Fake Dark Glass Pedals

[Derek Williams]

On the one hand, how many Klon / Big Muff / whatever else clones are out there on the market?

On the other hand, these skirt the line between clone/homage and forgery, especially using terms like "microtubes".

Hmmm.

It's useful to look at the watch market and what is considered a clone/homage, and what is considered counterfeit/forgery. I believe the agreed upon difference is using the company name and/or logo. If these pedals said Darkglass instead of DemonFX then I think we would all agree that they have crossed a line.

 

[socialleper]

On the one hand, how many Klon / Big Muff / whatever else clones are out there on the market?

On the other hand, these skirt the line between clone/homage and forgery, especially using terms like "microtubes".

Hmmm.

The obsession with Klones has always been weird to me. To my ear it just sounds like a mellow TS9. Doesn't seem worth all the effort and money guitar players put into them.

 

[HolmeBass]

I think DemonFX is on safe ground, legally.

But I am shocked Darkglass didn’t trademark “Microtubes”.

 

[socialleper]

I've heard some good things about the DemonFX pedals. I haven't tried one myself, but I didn't realize he did more than DG pedals. I might need to look into them again.
I wonder what they are skimping on to hit those price points? Cheap components? Child labor?

 

[HolmeBass]

I've heard some good things about the DemonFX pedals. I haven't tried one myself, but I didn't realize he did more than DG pedals. I might need to look into them again.
I wonder what they are skimping on to hit those price points? Cheap components? Child labor?

Cheap components, cheap materials, and cheap labor. Doesn’t necessarily have to be children. I mean, let’s hope it isn’t.

 

[socialleper]

"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment"

 

[Bastardbass]

Yall are tooo passionate about ur pedals and ethical standards, you only live once make it count! I’m sure dark glass is doing just fine cruising around on there super yacht drinking champagne & counting fat stacks of money with their French super model girlfriends who are throwing money into the ocean laughing saying we have so much money. Dark glass is ok they won’t miss someone skimming a little off the top. As for me I’m lucky to even own a honda civic and a female companion haha out of the question I can’t afford it ! I can barely afford the company of a small dog! The dreams that are in my reach are a fake pedal and possibly a french adult magazine, as a matter a fact I’m heading out to the local music store and the magazine section at the liquor I’ll be back in a few if all goes well

 

[tonymcbony]

If clones are getting smashed out and people are buying them, it's a good sign you're pushing too hard towards the overpriced bracket.
People gonna buy the real thing if it's a manageable stretch, but if the copy that's not particularly bargain bin priced is selling well, you might want to rethink your pricing strategy.

Darkglass gonna Darkglass though, someone is always going to want the real thing (and the Demon FX stuff does sound a bit different, but awfully close)

 

[DaveParker39]

It's useful to look at the watch market and what is considered a clone/homage, and what is considered counterfeit/forgery. I believe the agreed upon difference is using the company name and/or logo. If these pedals said Darkglass instead of DemonFX then I think we would all agree that they have crossed a line.

Yep. There's a difference between making an affordable dive watch and a knock-off "RQLEX Submariner".
The Cali76 clone is literally called the "Call76" so that at first glance you think it says "Cali76", though. I think they are reallllly close to that line.

 

[kleinenenten]

I have had the B7KU and the DemonFX clone of it - thought not at the same time. I wasn't a fan of either, and flipped them both. That being said, I actually found the DemonFX clone better for my uses as it wasn't quite as harsh in the upper treble content. I'm sure most people wouldn't notice the difference. I never had either for long, so I can't compare longevity or overall quality, but the clone was pretty much spot on as far as I could tell minus the previously mentioned treble.

But it's readily apparent that they copy pretty much everything aesthetically from the originals. My DemonFX clone had labels for features from the original that the clone didn't have.

I'm actually debating one of the B3K clones as a backup because I love my original so much, but can't justify purchasing one to not use it. So the clone may end up on my #2 board. We'll see what happens. I buy pretty much everything secondhand, though, so neither company has gotten any money from me directly.

 

[bdplaid]

It's called being poor

That's same argument used to justify looting.

 

[MtManiac]

Where do we draw the line? Are Jazz bass copies okay? I’ve got an LA-2A clone with teletronix artwork on it. You end up on pretty shakey ground if you are okay with that kind of thing but think DemonFX has gone so far that you start questioning the character of anyone that would buy one.

To someone that is familiar with these cloned pedals the DemonFX look like obvious fakes, just like a Fender fan can recognize a real one (I can’t tell them apart from the fakes without looking close).

The idea that these lines need to be drawn at all is a fallacy. You draw your lines wherever you want; I’ll draw mine.

 

[MtManiac]

Cheap components, cheap materials, and cheap labor. Doesn’t necessarily have to be children. I mean, let’s hope it isn’t.

Real estate, and design.

 

[MtManiac]

That's same argument used to justify looting.

Is it? Most poor people most of the time don’t “loot.” You think people are “looting” because they’re poor? People loot because they’re angry and living in a system where they have no power or voice.

Speaking of poor people, rich people exploit labour and other resources every day. Always curious why that isn’t considered theft, just because it’s legitimized by those same systems.

 

[Seth DuSith]

That's same argument used to justify looting.

Except I'm paying money for my product and breaking no laws. Not everyone is a rich coding hipster who has the money for 10 Dingwalls and 20 darkglass pedals. If we were, we would never buy these clones. The people who can afford the real deal will buy the real deal. It's the same reason you never see well off people with knock off air Jordan's

Just to add: the only time I consider counterfeit to be morally wrong is when they try pretend to be the real thing, and sell for the real things price. That's when I'm against it.

But if it's something like... A fingwall and a barkbass, it's hilarious and I don't believe it's truly taking any customers Dingwall and darkglass would have actually had

 

[bdplaid]

Except I'm paying money for my product and breaking no laws. Not everyone is a rich coding hipster who has the money for 10 Dingwalls and 20 darkglass pedals. If we were, we would never buy these clones. The people who can afford the real deal will buy the real deal. It's the same reason you never see well off people with knock off air Jordan's

I guess our society is past the idea of doing without, or buying used. Whatever, rock on. Just remember Diamond Effects went out of business for lack of sales.

 

[Seth DuSith]

I guess our society is past the idea of doing without, or buying used. Whatever, rock on. Just remember Diamond Effects went out of business for lack of sales.

I updated my post to add more on the topic. I don't think the big name brands would really lose customers. People are about name brands. It's how it is, it's why supreme can sell a literal brick for 200$. If someone is buying demonfx, they were likely never gonna buy a darkglass to begin with, or already have one and wanna compare. Not many, who are able to have the real thing, would pass up on opportunity for the real thing, because the real thing has resale value. It has collector value. It has a real value that can be traded, or sold

 

[Seth DuSith]

It's like this : would you guys pass up a steak, in exchange for steak Flavoured corn flakes? It taste similar and is cheap, would it honestly replace the desire you have for a real steak?

People pay absurd money for an instrument with their favourite artists name on it. The value of vintage instruments only go up. Everyone wants what their hero has. Even though the quality has been going down, people will still happily buy an American made fender because they need a fender. Gibson somehow still makes sales.

I said it already, but I do plan on replacing my clones with the real thing. But I want to make my music now. I need a fanned fret base with a long scale so I can tune down and retain clarity. I need overdrives with tht harmonic boost to stand out for a lot of bands I would potentially join.

It's only morally wrong if I change the label and sell it, pretending it's a dark glass, selling it for darkglass prices. Now that's theft

 

[bdplaid]

I updated my post to add more on the topic. I don't think the big name brands would really lose customers. People are about name brands. It's how it is, it's why supreme can sell a literal brick for 200$. If someone is buying demonfx, they were likely never gonna buy a darkglass to begin with, or already have one and wanna compare. Not many, who are able to have the real thing, would pass up on opportunity for the real thing, because the real thing has resale value. It has collector value. It has a real value that can be traded, or sold

You're onto something with the resale. I am currently selling off a lot of gear, and the things that went first were the name-brand items. The off-brand things I might as well put into the trash. And since I don't like to fill landfills, I just fill my shelves with unwanted crap. So while I have the (thing), I enjoy better performance, and when I am done with the (thing), I can sell it quickly and for more money. And keeps the lights on in the companies that developed the (thing). And keeps electronics out of landfills. Seems like a win win win win to me.

How do I afford it? By selling off the (thing) to fund the next (thing).

 

[Bastardbass]

Dreams can come true! Well I had to buy second hand magazines at the thrift store but they have french girls