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For Tequila Lovers

#183
aborgman said:
Sure there is... and that good reason is that there is no price more inexpensive than "free".

I'll agree that there is no good reason to buy a mixto.
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I still disagree: Just because it is free doesn't make it any more pleasant or enjoyable to drink. I'll just have a beer instead, thanks.

aborgman said:
I'd say that holds true in about 99.9% of cases. I've actually had a select few puros that were just plain awful. Cuervo Gold kinda awful.
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I disagree here, too, but that 0.01% just ain't worth fighting over. :cool:
 
#186
Lobster11 said:
I still disagree: Just because it is free doesn't make it any more pleasant or enjoyable to drink. I'll just have a beer instead, thanks.
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I'll take a free beer anytime.

Now - there are tequilas (and beers) I won't drink even for free... But I don't think Sauza Silver is THAT bad.



I disagree here, too, but that 0.01% just ain't worth fighting over. :cool:
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By and large, I'll take any puro over a mix to - but when I was tasting piles of puros while in Mexico, there were a few that we're just plain nasty.
 
#189
Akami said:
Just finding out more all the time and if you can list some of these inexpensive puros I'll go out and try to find some of them to try.
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Pricing and availability vary so much by region and by state that it's difficult to make such recommendations, but in terms of my own local prices and availability I would suggest:

1. At the cheapest price point -- about the same price as Cuervo's "Especial" pseudo-tequila -- try Camarena. Not terribly exciting, but surprisingly smooth and drinkable for the price.

2. For just a few bucks more, Espolon. Much more complex and interesting, and my current personal fave in the bang-for-the-buck category. Hornitos (made by Sauza) is also good at about the same price point.

In all these cases I prefer the blancos to the respective reposados, but I'm admittedly biased toward blancos and you shouldn't hesitate to try the repos if you don't share that bias.

Another way we could do this is that you could stop by your favorite local store and jot down some names and prices of what they have available. If you'll post that info, I (and I'm sure others) would be happy to chime in and offer some recommendations....
 
#190
Since some recent posts have brought up the issue of beer preferences and coffee preferences, and previous posters have mentioned whiskies and other liquors, I feel compelled to get on my high horse again about something. Please bear with me, but I just can't help myself....

When it comes to coffee, beer, wine, whisky (or whiskey), and so forth -- and for that matter basses and amps (this is TalkBass, after all) -- there is plenty of room for lots of variability in tastes and preferences. And this variability is, for the most part, just that: personal tastes and preferences.

In Tequila World, however, there is a unique distinction that has no parallel in any of those other worlds: the difference between tequila that is made 100% de agave versus (so-called) "tequila" that is 51% de agave and 49% de god-knows-what. Even a terrible cup of coffee, or beer, or glass of whiskey, is at least 100% coffee, or beer, or whiskey. Even a crappy bass guitar is 100% bass guitar, not half bass guitar and half coffee table. In my opinion, any tequila that is not 100% de agave simply does not count as "tequila" and is not worthy of consideration. Once we reduce the field to puros, though, I am all for people liking what they like and not liking what they don't.

OK, I feel better now. Thanks for indulging me....
 
#191
Lobster11 said:
In Tequila World, however, there is a unique distinction that has no parallel in any of those other worlds:
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I agree - but...

There is 'real' (Arabica) coffee and there are cheaper blends with Robusto.

Even Bourbons, which I love, need be by law, only 51% corn. The rest falls into your 'God-knows-what' bin. The best use way more than 51% corn, and good quality GNW for the rest.

So I definitely agree with you - only 100% agave 'puro' is worthy of distinction unless as an aside we happen to mention a Mezcal. I proved this recently, when the Sauza Gold (on sale and suitable for its intended purpose) was fine for marinating a turkey, but not quite drinkable on its own. One shot of that was all I could take, and I dumped the rest.

Maestro Doble for the rest of the night ;-)
 
#194
Lobster11 said:
Since some recent posts have brought up the issue of beer preferences and coffee preferences, and previous posters have mentioned whiskies and other liquors, I feel compelled to get on my high horse again about something. Please bear with me, but I just can't help myself....

When it comes to coffee, beer, wine, whisky (or whiskey), and so forth -- and for that matter basses and amps (this is TalkBass, after all) -- there is plenty of room for lots of variability in tastes and preferences. And this variability is, for the most part, just that: personal tastes and preferences.

In Tequila World, however, there is a unique distinction that has no parallel in any of those other worlds: the difference between tequila that is made 100% de agave versus (so-called) "tequila" that is 51% de agave and 49% de god-knows-what. Even a terrible cup of coffee, or beer, or glass of whiskey, is at least 100% coffee, or beer, or whiskey. Even a crappy bass guitar is 100% bass guitar, not half bass guitar and half coffee table. In my opinion, any tequila that is not 100% de agave simply does not count as "tequila" and is not worthy of consideration. Once we reduce the field to puros, though, I am all for people liking what they like and not liking what they don't.

OK, I feel better now. Thanks for indulging me....
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Mmmm...

Coffee - arabica beans vs. rubusto vs. a few others?? All 100% coffee?

Wheat beers? Beers that don't meet Reinheitsgebot? Beers made without malt? All 100% beer?

In my opinion any coffee that isn't pure arabica beans isn't really coffee, and beers made with anything other than malted barely and hops aren't really beers....
 
#195
Wow, while everyone else is weighing in, in life, I'll have what is in front of me and generally enjoy it. For years I played in expensive hotels and restaurants, but even then I could be at a friends house and enjoy macaroni and cheese.

Not sure what the resistance to Starbucks is other than that they're successful and having made espressos in a small cafe at work for years I know that the customers that came in always seemed happy. Well I liked the espresso I made, but if I went to Starbucks, I think it was just a little bit better, and for less than $2. My favorite espresso ever is from a place that buys their own beans and roasts them onsite and I'd have it all the time if it was handy to do so, but to tell the truth, I don't think I'm so special as to have nothing but the finest, and I think it can be a dangerous place to go, placing oneself as royalty.

I'm picky about my musical equipment and mics too, but if I'm at a jam session and I see the dreaded SM-58, I can still sing and enjoy myself.

Like many others here, I've found that I prefer blancos, but unlike a lot of you, I've yet to find one that I enjoy sipping and am curious to see if I can. When I hear about someone really enjoying something it's just natural to wonder if finding the right one will give me the same kind of enjoyment, but at the end of the day, if I never become a connoisseur of tequila I'll still have shots, preferably blancos, and if someone gets me a shot of Jose Cuervo, I'll just ask for some salt and toast to them.

Beer is a whole different subject to me and I think the only way I've ever been able to enjoy it is in pancake batter, but I don't think there's anything wrong with others enjoying something I find incomprehensible, because we're all different, especially when it comes to outlooks.

It's fun to read about others preferences and contemplate why we have them, but really, put a cup of coffee in front of me, I'll say thanks and drink it; beer and I'll ask if I can have some whisky, or even water instead; tequila and again, I'll say thanks and drink it.

Back to tequila specific talk, I bought a small bottle of the Camarena this last summer and found it to be okay, but there was one I tried about a year ago called Camaro that seemed to me to be pretty good and I've never seen it again. I even took a picture of the bottle to remember what it was.

The Hornitos is definitely on my radar to give a try, but just one more inquiry, what would be the absolutely best sipping tequila for someone who like 1942, but still doesn't think of it as something that would be enjoyable to sip?
 
#196
aborgman said:
In my opinion any coffee that isn't pure arabica beans isn't really coffee, and beers made with anything other than malted barely and hops aren't really beers....
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Water-free beer tends to be a little dry, and yeast-free beer tends to be a little flat ;) In fact, the original Reinheitsgebot missed out on yeast as well, so there are no beers that actually comply with the letter of the law.

edit: A small amount (10-20%) of robusta is a traditional component of espresso blends.
 
#197
aborgman said:
Lately it has been Mighty Good (a local roaster) Guatemala Antigua Flor de Cafe or Costa Rican Hacienda Rio Negro.

I'm a big fan of Chiapas Alturas in general - my favorite ever is probably Blue Bag, and the best I've had that is currently available in the USA is Ruta Maya.
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You'll need to hook me up with your local roaster, and I'll hook you up with a couple local to me. I am usually a fan of Guatemalan coffee, so the Antigua intrigues me. Is that single origin?

-Mike
 
#198
Akami said:
Not sure what the resistance to Starbucks is other than that they're successful and having made espressos in a small cafe at work for years I know that the customers that came in always seemed happy.
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Starbucks espresso drinks aren't bad.

Their coffee on the other hand is invariably WAY over roasted. Their "light" roast is really about a dark roast, and their dark roast is just plain burnt.
 
#200
Several folks have suggested analogues to the mixto-puro distinction in other beverages, but I still maintain that there is a qualitative difference when it comes to tequila. "Bourbon" must contain a certain minimal percentage of corn; "rye whiskey" must contain a certain minimal amount of rye, and so forth -- but in all of these cases the "other stuff" is other grains. You might like rye whiskey more or less than corn whiskey, or malt whiskey more or less than grain whiskey, but it's still all whiskey. Similarly, you might like the taste of coffee made from arabica beans more or less than that made from robusta beans, but it's still all "coffee." In contrast, the non-agave distillate in a mixto tequila is typically sugar cane -- which means that the fermented and distilled product that results is essentially, er, rum. So drinking a mixto tequila is essentially compable to mixing a drink for yourself that is half puro tequila, and half the-cheapest-unaged-rum-you-can find. To my mind, that's a "mixed drink" that should be given its own name -- maybe something like, say, "The Nauseator" or "The Dry Heave" or "The Hangover Machine." With all due respect to our cousins south of the border, I just don't think it should be called "tequila."

And here's an interesting little factoid I just came across this morning: By Mexican law, the 49% of the juice in a mixto that doesn't come from the Weber blue agave plant cannot include any other kind of agave: It has to come from a non-agave source (such as sugar cane or corn). If a mixto were made from 51% Weber blue agave, and 49% from some other inferior kind of agave, I'd agree that a mixto is analogous to, say, arabica vs. robusta coffee. But that's not how mixto tequilas are made.

The singlest best analogue I can think of to the mixto-puro distinction is in the beer world, specifically with respect to homebrewed beer. These days it is easy and relatively inexpensive to acquire barley malt for homebrewing, but before that was the case the most popular method for homebrewing beer involved using a half-and-half mixture of barley malt and cane sugar for the fermentables. This made it a lot cheaper to brew your own beer, but if you've ever tasted homebrew made that way you'll know why nobody in their right mind does it that way anymore.

The defense rests.
 

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