• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Fender decals on not-really-Fender basses

#361
1SHOT1HIT said:
Nah, I'm good. You got something to share? Share it, if you'd like.
I'm completely comfortable with just using my eyes and looking right on the headstock where it says BY FENDER.

If you'd like to share a link feel free but I have no plans on going on some wild goose chase to prove a pointless point.
Click to expand...

OK, This is false:
"bought the hell out of them to stop them from undercutting their ability to target the budget line consumers with their cheap knock offs".
If you're going to make claims, and want to be taken seriously, take the time to know what you are talking about.
 
#364
Turock said:
OK, This is false:
"bought the hell out of them to stop them from undercutting their ability to target the budget line consumers with their cheap knock offs".
If you're going to make claims, and want to be taken seriously, take the time to know what you are talking about.
Click to expand...


The following is an article from Wikipedia, about Fender and their buying of the Squire name to keep from losing money from budget line consumers, as they did not offer a budget line.
Fender wanted in on that market, and bought out Squire to do so, they not only got in on it, they completely took it over.

Feel free to read for yourself.



History


Fender, under the ownership of CBS, acquired the Squier brand name in 1965 when it bought a USA based string making firm, but it lay dormant for many years.[1] Before the Fender Squier series was introduced in 1982, Fender was making lower priced guitars such as the Fender Lead series at its Fullerton California plant. Until the introduction of the Fender Squier series, Fender had never produced lower priced guitars based on its main Stratocaster and Telecaster designs and had always used different model designs for its lower priced guitars.
In the late 1970s and early 1980s Fender was facing competition from lower priced Japanese made guitars. The higher priced Fender guitars were made in America and could not compete with the lower prices of Japanese made Fender copies. In the early 1980s, Japanese labour and production costs were much lower than in America and to compete with the Japanese made guitars, Fender moved the lower priced Fender guitar production from America to Japan.
Fender was also losing sales in Japan to Japanese guitar brands such as Tōkai, Greco and Fernandes and the establishment of Fender Japan would benefit Fender sales in Japan as well as overseas. Fender began negotiations with several Japanese musical instrument distributors and reached an agreement with Yamano Gakki and Kanda Shokai to establish Fender Japan. Yamano Gakki is also known for once being part of Epiphone Japan. Kanda Shokai owned the Greco brand name and one of the conditions of the Fender Japan agreement was that Kanda Shokai cease production of its own Greco Fender copies.
This arrangement benefited Fender because it removed the Greco Fender copies from the Japanese market which were selling in Japan at much lower prices than the American made Fenders and it also benefited Kanda Shokai because Kanda Shokai could then distribute Japanese made Fender branded guitars in Japan. Further negotiations between Fender and Japanese guitar factories took place. Tokai was seriously considered to start building the first Japanese made Fenders, but after a breakdown in negotiations, FujiGen Gakki was chosen instead.[2]
The first Squier series was launched on July/August 1982 and over time the Squier series has slowly evolved to include original model designs and production has moved from Japan to various other Asian countries such as Korea and China.

If your going to tell people they don't know what their talking about, I think it would be a really good time to definitely make sure you yourself know what your talking about.
 
#366
Here's a link for anyone that wants to argue about Squire somehow not being Fender.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...iYHgBA&usg=AFQjCNEybcw_u3XJjjgQ_TPRaDLhcCluyg


Although, I think it's broken because it's funny Squier's site is Invalid Link Removed

And then they have stuff like this all over the place.

Crazy, I think you guys are right, SQUIER IS NOT FENDER, no way no how, not possible. :rollno:

Copyright © 2012 Fender Musical Instruments Corporation. All rights reserved.
Fender Products

Electric Guitars
Bass Guitars
Acoustic Guitars
Guitar Amplifiers
Bass Amplifiers
Fender Audio
Accessories
Feature Sites
About Fender

About Fender
Visitor Center
Factory Tours
Community Outreach
Contact Information
Gigs at Fender
Newsroom
Privacy Policy
Terms of Use
News

Fender News
Fender E-News
Blog
Video
Promos & Giveaways
Store

Store Home
New Items
Men's Clothing
Ladies Clothing
Misc. Collectibles
Support

Support Home
Product Manuals
How-To Guides
Product Dating
Library
Community

Fender® Lounge Forums
Guitar Builder
Online Guitar Lessons
Online Guitar Tuner
Fender® FUSE™
 
#367
1SHOT1HIT said:
The following is an article from Wikipedia, about Fender and their buying of the Squire name to keep from losing money from budget line consumers, as they did not offer a budget line.
Fender wanted in on that market, and bought out Squire to do so, they not only got in on it, they completely took it over.

Feel free to read for yourself.



History


Fender, under the ownership of CBS, acquired the Squier brand name in 1965 when it bought a USA based string making firm, but it lay dormant for many years.[1] Before the Fender Squier series was introduced in 1982, Fender was making lower priced guitars such as the Fender Lead series at its Fullerton California plant. Until the introduction of the Fender Squier series, Fender had never produced lower priced guitars based on its main Stratocaster and Telecaster designs and had always used different model designs for its lower priced guitars.
In the late 1970s and early 1980s Fender was facing competition from lower priced Japanese made guitars. The higher priced Fender guitars were made in America and could not compete with the lower prices of Japanese made Fender copies. In the early 1980s, Japanese labour and production costs were much lower than in America and to compete with the Japanese made guitars, Fender moved the lower priced Fender guitar production from America to Japan.
Fender was also losing sales in Japan to Japanese guitar brands such as Tōkai, Greco and Fernandes and the establishment of Fender Japan would benefit Fender sales in Japan as well as overseas. Fender began negotiations with several Japanese musical instrument distributors and reached an agreement with Yamano Gakki and Kanda Shokai to establish Fender Japan. Yamano Gakki is also known for once being part of Epiphone Japan. Kanda Shokai owned the Greco brand name and one of the conditions of the Fender Japan agreement was that Kanda Shokai cease production of its own Greco Fender copies.
This arrangement benefited Fender because it removed the Greco Fender copies from the Japanese market which were selling in Japan at much lower prices than the American made Fenders and it also benefited Kanda Shokai because Kanda Shokai could then distribute Japanese made Fender branded guitars in Japan. Further negotiations between Fender and Japanese guitar factories took place. Tokai was seriously considered to start building the first Japanese made Fenders, but after a breakdown in negotiations, FujiGen Gakki was chosen instead.[2]
The first Squier series was launched on July/August 1982 and over time the Squier series has slowly evolved to include original model designs and production has moved from Japan to various other Asian countries such as Korea and China.

If your going to tell people they don't know what their talking about, I think it would be a really good time to definitely make sure you yourself know what your talking about.
Click to expand...
I'm well aware of all that. That is not what you said.You said Fender bought Squier to "to stop them from undercutting their ability to target the budget line consumers with their cheap knock offs".
Fender did not buy them because they were selling. "cheap knockoffs". Squier was not selling "cheap knock offs" when Fender bought them, they made strings.
Yes, I do know what I'm talking about. You made up your's.
 
#368
Turock said:
I'm well aware of all that. That is not what you said.You said Fender bought Squier to "to stop them from undercutting their ability to target the budget line consumers with their cheap knock offs".
Fender did not buy them because they were selling. "cheap knockoffs". Squier was not selling "cheap knock offs" when Fender bought them, they made strings.
Yes, I do know what I'm talking about. You made up your's.
Click to expand...

See I didn't, you in your moment of infinite, self ass-ertiveness, decided to assume you knew the intent behind a quick written comment on the tail end of a sarcastic statement.

I understand it didn't lay my entire thought out or convey it to where only a dense person could misconstrue it, that is why I'm even bothering wasting the time, to try and explain this to you. admittedly it was poorly worded. However it was NOT what you are insinuating it was.

Let me be clear for you, Unlike you I'm not claiming to be a know it all, or anymore informed than anyone else.
I had literally just read the article seconds prior to my comment being written.
So it was very fresh in my mind, I know exactly what I meant by it and had my intent of been to define Squier & Fenders history clearly, I surely would have been more verbose with my comment. However it was nothing more than filler at the end of a sarcastic statement.

My wording does not insinuate that Squier made cheap knock offs or didn't, it says Fender bought Squier to stop THEM from undercutting their ABILTY to target the budget line consumer.
Perhaps I should have used ,,Japan,, in place of THEM.

But if I wanted to insinuate that they were directly trying to stop SQUIER from anything I would have used Squier in place of THEM.
When I said that they kicked in the door, my insinuation was to the entire Japanese market.
Again, I literally had just read the article, I knew very well why Fender bought Squier.

But the point was that Fender bought Squier to stop production of the bulk of the cheap knock offs.
Nothing I said was accusative of Squier doing anything,
It was to keep from being undercut.

If that doesn't clear it up for you, I'm sorry, but I've had 1-1/2 hours of sleep and literally dozed off 3 times while typing this. I can't be any more clear. Not now at least.
 
#370
1SHOT1HIT said:
See I didn't, you in your moment of infinite, self ass-ertiveness, decided to assume you knew the intent behind a quick written comment on the tail end of a sarcastic statement.

I understand it didn't lay my entire thought out or convey it to where only a dense person could misconstrue it, that is why I'm even bothering wasting the time, to try and explain this to you. admittedly it was poorly worded. However it was NOT what you are insinuating it was.

Let me be clear for you, Unlike you I'm not claiming to be a know it all, or anymore informed than anyone else.
I had literally just read the article seconds prior to my comment being written.
So it was very fresh in my mind, I know exactly what I meant by it and had my intent of been to define Squier & Fenders history clearly, I surely would have been more verbose with my comment. However it was nothing more than filler at the end of a sarcastic statement.

My wording does not insinuate that Squier made cheap knock offs or didn't, it says Fender bought Squier to stop THEM from undercutting their ABILTY to target the budget line consumer.
Perhaps I should have used ,,Japan,, in place of THEM.

But if I wanted to insinuate that they were directly trying to stop SQUIER from anything I would have used Squier in place of THEM.
When I said that they kicked in the door, my insinuation was to the entire Japanese market.
Again, I literally had just read the article, I knew very well why Fender bought Squier.

But the point was that Fender bought Squier to stop production of the bulk of the cheap knock offs.
Nothing I said was accusative of Squier doing anything,
It was to keep from being undercut.

If that doesn't clear it up for you, I'm sorry, but I've had 1-1/2 hours of sleep and literally dozed off 3 times while typing this. I can't be any more clear. Not now at least.
Click to expand...
I got that point. It's the one I've been referring to. It is false.
 
#371
scotch said:
1Shot'- if Fender and Squier are the same, why does Fender bother using the 'Squier' label at all? It seems the folks at Fender (who actually make & market the things) may have a different take than you.
Click to expand...

No it doesn't seem that at all.

Are you seriously having this much trouble accepting this?

Invalid Link Removed

I Really shouldn't have to say more.

It's a series, a line, a type, call it what you will but IT IS FENDER.
 
#373
I thought that other than the Mexican and very rare US made Squiers made in the late 90's to early 2000's the Squier line is made at a non-Fender factory. In general, they are licensed copies made by other factories and sold by Fender dealers. So the distinction is that Fenders are made by Fender in Fender factories, Squiers are not. I'm sure there are exceptions.
 
#374
1SHOT1HIT said:
No it doesn't seem that at all.

Are you seriously having this much trouble accepting this?

Invalid Link Removed

I Really shouldn't have to say more.

It's a series, a line, a type, call it what you will but IT IS FENDER.
Click to expand...

Yes, the Squier line is manufactured and marketed by Fender. This is like a religious fanaticism for you man. Yikes!
 
#379
Turock said:
"But the point was that Fender bought Squier to stop production of the bulk of the cheap knock offs".

Does it seem likely to you that Fender would buy Squier in 1965 to stop production of "cheap knock offs" in 1982?
Click to expand...

No they bought Squire to get their foot in the door in that level of market.
It's clearly documented, how long they took to do it is irrelevant.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back