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Fodera low B string

#21
I had 2 Foderas. A Yin Yang Standard 5 and an Emperor Standard 5 fretless. I quite liked Fodera strings for a bit while I had them. Yin Yang felt really good with a .130 B but wasn’t super punchy. Oddly, the .136 B from a set of TIJF’s was simply amazing sounding but I hated the limp noodle feel. Emperor fretless felt and sounded great with a .125 B but was utterly lifeless with a .120 or .130.

I suspect it was the neck woods. Yin Yang was a 3 piece maple neck and the Emperor fretless was a 1 piece oak. God I miss that Emperors fretless tone. It was truly special.
 
#23
galore said:
Today I had the chance to play a few different Fodera Emperors for the first time. Knowing their reputation and other people’s feedback on Foderas I had high expectations.

All were 5 stringed, one standard, one classic and two others I am unfamiliar with, but they were priced higher, with maple woods and gold hardware. 3 of them had the same preamp layout (Pope 3-band eq) while the fourth one was different. One had EMGs, other 3 had Fodera/Duncans. I played them long enough to get a good feeling what they are like, I switched them around to compare them as much as possible. The amp used was Glockenklang Steamhammer through some Glockenklang cabinet, with eq off.

What I really liked about Emperors was the general build quality, they all felt really good, refined when picked up and played, regardless of wood combinations. They all had great fingerboards, although very wide for my taste. They all sounded powerful and punchy on E to G strings and playing on these strings was as expected.

What I really disliked was the low B string on all of them. The cheapest one in price, the standard, had the best low B between them, but even this one was not what I was expecting from an $8500 bass. Low B just felt dead, different from higher strings on all 4 basses. Lacking punch, buzzing, very flabby. I had to play them with a significantly lighter touch to avoid them choking and that had no punch, it was just some undefined rumble.

Now it might be the strings, poor setup on all of them (unlikely?) and/or the amp that I haven’t used before. I noticed that low B string was not in tune while E to G strings were - and that was the same on all 4 basses. It also seems unlikely that 4 different basses would have similarly poor setups.

Is this just the way Foderas are and I was expecting too much? Are Foderas made in such a way to have low Bs so loose? I had Alleva Coppolo in the past and from my memory the low B on that bass was much better. It was disappointing as everything else about these Emperors was amazing. Am I missing something here?
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Just something to consider........
If you are shopping for sound, I'd recommend Alembic. Their 5's are equal in tone and punch to the E's on their 4 string. Certaining the best I've owned though I don't consider myself a 5 player any more, still recognise its capability.
 
#25
I have heard the density of the wood choices plays into the awesomeness of a B string. I have one fender jazz 5, not the best B with a swamp ash body...lighter wood. My Stingray Ray 5 with an alder body is amazballs
 
#26
you know it’s against the TOS on talkbass to ever speak negatively about Fodera.

Anyways, Ive owned many Foderas over the years and the B string has never been very good and thats trying dozens of string manufacturers and gauges. all my 35 inch scale 5s hit very nice
 
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#27
I remember going to a huge German store that carries a lot of boutique basses among other things. I remember playing a Fodera that had a terrible B string but not as terrible as a Smith that they were also selling. Both basses were properly set-up.

I talked to the owner about this and also asked him how on earth are they going to sell these basses (to which he didn't answer). To my surprise both basses were sold in a matter of weeks.

The takeaway from this anecdote for me was that probably most builders are going to build a lemon now and then. Another thing that I try to keep in mind is that a lot of people who buy these basses are not professionals or even highly trained. So trust your ears.
 
#28
ClassicJazz said:
I have an Emperor Standard and no issues with the B string whatsoever! Could be the setup or the strings. I know .130 are a common B string size, but I run with a .125 B string. I find on any 5 string bass a .130 string is not as punchy.

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I'm sold on a 125 B string. To me, it was always counterintuitive to go lighter than 130 for the B string. But now I play two different 34" scale five strings, using 125 Bs on both and they sound killer - very clear, focused, integrated-sounding with the rest of the strings, better than with the 130s.
 
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#29
Fodera did acknowledge some QC issues on the low B strings in their sets in the past so I wonder if that had a part to play? I do sometimes find one dead string in a set, regardless of the manufacturer. Bad setup is also a thing. Over the years I've owned six Fodera 5- or 6-strings and all of them had stellar low Bs.

Regarding setup, one thing that seems to be often overlooked is the twisting of the string along its longitudinal axis. This is a known issue with DB strings and causes poor fundamental and odd overtones and frequency beating. I believe this applies to EB strings as well so I'm careful about having as little longitudinal tension as possible.

Case in point - I recently got my Sadowsky NYC 5-24 PJ back from a Plek and re-string done at a very reputable shop and whichever tech strung it up didn't take much care because sure enough, the low B was warbly and weird. I loosened the B, released the tension on the ball end at the bridge, and it sounded much better. Not perfect but much, much better. I went through that set quickly as I was rehearsing and playing outdoor gigs every night of the week. As soon as I changed the set the way I normally do it, the low B came back into laser focus as I am accustomed to. Just sayin', it's not always the instrument's fault.
 
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#31
Id put money on it being the strings and the store environment. Every time I go into a music store, 90% of the basses have a wonky setup and I end up encountering some dead sounding strings, particularly basses being hung up a bit higher on the wall, which exposes them to more extreme temperature shifts. I've played 35" scale basses in stores with completely dead noodle B strings, meanwhile my Rickenbacker (33.25") is setup in A with a 130 and rings like a piano. Everything usually points to strings and setup.
 
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#32
Yeah, B strings can be tricky. In addition to making sure the string isn't twisted you also want to make sure there's a good bend at the witness point on the saddle.

When I received my new Sadowsky NYC I was initially quite disheartened when the B string sounded airy and... bad. That's an expensive disappointment! It took me a few minutes to spot the problem at the saddle and once I gave it a good push downwards it sounded great!
 
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#33
The first thing I do with a new bass is new strings and a set up.
Invariably improves the bass.
Unfortunately store basses out on the hanger don't get the constant required attention, although at this pricepoint, you'd assume they would.

Last shop listing Fodera's had them locked away and when I asked where they were...listed on website... they offered to get them out for me.
I wasn't in that market, so I didn't put them to that trouble.

But in general, I find most store basses are not set up too well.
 
#34
IME the B-strings degrade faster than the other strings. The thicker the string, the quicker it looses definition and high end. So ... most of my basses have dead B-Strings and questionable E-strings whith the other strings being still acceptable.
Maybe this can play a role, too.

Except Dingwall. Even dead B-Strings sound good on those.
 
#35
mr80htz said:
I have heard the density of the wood choices plays into the awesomeness of a B string. I have one fender jazz 5, not the best B with a swamp ash body...lighter wood. My Stingray Ray 5 with an alder body is amazballs
Click to expand...
plenty of discussion on this subject but the experts and builders have narrowed it down to the neck/body joint and string tension....woods have little to nothing to do with the B string sound
 
#37
I have had 4 Fodera's. Two 4's and two 5's.
On my small sample, the 4's were better and the low B on the 5's were average. Not bad per se, but not particularly good. Which can lead to disappointment at this price point.
 
#38
Kinda a weird take here….. but I feel like Fodera’s have to be coaxed to get the most out of their B strings. I’ve always had to play that string lighter than others for it to not sound floppy. Granted mine is a 33” but I’m very happy with the sound of my B on my six
 
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#39
ClassicJazz said:
I know .130 are a common B string size, but I run with a .125 B string. I find on any 5 string bass a .130 string is not as punchy.
Click to expand...

Interesting. I found exactly the opposite! Definitely feel that the .130 is both punchier and more balanced with the rest of the string set.
Then again, all my basses with low B strings also have 35" scale length, so not really apples-to-apples.

To OP: I once owned a 5-string bass with exactly the same symptoms that you describe: E through G strings sounded firm, full, punchy, balanced...and then that low B string sounded anemic, weak, no solid fundamental, lacking in the same full harmonic content as the other strings. The only successful solution I eventually came up with was
- get an entirely new body, bridge, pickups, and electronics; and
- restring it EADGC
Sounds great now! :)

But yeah, I can definitely understand finding one bass -- by any manufacturer -- with that problem. Finding all the basses by Fodera in your local store with that problem makes me think there's something else going on, it's not a Fodera thing.
 
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