- Jan 29, 2008
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- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
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Fixing a neck... is this a video good or not?
- Thread starter Ric5
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- bass neck bowed repair rickenbacker
Following your progress and frustrations Ric5. I'm picking up a 2x4 and some clamping tools from a friend to try the same on a rather old (1975) and very stubborn neck.
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
I have this frankensteined SG bass here 32" scale 5 strings on a 4 string neck … the neck sat around uninstalled for years with the truss rod tightened. When I finally installed the neck I had to loosen the truss rod completely … and the neck with 5 string is almost flat.
and this one here the truss rod is broken but the neck is fine … the action is a little high but it plays good, looks good, and sounds good
and this one here the truss rod is broken but the neck is fine … the action is a little high but it plays good, looks good, and sounds good
Great video as mentioned.
Honestly I don't think the time spent backbowed is the key, but rather how far you'll backbow the neck in the clamps.
If you plan on leaving the neck clamped for a long period of time, I think its only really beneficial if some low level heat is also applied.
Funny enough I started doing this based on an article I read from Dan that was in a book I got when I first started playing. No video but the article stated "clamp neck into a strong back bow" which in my head means the neck should be clamped almost to the point where its scares ya lol. It does sometime take a try or two.
Good luck!
Honestly I don't think the time spent backbowed is the key, but rather how far you'll backbow the neck in the clamps.
If you plan on leaving the neck clamped for a long period of time, I think its only really beneficial if some low level heat is also applied.
Funny enough I started doing this based on an article I read from Dan that was in a book I got when I first started playing. No video but the article stated "clamp neck into a strong back bow" which in my head means the neck should be clamped almost to the point where its scares ya lol. It does sometime take a try or two.
Good luck!
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
I was wondering about the heat thing …
and this is not a cheap bass so I don't want to push it so far into back bow that something breaks.
as per the time … wood has a "memory" and maybe if it clamped down into backbow for a long time then will the "memory" of the wood be changed?
also maybe the front bow is simply the wood reverting back to its natural state.
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- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
I bought this bass here in 1973. It had front bow so bad it looked like a ski jump.
but fortunately I found a bass tech who knew how to adjust the old style Rickenbacker truss rods. And once it was adjusted in 1973 it never got another adjustment. But that neck never did flatten out .
but fortunately I found a bass tech who knew how to adjust the old style Rickenbacker truss rods. And once it was adjusted in 1973 it never got another adjustment. But that neck never did flatten out .
Thats a beauty! I have a 73 as well but its a December 73, so all the desirable specs aren't there lol I still love it though.
Yeah I wouldn't go too crazy clamping it back, but do so enough where if you sight the neck while its clamped, its a significant enough back bow to be seen, or if you put a straightedge on the board, it give a good rock back and forth.
Heating a neck is not in my wheelhouse. I've heard some luthiers say the heat helps relax the wood fibers and realign things, and I've heard a few others say that its actually the heating and cooling of the glue joint between neck and fretboard that allows the neck to realign itself. I say the former makes more sense but I thankfully haven't had to deal with too stubborn of a neck.
I say stay the course of letting it sit for a while, it certainly can't hurt anything.
Turnaround
Commercial User
I don't understand. If the neck already has a back bow, your clamping is the opposite of what it should be - you should be inducing front bow with the clamps.
If indeed you are trying to induce backbow, your clamping method is OK. But necks develop a "set" after long periods of time, or if the wood was not fully seasoned before it was made into a neck. In the first case clamping alone will take about as long as it took for the neck to develop its set in the first place. So it if took 5 years to develop a bow, it will take 5 years under reverse bow to develop a set in that direction. Leaving a neck in clamps overnight may give a very temporary fix, but it won't last. What will help it along and speed up the re-bending process is heat. Heat will soften the bond between the fibres of the wood and allow them to realign in a new configuration. Otherwise only time will allow the fibres to re-align. And that process unaided is slow. It can take years.
The second case (improperly seasoned wood) will not take well to a simple reverse clamping. In this case even prolonged clamping may not give a long-term solution. Steaming or dry heat is the method to use.
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I tried clamping two necks without heat and neither really responded to that. I put a clothes iron set on polyesters (medium?) heat with a 1/8" thick, 1.5" wide, ~36" long aluminum strip sitting on the frets. The aluminum strip helped distribute the heat. I also released the tension on the truss rod while heating. This process worked well. Don't over bend it as you can put too much backbow in the neck, too.
Initially, I set the iron for the lowest setting and let it sit on the center of the neck for ~20 minutes. I removed the iron and let it cool over night while clamped in the backbowed position. That didn't do much, so I increased the temperature to the polyester setting. That may be medium to medium low on your iron. It is the lowest among the "steam" range of heat settings on my iron. I did not use steam, just dry heat. Anyhow, you could feel that the back of the neck was very warm and the aluminum was hot to the touch. Let it sit for a half hour and let it stay clamped until the neck was cool.
I did this to the neck above from an Aria Pro beater to test and then to a nicer Fender neck. You may want to be a bit more conservative with that Ric, but the heat definitely worked to get rid of forward bow.
Initially, I set the iron for the lowest setting and let it sit on the center of the neck for ~20 minutes. I removed the iron and let it cool over night while clamped in the backbowed position. That didn't do much, so I increased the temperature to the polyester setting. That may be medium to medium low on your iron. It is the lowest among the "steam" range of heat settings on my iron. I did not use steam, just dry heat. Anyhow, you could feel that the back of the neck was very warm and the aluminum was hot to the touch. Let it sit for a half hour and let it stay clamped until the neck was cool.
I did this to the neck above from an Aria Pro beater to test and then to a nicer Fender neck. You may want to be a bit more conservative with that Ric, but the heat definitely worked to get rid of forward bow.
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
hey … thanks for that … I was afraid the heat could loosen the glue … it this a possibility?
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
I watched these videos and the one you found above before doing it myself:
I think that the point is to both soften the glue between the fretboard and neck and (extreme speculation with no scientific justification>) to soften the lignin in the structure of the wood while bent in a back bow. Heating at a low temperature slightly softens both the glue and lignins without breaking down the structures. Allowing them to cool and become stiff again in the bent position resets some of the forward bow. I am sure you could heat them too much or too long and add too much backbow to the neck. I only did short intervals of heating and would suggest being gentle.
Good luck!
Joe Konkoly is excellent.
A male plug to male plug extension cable is a flagrant code violation. OSHA would have a field day with this one.
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
Hmmm … I just had a crazy idea …
I have the neck clamped up pulling it into backbow … I could put the whole thing into my SUV on a hot summer day here in Denver and leave the SUV in the sun for a few hours. I am not sure that will be enough heat … but what the heck it just might do it.
It will probably get to be at least 120 degrees in the car …. maybe 2 or 3 hours would do the trick?
I have the neck clamped up pulling it into backbow … I could put the whole thing into my SUV on a hot summer day here in Denver and leave the SUV in the sun for a few hours. I am not sure that will be enough heat … but what the heck it just might do it.
It will probably get to be at least 120 degrees in the car …. maybe 2 or 3 hours would do the trick?
PVA (white) glue will soften around 175F. Aliphatic resin (yellow) glue releases at ~210F. Heat pressing works best when the glue bond between the fingerboard and the neck release.
Unlikely that the interior of your car gets that hot.
Unlikely that the interior of your car gets that hot.
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With the neck clamped and back bowed, at what point of the back bow might the truss rod be in its max extension? That's where I would like to tighten the nut, and then provide some relief (if needed) when the string load is there.
After the neck cools overnight, tighten the truss rod nut before releasing the clamps. If the job was successful the truss rod will hold the neck in a back bow. Or somewhere between a relaxed back bow to straight. Then adjusting is a breeze.
Don't be surprised that the entire procedure needs to be repeated a few times.
Don't be surprised that the entire procedure needs to be repeated a few times.
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
OK update.
I had the neck clamped into backbow for 2 weeks … no heat.
Without strings the neck was in backbow. with strings a slight relief. this neck may never straighten out, but it is a lot better.
I had the neck clamped into backbow for 2 weeks … no heat.
Without strings the neck was in backbow. with strings a slight relief. this neck may never straighten out, but it is a lot better.
