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Fretless playing question ...

David Sutkin

David Sutkin

“Bass Upfront” Founder
Commercial User
Apr 20, 2017
2,636
8,106
58
Brooklyn, NY
#1
Hey all,

I've recently purchased my first fretless bass after playing fretted basses for 30+ years.

Before I decided to invest big money into a high end axe, I bought a Squire VM fretless.
I noticed that to play in tune, I have to press down almost literally right on the fretline of the note I want to play and the following note .... Is this normal for fretless basses that have fret markers in the neck? Will I find this with pretty much any fretless I buy that has fret markers? ... If so I may consider returning the bass and buying one with no fret markers, just a plain unmarked neck.

Any feedback or advice on this would be appreciated - Thanks
 
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#2
14933057842561269740482.jpg
The tip of your finger should be roughly on the line, provided your instrument is correctly intonated. Try stopping (this is fretless so fretting is out!) the note with your fingernail or edge of a bank card on the octave line... Is it in tune with the open string?
Ultimately no-one will judge you on where your fingers go provided you are in tune...
 
Last edited:
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#6
SteveCS said:
View attachment 1118312 The tip of your finger should be roughly on the line, provided your instrument is correctly intonated. Try stopping (this is fretless so fretting is out!) the note with your fingernail or edge of a bank card on the octave line... Is it in tune with the open string?
Ultimately no-one will judge you on where your fingers go provided you are in tune...
Click to expand...


Thank you for posting this image.
 
#7
For me, the lines were a visual/mental problem, as I go back to fretted on other songs. I'm not quite good enough to play without visual reference, and I just couldn't wrap my head around stopping on the lines vs. between them.

My unlined fretless, Fender Imprecision Bass, has dots where the fretlines would be. That... I can figure out.
 
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#8
Engine207 said:
and I just couldn't wrap my head around stopping on the lines vs. between them.
Click to expand...

EXACTLY where I'm coming from. After 30 years of playing pretty much solidly right in the middle of the frets, now to all of a sudden need to play right up on the line (or pretty close) is going to require a learning curve. If I'm going to put the time in, I think it might be easier to just go with an unlined neck .... I was actually considering this beauty:
upload_2017-4-27_11-36-28.png
 

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#9
David Sutkin said:
Thank you for posting this image.
Click to expand...

Any time. It can be a daunting task picking up fretless, even after a long time playing on frets. The most important task is to learn to trust your ears and not get too hung up on where your fingers are in relation to the lines. In terms of setup, correct intonation is doubly important with fretless because it not only makes each string in tune with itself but makes the finger positions across string line up consistently. All of my fretlesses (bar 1) over the last 35 years have been unlined but the setup and listening aspects are equally important. Good luck...
 
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#10
David Sutkin said:
EXACTLY where I'm coming from. After 30 years of playing pretty much solidly right in the middle of the frets, now to all of a sudden need to play right up on the line (or pretty close) is going to require a learning curve. If I'm going to put the time in, I think it might be easier to just go with an unlined neck .... I was actually considering this beauty:
View attachment 1118365
Click to expand...

That looks like my Corvette's big brother...
DSC_0001_10.JPG

(any excuse to post another pic...)
 
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#12
David Sutkin said:
Do you love it?
Click to expand...

Yes. I do have a couple of niggles, for example access to the highest positions is restricted by the lower horn, amd I find the bass control centre frequency too low - I'd rather have more of a low mids control whereas this one just creates boom - but that's a personal thing, really. The tone, feel, sustain, weight, materials and build quality are flawless, as is the playability (other than at the top).
 
#13
SteveCS said:
Yes. I do have a couple of niggles, for example access to the highest positions is restricted by the lower horn, amd I find the bass control centre frequency too low - I'd rather have more of a low mids control whereas this one just creates boom - but that's a personal thing, really. The tone, feel, sustain, weight, materials and build quality are flawless, as is the playability (other than at the top).
Click to expand...

And I would prefer VV over blend/master, and I'd like a passive tone control for passive mode, but...
 
#16
SteveCS said:
View attachment 1118312 The tip of your finger should be roughly on the line, provided your instrument is correctly intonated. Try stopping (this is fretless so fretting is out!) the note with your fingernail or edge of a bank card on the octave line... Is it in tune with the open string?
Ultimately no-one will judge you on where your fingers go provided you are in tune...
Click to expand...

that pic seems to show the finger pads behind the lines..I was told they should be right on top of the line...

also..... is it possible to "tune & intonnate" a fretless so that it will be in tune IF your pads are behind the line , so visually it is like playing a fretted bass?
 
#17
David Sutkin said:
EXACTLY where I'm coming from. After 30 years of playing pretty much solidly right in the middle of the frets, now to all of a sudden need to play right up on the line (or pretty close) is going to require a learning curve. If I'm going to put the time in, I think it might be easier to just go with an unlined neck
Click to expand...

I don't think an unlined fretboard is going to be of much help here. My guess is,if you fret right in the middle of where fret markers would be, your intonation wrt open strings will be off; especially in the lower frets.

I'd advise you to put in the hours and change your left hand technique. It's really not that difficult -I had to do it when I got my first (lined) fretless and it took less effort than I'd foreseen- and I'd say my fretted playing also improved as a fringe benefit.
 
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#18
Engine207 said:
Interesting. I've converted all of my dual-pickup basses (except my Ric) to a VBT wiring setup. Easier for me to make small adjustments while playing.
Click to expand...

I suppose it's just what I'm used to. The vette is my first with a blend and I'm still not quite there yet, having had VVT since year dot on my dual-pickup basses. I miss the rolled back mixes you can only get with dual volumes amd that I could dial in quickly, but the vette is a monster in so many ways that my doubts are really disappearing fast...
 
#19
edencab said:
that pic seems to show the finger pads behind the lines..I was told they should be right on top of the line...

also..... is it possible to "tune & intonnate" a fretless so that it will be in tune IF your pads are behind the line , so visually it is like playing a fretted bass?
Click to expand...
Yes it is but the caveat is you have to play exactly where your fingers were at when intonating and gives more room for error because you are estimating where the middle would be. I did this with a fret less in high school because I was used to fretted basses so there was almost no transition in a sense. It is possible but not entirely effective
 

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