Finally played an all-tube amp!

[x52dcd]

Played a bar gig last night where I usually have to bring my own rig, but new ownership has some house gear. Blown away by the difference in feel! Was like the notes just sprung out of the amp. Mind you, only an amateur player, so experience is limited.

It wasn't even a highly regarded amp from what I've read on here today - a Fender Bassman Ten, Silverface 70's vintage, hefty 4x10 combo. Primarily a guitar amp, only 50 watts, but in that venue I feel like that worked to its advantage because the channel and master volumes were up high, and we all know tubes like the workout.

Now I'm re-evaluating my whole setup. My rig is no slouch, Mesa Subway WD800 with matching 210 cab. But is it "too much rig for the gig"? Am I not running it where it needs to be to give the same snap? Am I too caught up in all the tone shaping capabilities and diluting things rather than enhancing? Realistically, I'm not about to go snap up a 100 pound tube amp to lug around, but I think I've now "crossed the chasm" where the feel and responsiveness have creeped to the top of the priority pile.

So, I guess this was more of a statement than discussion inducing. But an opportunity to play on something I wouldn't have otherwise had has upped the inspiration level and was a valuable learning experience (or at least a quest for new knowledge) that I thought I'd share. That happen to anyone else?

 

[Bobo]

Played a bar gig last night where I usually have to bring my own rig, but new ownership has some house gear. Blown away by the difference in feel! Was like the notes just sprung out of the amp. Mind you, only an amateur player, so experience is limited.

It wasn't even a highly regarded amp from what I've read on here today - a Fender Bassman Ten, Silverface 70's vintage, hefty 4x10 combo. Primarily a guitar amp, only 50 watts, but in that venue I feel like that worked to its advantage because the channel and master volumes were up high, and we all know tubes like the workout.

Now I'm re-evaluating my whole setup. My rig is no slouch, Mesa Subway WD800 with matching 210 cab. But is it "too much rig for the gig"? Am I not running it where it needs to be to give the same snap? Am I too caught up in all the tone shaping capabilities and diluting things rather than enhancing? Realistically, I'm not about to go snap up a 100 pound tube amp to lug around, but I think I've now "crossed the chasm" where the feel and responsiveness have creeped to the top of the priority pile.

So, I guess this was more of a statement than discussion inducing. But an opportunity to play on something I wouldn't have otherwise had has upped the inspiration level and was a valuable learning experience (or at least a quest for new knowledge) that I thought I'd share. That happen to anyone else?

Do I miss playing though an SVT or a V4-B, or even my ‘66 B-15n? You betcha; however, I’ve got a 69 year old back, and no roadies…so my 1.6 pound TE Elf is my go to amp these days…

 

[LetItGrowTone]

Naming your current rig, instead of keeping it more general, will probably change the course of the thread.

 

[x52dcd]

Do I miss playing though an SVT or a V4-B, or even my ‘66 B-15n? You betcha; however, I’ve got a 69 year old back, and no roadies…so my 1.6 pound TE Elf is my go to amp these days…

Oh, I hear that! None of use are getting any younger. Funny thing, one of those same Bassman Ten amps (1972 silverface) was posted for sale today locally. Some may consider that "fate", but I value my lower back too much to do anything crazy

 

[x52dcd]

Naming your current rig, instead of keeping it more general, will probably change the course of the thread.

It's in there, third paragraph. Mesa Subway WD800 + 210 cab

 

[MHeardOnBass]

What are your power amp damping settings on the Mesa? I’m on the hunt for one and from what I’ve read the lowest setting is meant to emulate the way older amps deliver power to the speakers. Between that and the gain knob you might be able to get closer to that Fender.

 

[LetItGrowTone]

It's in there, third paragraph. Mesa Subway WD800 + 210 cab

I know.
I meant, the thread will probably be different because you named it specifically.

 

[jbrew73]

My bassman 10 was the worst amp I ever had. There were two versions of it though. Mine was the non ultra-linear model.

 

[Bill Whitehurst]

On the flip side, I remember the first time I played a solid state amp I liked the power , but it felt dead.

 

[x52dcd]

I know.
I meant, the thread will probably be different because you named it specifically.

Ahhhhh....apologies for my poor comprehension!!

 

[tshapiro]

Played a bar gig last night where I usually have to bring my own rig, but new ownership has some house gear. Blown away by the difference in feel! Was like the notes just sprung out of the amp. Mind you, only an amateur player, so experience is limited.

It wasn't even a highly regarded amp from what I've read on here today - a Fender Bassman Ten, Silverface 70's vintage, hefty 4x10 combo. Primarily a guitar amp, only 50 watts, but in that venue I feel like that worked to its advantage because the channel and master volumes were up high, and we all know tubes like the workout.

Now I'm re-evaluating my whole setup. My rig is no slouch, Mesa Subway WD800 with matching 210 cab. But is it "too much rig for the gig"? Am I not running it where it needs to be to give the same snap? Am I too caught up in all the tone shaping capabilities and diluting things rather than enhancing? Realistically, I'm not about to go snap up a 100 pound tube amp to lug around, but I think I've now "crossed the chasm" where the feel and responsiveness have creeped to the top of the priority pile.

So, I guess this was more of a statement than discussion inducing. But an opportunity to play on something I wouldn't have otherwise had has upped the inspiration level and was a valuable learning experience (or at least a quest for new knowledge) that I thought I'd share. That happen to anyone else?

You likely know, but 50 tubes watts will sound a lot more substantial than its SS equivalent. And, a lot of people have discovered that vintage gear powered by tubes or older Class A/B solid state, with minimal tone shaping or effects has much more pop and clarity.

Long winded story for anyone interested:
About 25 years ago, I brought my pedalboard and 100w solid state guitar amp into a music store to try out a very common overdrive pedal. Coincidently, one of my favorite guitarists who used that pedal worked at the store. In my setup, the pedal sounded blah. "Give me a second," he said. He took the pedal off my board, adjusted it to minimal settings. Then he plugged it into a 22 watt tube amp a bit cranked. "Now try that," he said. Mind blown. We went right from Blah Street to Rip Your Face Off Town. Immediately ditched the SS amp, now own 4 tube amps of various sizes and have minimal pedal boards. With bass, I find the legacy big Class A/B SS as well as tube amps provide that same umph and clarity. So, your experience doesn't surprise me at all. Granted, there is the very real aspect of weight and maintenance to deal with which is a deal breaker for many. But, there's a reason these legacy amps still sell for a pretty penny.

 

[x52dcd]

What are your power amp damping settings on the Mesa? I’m on the hunt for one and from what I’ve read the lowest setting is meant to emulate the way older amps deliver power to the speakers. Between that and the gain knob you might be able to get closer to that Fender.

That's a fair point. I've been through the 3 settings, though never really focused in on what differences I was experiencing. I'll do that next time I get it set up. I'm also going to try to push the volume more than I typically play at, to see if that brings more spark. Will report back!

 

[x52dcd]

You likely know, but 50 tubes watts will sound a lot more substantial than its SS equivalent. And, a lot of people have discovered that vintage gear powered by tubes or older Class A/B solid state, with minimal tone shaping or effects has much more pop and clarity.

Long winded story for anyone interested:
About 25 years ago, I brought my pedalboard and 100w solid state guitar amp into a music store to try out a very common overdrive pedal. Coincidently, one of my favorite guitarists who used that pedal worked at the store. In my setup, the pedal sounded blah. "Give me a second," he said. He took the pedal off my board, adjusted it to minimal settings. Then he plugged it into a 22 watt tube amp a bit cranked. "Now try that," he said. Mind blown. We went right from Blah Street to Rip Your Face Off Town. Immediately ditched the SS amp, now own 4 tube amps of various sizes and have minimal pedal boards. With bass, I find the legacy big Class A/B SS as well as tube amps provide that same umph and clarity. So, your experience doesn't surprise me at all. Granted, there is the very real aspect of weight and maintenance to deal with which is a deal breaker for many. But, there's a reason these legacy amps still sell for a pretty penny.

Truth. Before bass, I played some guitar. Tube amps are much more accessible/practical in that market; I don't even think I owned a SS guitar amp. Sometimes you don't know what you're missing!

 

[hennessybass]

Put the damping on your Mesa amp to low, and change the ohm selector on the back to 2 ohms. The ohm thing will essentially lower the power of the amp when driving a 4 or 8 ohm cab... meaning you could probably drive it more to it's full potential.

I've had a lot of tube amps, and they are all pretty different, but I've generally had a really good experience. Love Fender amps especially. There is something really great about only having 2-3 knobs - get a sound a play - it forces you to focus on your playing rather than the features of the amp.

You might like a fender style preamp before your Mesa rig... it might bring that something extra without getting a whole new rig.

 

[Jrussblues]

It’s trial and error. If you like the amp and can snag one up then do it. It’s okay to rethink your rig, that’s the only way you will find the sound you want.

 

[Bass4Brkfast]

I used to own one of those silverface Bassman Ten amps...mine had been chopped up and made into a head, so I used it with other cabinets than the original.
It sounded lovely: lots of clarity and low-mid heft.
During some tough times I sold it, like an idiot (instead of selling a kidney or a cornea, like a sensible human would).
I still miss it.

 

[mikewalker]

Ah.. Fender used to RULE, back in the 70s! I played the silverface bassman 10 combo in junior high school (the school owned it, along with the 74 P-bass they let me borrow for all of grade 9). "Played out" at some regional jazz band festivals and it was plenty loud and fat sounding.

Then in the Sr. high school jazz ensemble (in a different city) they had big Standell amps for the rhythm section at school, but when we went down to California for a tour - Oregon, L.A., Knott's Berry Farm, Escondido (Carvin Factory Tour!), and San Diego (grand finale on the Queen Mary Ballroom) - our "touring' backline was the same silverface Fender combos (4-10 for bass, twin for guitar, and the Rhodes piano had it's own suitcase amp).

When I finally got to the university jazz ensemble - it was a whole different story: the backline there was all Orange (the older ones with the gigantic knobs, which I thought was very cool... the only amps with bigger knobs than those were the Gibson LAB series, and some pretty rare Garnets)

By the early-80s, every 50-watt bassman amp around our neck of the woods had been relegated to guitar duty, bass had moved on to the next level...

 

[kleinenenten]

I'm in the minority, but I've had the opposite experience. I LOVE my solid state amps, and tried a tube amp a few years ago. It was an old 70's SVT. I was shocked that it did nothing for me. It seemed less punchy, slower to react, and the lows were mushier and less articulate. Overall, it told me that I DIDN'T want that sort of amp. Of course, do whatever works for you! But there's nothing wrong with deciding what you have works. As long as it's a quality amp that does what you need, that's all that matters.

 

[Killing Floor]

On a bass where there is often a greater demand for power I don't mind a hybrid or tube preamp in front.
But I would not touch a solid state guitar amp. There are some really good ones but there's nothing like that blossom.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Played a bar gig last night where I usually have to bring my own rig, but new ownership has some house gear. Blown away by the difference in feel! Was like the notes just sprung out of the amp. Mind you, only an amateur player, so experience is limited.

It wasn't even a highly regarded amp from what I've read on here today - a Fender Bassman Ten, Silverface 70's vintage, hefty 4x10 combo. Primarily a guitar amp, only 50 watts, but in that venue I feel like that worked to its advantage because the channel and master volumes were up high, and we all know tubes like the workout.

Now I'm re-evaluating my whole setup. My rig is no slouch, Mesa Subway WD800 with matching 210 cab. But is it "too much rig for the gig"? Am I not running it where it needs to be to give the same snap? Am I too caught up in all the tone shaping capabilities and diluting things rather than enhancing? Realistically, I'm not about to go snap up a 100 pound tube amp to lug around, but I think I've now "crossed the chasm" where the feel and responsiveness have creeped to the top of the priority pile.

So, I guess this was more of a statement than discussion inducing. But an opportunity to play on something I wouldn't have otherwise had has upped the inspiration level and was a valuable learning experience (or at least a quest for new knowledge) that I thought I'd share. That happen to anyone else?

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