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Fender no longer using rosewood ?

#243
wvbass said:
Yeah, I'm not a big "wood matters" guy, but I do think, two things about wood selection. First, Bbsswood tends to affect (IMO damage) the midrange of a passive bass, and second, fingerboard wood affects the acoustic tone of an instrument. I won't argue that it affects the amplified tone in any way that matters, but I sure do think the acoustic tone changes.

...

I also think this is as much a marketing ploy as it is concern about import/export costs. Fender is still going to use rosewood on the American Professional series, and they used CITES as a reason (excuse?) to raise their prices. That may be about importing neck blanks, but a lot of these MIA basses never leave the US. Ebony has long been sold as an upgrade from rosewood, so moving the Elites to this adds marketing prestige. Pau Ferro is less prestigious, which, given the high quality of the MIM line, adds a needed (IMO) differentiator between the MIM and MIA product lines.

Fender seems to be trying to distinguish between its product lines, and if they can get any positive press from being pro-conservation, they will take it:

MIM = Pao Ferro
MIA = Rosewood
MIA Elite = Ebony

See what they did there?
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guy n. cognito said:
Good thing Fender makes electrics then......
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I'm not sure what point you are trying to make, but you sure did a nice job of pulling my quote out of context, which removes any meaning it may have had.
 
#246
Clef_de_fa said:
How can Ebony be a problem when violin, alto, cello and DB are all made with Ebony fingerboard and many instrument are a few undred years old ...
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I had problems with ebony cracking on two basses. It probably cracks on members of the violin family as well (though the ebony on such instruments is much thicker than on electric basses). It isn't the end of the world when cracks appear (the cracks can be glued up) but it can still be a drag when it happens.
 
#247
chris_b said:
This is a storm in a tea cup! Stop buying stuff that isn't sustainable. We already own enough great stuff and we don't need any more. Be sensible and save the planet.

On fretboards. . . . I don't like maple because it looks dirty and messy when it wears through to the wood and stains up. This is the reason Leo Fender introduced rosewood in the first place. He didn't think stained maple looked good either. . . . great minds eh? If they could stop that happening I'd be just as happy with maple.
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I love dirty old maple but 100% agree with the first part of that post. Sustainability is the only thing that really matters, everything else is just a first world problem.
 
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#249
guy n. cognito said:
Relevance. Why bring up acoustic tone if it's irrevelant?
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I don't see it as irrelevant. I wasn't talking about acoustic instruments; I was talking about acoustic tone. I agree with the post I was quoting that implied a dislike for "clacky" maple boards. I think, for example, that an electric bass with a maple board and dead roundwounds has a distinctive "clack" to the fret noise. I don't like that sound, and it colors my opinion about maple boards. In the opposite direction, I don't hear that same noise with rosewood boards. This is 99% about the acoustic tone, but it affects my opinion of maple boards. So, for me, the reduction in the use of rosewood is a negative, even though I also recognize (and it contradicts my arguably emotional opinion) that it is virtually impossible to hear a difference between, for example, an amplified P bass with a rosewood board and one with a maple board.
 
#250
bass12 said:
According to the Janka hardness scale, hard maple is softer than the various rosewoods. Pau ferro is between maple and the rosewoods hardness-wise (with Brazilian rosewood being the hardest of the rosewoods listed).
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All of this.

Maple needs to be coated or roasted in order to even get close to rosewood in hardness.
SpazzTheBassist said:
In the case of Ebony for the Elites, I personally like harder fretboards and usually always opt for maple over rosewood between the two but, now, with Ebony replacing Rosewood for dark wood aesthetics, Ebony is harder than maple......This is going to be interesting for players that prefer the softer/spongier response and feel of rosewood (and, yes, this does effect tone slightly) if maple is now the "softer wood" option




Question: I know nothing about Pau Ferro, so is it softer than rosewood or harder?
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#251
SpazzTheBassist said:
i do appreciate the info and find in interesting......Still, Ive yet to play any rosewood board that has the more solid response of maple...as far as this player is concerned, rosewood is spongier than maple (this also seems to be the consensus on most guitar sites Ive just visited)
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Rosewood had a characteristic sound, that is caused by its open grain. Maple has a tighter grain structure, and is sealed, causing it to sound brighter, and eliminate the sponginess that you dislike.
 
#254
Before long (and the new CITES rules will move it forward dramatically), we will be in a world of synthetic boards.

NS Designs has already moved from Ebony on their NXT line to Richlite. And if there's a single company that I'd trust not to play fast and loose with their QC, it's them.

When I get a chance, I want to try a Richlite fingerboard.
 
#255
Matin has been using Richlite on their acoustics for some time now. "Diamondwood" is also a synthetic blend (Roscoe uses it on fretli), and Zon has used synthetic blends for decades.

Every material has advantages and disadvantages. Some of those are real, some imagined, but since perception is reality, they all matter depending on the individual.
 
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#256
nostatic said:
Matin has been using Richlite on their acoustics for some time now. "Diamondwood" is also a synthetic blend (Roscoe uses it on fretli), and Zon has used synthetic blends for decades.

Every material has advantages and disadvantages. Some of those are real, some imagined, but since perception is reality, they all matter depending on the individual.
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Martin is another company that I'd trust. Their reputation is priceless to them, and making a mistake with it could cost them millions.

I'm curious about the sound of Richlite. Is it a true replacement for the brightness and snap of ebony?

I much prefer the sound of open grained woods on my basses (read Rosewood!), but my EUB is Ebony, and it works extremely well in that regard. It has the attack that is expected for that instrument.
 
#257
bass12 said:
I had problems with ebony cracking on two basses. It probably cracks on members of the violin family as well (though the ebony on such instruments is much thicker than on electric basses). It isn't the end of the world when cracks appear (the cracks can be glued up) but it can still be a drag when it happens.
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European luthiers who make instruments in the violin family are often adamant about working with wood that has been drying for 50-100 years or more.This is certainly true for soundboards and backs and sides. It wouldn't surprise me if they feel the same way about fingerboard blanks as well. Wood that has been drying that long will have done all the twisting,cracking etc. it is likely to ever do so when properly cared for.
I doubt guitar factories can be so choosy with whatever ebony they can get their hands on.
 
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