Future Impact now available!! WAS: deep impact reissue!!! interested?

[ole Jason]

I wonder if we'll be able to get organ/electric keyboard sounds like the EHX C9 or K9? It looks we'll have all of the parameters needed to get those sounds as long as the timbre is there.

 

[Adamixoye]

So to be clear on the MIDI expression, as of right now it doesn't respond to CC but it will respond to NRPN, but support for MIDI CC is planned?

 

[DELACIUS]

So to be clear on the MIDI expression, as of right now it doesn't respond to CC but it will respond to NRPN, but support for MIDI CC is planned?

Can you explain you question? I was wondering if Source Audio Reflex would work on Future Impact

 

[Adamixoye]

Can you explain you question? I was wondering if Source Audio Reflex would work on Future Impact

I'm trying to understand what @lokki is saying in this post:

all the communication (editing sounds, saving presets) is done via midi. so yes basically you can control all the parameters via midi. it's a special kind of midi though, called nrpn. basically it sends 3 cc values at once, the first two specifying the parameter and the last representing the value. so it really depends upon the bfc2000 controller, can it send nrpn messages or not? i don't know.

the implementation of normal midi cc messages for some parameters is planned.

The Reflex just uses normal MIDI CC, not NRPN. Having a CC number in the Future Impact that can control the expression would be ideal.

 

[lokki]

I'm trying to understand what @lokki is saying in this post:



The Reflex just uses normal MIDI CC, not NRPN. Having a CC number in the Future Impact that can control the expression would be ideal.

right, some parameters will be controllable by normal cc messages. right now it is only the volume (cc 7) but this list will grow.

 

[Adamixoye]

right, some parameters will be controllable by normal cc messages. right now it is only the volume (cc 7) but this list will grow.

Just curious, why not a CC for "master expression" as well? What's the advantage of NRPN?

 

[ProfFrink]

Just curious, why not a CC for "master expression" as well? What's the advantage of NRPN?

Yes, is there any reason not to use plain CCs for all these parameters? AFAIU this is what most pedals do, even for non-standard stuff. Please spare us the need for arcane MIDI translators or settings..,.

 

[ProfFrink]

Yes, is there any reason not to use plain CCs for all these parameters? AFAIU this is what most pedals do, even for non-standard stuff. Please spare us the need for arcane MIDI translators or settings..,.

Or maybe the use of RPN/NRPN allows for 16-bit precision for the parameters and CCs - only 8 bit...? This is about as far as my MIDI knowledge goes... I used to know all this stuff....

 

[sillyfabe]

Also, for a while I was wondering how this was going to fit in with my SY-300, right now I'm feeling like this covers the ground that the SY-300 doesn't---the FI will be for fat monophonic bass work, the SY-300 for polyphonic/ambient/guitar work.

EXACTLY what I was thinking! Plan on running the FI into the SY-300 that way I can layer the "FAT-analog" synth on top of "digital-ambient" synth

 

[lokki]

it is a much better way to have many parameters controlled. with the nrpn method you only use 3 cc's (or 4 with 14-bit precision) for more than 100 parameters. with normal cc's you would almost use the whole midi cc's available. some of them have special functions with midi gear and should not be used for other things. (midi volume, pitch-bend etc.) so for as many parameters as the f.i. has, nrpn is likely the only solution. 14bit precision is not used at the moment so that is not the reason.

but as i stated earlier, there will be some of the parameters controllable by normal cc messages. @Adamixoye what would be the "master expression"? i don't exactly understand what you mean by that. what would the master expression control?

one idea was/is to map all the controls of the f.i. pedal (the ones accessible from the front) to cc's. i would rather have a subset of the parameters controllable by normal cc messages (say 20 or 30). but this is not yet clear...

 

[Adamixoye]

it is a much better way to have many parameters controlled. with the nrpn method you only use 3 cc's (or 4 with 14-bit precision) for more than 100 parameters. with normal cc's you would almost use the whole midi cc's available. some of them have special functions with midi gear and should not be used for other things. (midi volume, pitch-bend etc.) so for as many parameters as the f.i. has, nrpn is likely the only solution. 14bit precision is not used at the moment so that is not the reason.

but as i stated earlier, there will be some of the parameters controllable by normal cc messages. @Adamixoye what would be the "master expression"? i don't exactly understand what you mean by that. what would the master expression control?

one idea was/is to map all the controls of the f.i. pedal (the ones accessible from the front) to cc's. i would rather have a subset of the parameters controllable by normal cc messages (say 20 or 30). but this is not yet clear...

Line6 and Eventide (Factor series/H9) do MIDI expression similarly. They both have a 1/4" expression jack, but you can use MIDI CC instead. For the Line6 the CC# is specified, for the Eventides you can select the CC.

In both cases, you can determine which parameters are controlled by the expression on a preset-by-preset basis. Those parameters might also controlled separately by CC, but the "expression" is still a master control in some sense.

So, on my H9, CC #11 is expression, and CC #22-31 correspond to parameters 1-10. On Preset #1, the expression might control parameters 2 and 3 (say, mix and pitch). On Preset #2, the expression might control just parameter 4. On Preset #3 it might control parameters 6 and 7, but 6 is in reverse and 7 only goes from 0 to 50%. Etc.

So it seems to me, as some who uses a lot of MIDI but has never programmed it, that whatever is being done with NRPN could be done with a single CC#, even simultaneous control of multiple parameters that have their own separate CC#'s.

 

[ProfFrink]

Line6 and Eventide (Factor series/H9) do MIDI expression similarly. They both have a 1/4" expression jack, but you can use MIDI CC instead. For the Line6 the CC# is specified, for the Eventides you can select the CC.

In both cases, you can determine which parameters are controlled by the expression on a preset-by-preset basis. Those parameters might also controlled separately by CC, but the "expression" is still a master control in some sense.

So, on my H9, CC #11 is expression, and CC #22-31 correspond to parameters 1-10. On Preset #1, the expression might control parameters 2 and 3 (say, mix and pitch). On Preset #2, the expression might control just parameter 4. On Preset #3 it might control parameters 6 and 7, but 6 is in reverse and 7 only goes from 0 to 50%. Etc.

So it seems to me, as some who uses a lot of MIDI but has never programmed it, that whatever is being done with NRPN could be done with a single CC#, even simultaneous control of multiple parameters that have their own separate CC#'s.

I don't know much about the Eventides, but I do know that the expression-pedal implementation on my M5 is superb.

Only thing is this: Doesn't it sort of rely on having a pretty elaborate display? E.g. on the M5 - when you start controlling stuff with the pedal you get 2 small notches on the display indicating the range and direction of the sweep and the display for each parameter also changes with the expr-pedal in real time. It doesn't look like the FI has a display detailed enough for all this...

 

[lokki]

ah i see. yes this was also one way i had in mind. preset based selection of expression pedal changeable values

 

[Adamixoye]

I don't know much about the Eventides, but I do know that the expression-pedal implementation on my M5 is superb.

Only thing is this: Doesn't it sort of rely on having a pretty elaborate display? E.g. on the M5 - when you start controlling stuff with the pedal you get 2 small notches on the display indicating the range and direction of the sweep and the display for each parameter also changes with the expr-pedal in real time. It doesn't look like the FI has a display detailed enough for all this...

Eventides work very similarly to the M5 as far as this goes. You raise a good point with the display, though certainly it could be accomplished in the editor.

 

[ProfFrink]

ah i see. yes this was also one way i had in mind. preset based selection of expression pedal changeable values

Yeah. The problem with RPNs is that it's really hard to find devices that will actually transmit them...

 

[lokki]

i know...i will talk to andras about this ideas.

 

[Dark Barn]

Filter cutoff will be the main parameter I will care about for expression control, others would be nice but this one will be vital for me.

 

[Dark Barn]

I don't think there is a hardware expression pedal that sends NRPN out there. My Liquid Foot controller doesn't even translate expression into NRPN (afaik) even though it is one of the most full featured MIDI foot controllers out there.

Like others have said already all you really need is the ability to set the destination(s) in the software editor of a single MIDI expression controller and 99% of us would be happy with that.

 

[Derpherper]

I feel I saw the possible price for the FI earlier in this thread.

 

[nshuman]

I feel I saw the possible price for the FI earlier in this thread.

1999 USD