to me like this is water under the bridge, or over the dam, or whatever metaphor one prefers. Chalk it up to experience for your next band ... in my world I negotiate pay BEFORE I accept a job.

But for now, perhaps a more equitable division of labor is a better tack ...

 

[mrcbass]

My opinion is, that yes, if you are doing extra work and others are not, then you should get a bigger share. But only if others are not contributing is some other way. There's a lot of little things that need to happen for a band to be successful and not all of it are gig time tasks.

Somebody is probably running rehearsals and at least acting like BL. This is extra work. (lots!)
Somebody is booking gigs. This is extra work.
Somebody is probably doing public relations type work. This is extra work.

IMO these tasks (probably some others that I'm not considering) along with lighting/PA gig time type efforts are all additional work. If some are doing nothing but managing their own instrument's needs, then I believe extra compensation is warranted for those doing extra work. If everybody is pitching in some way, then you need to consider that. Bottom line: this is something that really needs to be negotiated very early on.

It sounds like you're kind of not interested in this project anymore and are simply looking for an excuse to quit. If you've been doing this for some time, you obviously didn't mind it THAT much. Is an extra half-share (or whatever you'd be asking for) really going to make you happy? I'm guessing not for long.

If you WANT to keep playing in the band and you really think you do more then the rest, then have a non emotional chat: "Guys, I'm feeling like I should get some compensation for all this extra work." and see how it goes. But if you hold your services for ransom, and they agree to pay, you sure better stick around a while.

 

[richntiff]

that's not how it works.

 

[WI Short Scaler]

I play with a three piece. I do all the PA work, own the PA, and run the board from the stage. I don't get any more than anyone else. I do it because neither of the other 2 know how. I'm not crazy about the extra work, but I'm happier with the sound. The band is good. There is no drama, and we seldom get a weekend off.
Balance. It's just a matter of balance.
Why do your bandmates not help out a bit? If they don't know how to hook everything up, at least they could schelp a cab or monitor.

This is how our 3 pc group operates as well. I do it because the others don't know how but they are more than helpful in setup/loading/plugging/running cables etc.

The group in question, 4 pc, is the one I have the issue with. I was looking for opinions because when I've mentioned this pay for extra work in the past to the group it was dismissed. And it wasn't only PA work at gigs. I ordered the business cards that had my number for contact, so I coordinated the calendar to try and line up bookings. I took the photos from gigs and made new posters every so often and got them printed. The banner for the group was painted by me and my kids. Over the last few years I've tried to pass these tasks off and guess what? They haven't gotten done.

So my mind is made up to finish our last 3 dates and be done because it's come to this point. I would not cancel any gigs, just finish what's there and walk away as amicably as possible. I just wanted to know how others felt about the work/pay balance is all. I guess I didn't explain it well enough.

 

[ArtechnikA]

..Over the last few years I've tried to pass these tasks off and guess what? They haven't gotten done.

There are people who will take all you have to give, come to expect it, and always want more.

 

[QweziRider]

Just a question, how do you guys feel about that division of labor and the fact that all 4 of us get paid the same?

In one of my bands'case, the drummer often brings the PA. Sometimes the BL brings his. We all get to sing through the PA. BL books the gigs - keeps us all working. I always end up helping the drummer load out his road cases because nobody else will (and I'm always faster at tear down than the BL and other guitarist). Often, with whatever lighting a venue might have, I end up running the darn thing from my side.

None of it is ever a burden to just pull some of my weight around there. We split even and that's that.

 

[basscapes]

I might have missed it (doing a Day Job lurk here), but does everyone share the responsibility of getting the gear to the gig? Helping you with the loadin/out?

If so, what you are doing is part of the "job" of gigging.

If they aren't (and or WON'T), then yes.

 

[lfmn16]

If you want more money than everyone else, for whatever reason, you should negotiate it BEFORE you join the band. I've been in bands where I provided and set up the PA for free and I've been in bands where one of the member provided and set up the PA for an extra fee. I'm OK with either because it was discussed BEFORE i joined the band.

If someone told me they wanted more money to plug in a couple of cables and step on a light switch, I'd laugh.

EDIT: Should have read the whole thing before posting.

It's not fair to the others to volunteer to do something and then provide them with a bill. If you want extra money to book gigs, tell them UP FRONT, "I'm taking 15% (or whatever) off the top for gigs I book." If you want reimbursement because you spend time and money on posters, tell them UP FRONT, "I'm going to need $50 off the top of the next gig for business cards and posters."

 

[bassliner50]

IMHO, the best policy is an even $ split. Think long term. I also supply my PA, I am the only vocalist, handle almost all PA set up and break down, handle 99% of technical issues as they come up and play bass in our jazz ensemble. I do not expect more compensation than anyone else. I am happy to perform music that I love. Again IMHO, the person who books the gig is *the* most critical. In our case he does not earn more than others. (does not ask for or expect it) That said, he might deserve more. And push comes to shove, he can have a larger cut if he insisted.

 

[Medicine Man]

I own and run the PA and lights for my band, and don't take an extra cut. The TB consensus is that I'm a fool. But in the end it means I pay better, and in the rare case i have a member turn over, there's someone else in line take their place. I also insist that everyone works on set up and teardown. Keeping anyone from being butthurt about money is worth it to me.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

This is how our 3 pc group operates as well. I do it because the others don't know how but they are more than helpful in setup/loading/plugging/running cables etc.

The group in question, 4 pc, is the one I have the issue with. I was looking for opinions because when I've mentioned this pay for extra work in the past to the group it was dismissed. And it wasn't only PA work at gigs. I ordered the business cards that had my number for contact, so I coordinated the calendar to try and line up bookings. I took the photos from gigs and made new posters every so often and got them printed. The banner for the group was painted by me and my kids. Over the last few years I've tried to pass these tasks off and guess what? They haven't gotten done.

So my mind is made up to finish our last 3 dates and be done because it's come to this point. I would not cancel any gigs, just finish what's there and walk away as amicably as possible. I just wanted to know how others felt about the work/pay balance is all. I guess I didn't explain it well enough.

Easily understood.

 

[Nickweissmusic]

Since I know there is such a variety of experience, knowledge, and talent on here I thought I'd pose this question to the other TB'ers.

So the "full" band I've been with for a LONG time seems to be coming full circle and may wind up this fall. I may be the one to quit first and spark that move to demise but that's not part of the question I'm getting to here.

So besides playing bass and singing at the gigs. I am responsible for connecting all the PA parts, the monitors, the leads to the board, and run sound during the gig. I usually end up with the foot switch for the LED's in front of me as well since the singer is not paying attention to the logistics.

Just a question, how do you guys feel about that division of labor and the fact that all 4 of us get paid the same? Am I within my rights to say I'm tired of doing the extra work and would like be compensated better for the effort?

I haven't done it yet, but in my mind there are two possible outcomes:

1) I'll be met with instant negative feedback because this pay division has been in place as long as this lineup has, about 11-12 years, so why change now
2) if I'm being paid more the main two complainers about everything soundwise will feel more empowered to be even more vocal

If you feel like it’s the beginning of the end, you’re probably right. When it comes down to it, of course you should be compensated for doing more work than others, whether it’s been happening for 100 years or not, if that is really what’s happening; are you also lugging all the gear in? Tearing it all down too? How much extra time does this require from you? Is this a situation where you are arriving earlier, leaving later, or working while other guys are sitting at the bar etc.? It’s clear you have resentment, and from what I’ve seen, it seems as though it’s deserved. A calm discussion of this will be your only chance at getting your deserved compensation. I don’t think it’s wrong to ask for change, you’re a different person than you were 10 years ago, but I wouldn’t even bother asking unless you would enjoy playing and continue with them if you are compensated properly. At any rate, I don’t feel you just have to suck it up because that’s the way it’s always been, it’s your career, you have to advocate for yourself, and understand that this could lead to parting ways.