Fretless players -- Lines or no lines?

[Tony G]

If that's how YOU feel, then it's good FOR YOU to go unlined. Seriously. It's a personal choice. But all you have to do is look around to see that your own preferences can't possibly apply to everybody. My experience and observation, along with that of others, says that your opinion, expressed as a general rule, is just flat out wrong. As your personal preference, it's not wrong at all. As a general statement about what's better for everybody else, it is.

That is all I was trying to say. Is this a thread that asked for peoples "general rules", or is it just another useless opinion thread on talkbass? I vote for the latter...

 

[spade2you]

I don't think I really fit in either category. I am unlined, but I have a fully dotted top of the fingerboard. It's almost like I have lines, but the fingerboard is blank. I have tried lines and they don't work for me. I always want to center my finger on the line instead of exactly behind the line. I can never sound right on a lined fretless.

The whole not looking thing might apply to upright playing, but the 40"+ scale and dull sound translates into lots of forgiveness in the intonation. The headstock and body heels allow the upright player to have a natural feel for the 7 positions that you can play. When playing an electric bass, we don't have very many physical "land marks" to use and develop muscle memory. If I got blindfolded, I wouldn't be able to tell the 5th position from the 7th position very well untill I played either the right or wrong note and ajusted from there.

Honestly, I don't care what other people use. I have what I need and that's all that matters to me. Just be sure to protect your ears. I remember a kinda old dude telling me that earplugs were for pussys. When he started messing around on a fretless, his intonation sounded like was....deaf.

 

[Bryan R. Tyler]

I think there's one thing everyone can agree on- side dots should be placed at the point of intonaton on all fretless basses, NOT in-between the lines as they are on most lined fretlesses. Am I right?

 

[jasonbraatz]

I agree. Aside from the looks aspect having lines does nothing to hurt, and can definitely help you in some situations.

No matter how long you've played, there can still be days where your muscle memory just isn't working right, or you can't hear yourself.

 

[spade2you]

I think there's one thing everyone can agree on- side dots should be placed at the point of intonaton on all fretless basses, NOT in-between the lines as they are on most lined fretlesses. Am I right?

I wish every bass company did this standard. Well, works for me anyway.

 

[Scottgun]

Wow. Didn't think this would be that contentious.

I like no lines for the look and the fact that I used to play acoustic bass and am used to that look. If I had lines on my fretless, it would seem like they would be taunting me all the time. I have no complaints about someone who wants them, but I am adamant they aren't on mine. When I special ordered my Bongo Fretless, they guy tried to tell me it only came lined. Needless to say I was on the horn with the Ernie Ball company getting the info and setting the dealer straight. Yes! Bongo's do come unlined. They use a nine-digit code: XXXXX43XX. The 43 is for unlined in case anyone wants to know.


I'm not convinced of the lines being necessary when it is difficult to hear because the side dots are adequet for that imho.

Here's Jaco looking at his fingerboard:




If I every play as well as him, then I will render an opinion on the look/no look controversy.



Scott

 

[keb]

I've owned both lined and unlined, and I think lined works out better for me. Unlined does look cooler though.

And the "bad habit" of looking at your fingerboard: hogwash. I guess all those pro classical guitarists and pianists I've seen looking at their respective boards while playing are bad players!

 

[Richard Lindsey]

I think there's one thing everyone can agree on- side dots should be placed at the point of intonaton on all fretless basses, NOT in-between the lines as they are on most lined fretlesses. Am I right?

I dunno if even that is a given. Mine aren't on the lines but between them, and it doesn't really matter to me. I kind of expect dots to be between intonation spots rather than on them anyway, so I don't find it disorienting. If I played unlined, though, I think I'd want the side dots in the spots you suggest.

 

[Throckmorten]

Can we make this a sticky some place?

Maybe start a "Dead Horse" forum and direct all the endless discussion subjects there.

Or maybe just revive this thread every 3 months and everyone can pretend it's new.

 

[ClassicJazz]

I wish every bass company did this standard. Well, works for me anyway.

I like that!!

 

[Richard Lindsey]

That is all I was trying to say. Is this a thread that asked for peoples "general rules", or is it just another useless opinion thread on talkbass? I vote for the latter...

This is a general rule (from your posts):

"I feel that lines are like training wheels, and I simply think that you will learn to balance yourself a bit quicker falling off a bike a couple of times without training wheels rather than riding around for a year or two with them."

This, OTOH, is an expression of a personal preference:

"I learned to play without lines, and that is what works for me."

I don't have any beef with the second; no sensible person would IMO. I just disagree with the first.

 

[Richard Lindsey]

Maybe start a "Dead Horse" forum and direct all the endless discussion subjects there.

Excellent idea.

 

[Blake Bass]

When you listen to a recording of a fretless bassist can you hear if his bass is lined or unlined? I think not. So it really comes down to asthetics and comfort for each individual. The bottm line is good tone, time, and intonation. Does it really matter how the player achieves that?

 

[Tony G]

This is a general rule (from your posts):

"I feel that lines are like training wheels, and I simply think that you will learn to balance yourself a bit quicker falling off a bike a couple of times without training wheels rather than riding around for a year or two with them."

This, OTOH, is an expression of a personal preference:

"I learned to play without lines, and that is what works for me."

I don't have any beef with the second; no sensible person would IMO. I just disagree with the first.

I still feel that everything I've said here is my opinion and nothing more. I'm not trying to "convert" anybody to my way of thinking. You play a fretless with lines, and I don't. Big deal....

 

[MobileHolmes]

Both of mine (soon to just be one) have lines. I don't look much, but it is reassuring to have some reference to get you in the ballpark, especially up a little higher.

 

[i_got_a_mohawk]

for me it depends on the wood. rosewood? lined. anything else? unlined. btw love the mm

Thanks

BS.

The whole "don't look at your instrument while playing" is a fallacy established by rockers who thought it looked cooler to stare at the crowd and holds no water in nearly any other musical genre.

I dont think its BS at all, when i play, fretted or fretless, the vast majority of the time i look at the bass, its at the SIDE of the neck, and unlined basses (mine anyways) still has the placement dots at the side.

 

[Bryan R. Tyler]

I dont think its BS at all, when i play, fretted or fretless, the vast majority of the time i look at the bass, its at the SIDE of the neck, and unlined basses (mine anyways) still has the placement dots at the side.

You may have not read my post correctly- it was in response to xgabriel saying that looking at the fingerboard is a bad habit. If you're looking at the side of your fretboard, you are still looking at your fretboard, so you're kind of proving my point.

 

[Gastambide]

I had my Ibanez Mini-Musician defretted years ago. Last year, I undertook a project to remove the lines that were left when the luthier splined the fingerboard with ebony. I actually painted the fingerboard (pearl dots and all) flat balck, then coated it with marine epoxy. Afterward, I touched up the "lines" on the side of the neck (they were still visible where the frets used to be) with bright white paint to provide highly visible side markers. The original dots are still there on the side from the days when the bass was fretted. It's now just as easy, in my opinion, to play in-tune as when the bass had the visible lines on the front of the fingerboard.

This is the best of both worlds for me - From the front, No lines, so it looks beautiful! From the side -all the reference you're likely to need in order to play in-tune.

 

[Joel B]

I agree.

 

[doctorjazz]

The first fretless I ever played (Warwick Streamer Stage I) was unlined. I liked it, but I had to move SLOWLY and there was a lot of "trial and error" with regards to exactly where the point of intonation was, especially past the 12th position. I played a lined fretless Jazz, and things went much more smoothly.

My first fretless will have lines, just to help me adapt more quickly. After that, no lines for me, because I prefer the look of an unlined board.