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Genzler 4 on the Floor

#182
odarellmc said:
You don't think you're overloading the input of the mixer do you? Sounds like an input is being overloaded because as many have said they shouldn't sound like that..
Click to expand...
I want to say no, I am not overloading a mixer input for the following reasons.
1. I can see the visual display on the mixer and only show that I am pushing in the yellow during these weird parts that are heard on the video. I still have roughly 16 dB left of headroom
2. This sound still happens if I bring the gain on the mixer down.
3. Also tested this on an bass amp and had the same issue no matter the input gain setting.

I don't believe it is anything on the mixer primarily because I have run live sound since 2009 and have heard and mixed my fair share of effects. This pedal issue seemed really out of my wheel house.

Thanks for covering all of the bases.
 
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#183
Nice tone even before the 4OTF!
Just a quick observation in between getting some work done.... I listened earlier and kept thinking on what was happening. As I hear it, everything sounds normal until the main drive is maxed. That may/may not be normal. I don't recall maxing mine out and it's not at home for me to try to duplicate. I can try later tonight possibly. Since it did it with just an amp, that rules out something in the signal being mixed, as you noted. That was going to be my next question, so I'm glad you tried it already. Maybe I missed it, have you tried another bass. I don't see where that would really be a factor here, but hey, who knows.

Hopefully @agedhorse will give it a listen and have some advice. He will know better than anyone if that's normal and what might be going on given what is heard. Might be worth sending him a PM. If not, try sending an email to Genzler.

Side note, I find the gears are are subtle--but noticeable--but it all depends on how other things are set. I also find what each gear does more in a live mix than at home. Meaning each one fills in differently in a live setting and that's one of the tings I love about it. It's really given some new life to a couple basses that I was not completely pleased with. It's always on except for one maybe two basses. Just makes everything sound better for my tastes. Hopefully it will work that way for you in a recorded mix as well, if that's your main goal. I need to get back to work now!
 
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#184
Ok, I listened to the video and this is an easy one that in fact is covered in the owner's manual too.

First, there is a difference between drive and drive VOLUME.

With a higher output bass, with the drive volume. The DRIVE control adjusts the amount of GAIN within the overdrive engine, and in the lower gears (specifically 1 and 2), since there is so much available gain and the compression compliance is high (ratio low), it's possible to drive the O/D engine into clipping which is a completely different mechanism than overdrive. That's what the low sensitivity switch position is for, to accommodate higher output basses at high drive gain settings.

The drive VOLUME adjusts the level OUT of the overdrive engine, and it's used along with the clean volume to balance the two signal paths. When using the lower gears, it's a lot easier to hear the overdriven signal tone and texture with much lower amounts of clean signal.

I have attached a copy of the owner's manual, please read through it because there is a lot of information that will be helpful to addressing this.
 

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#186
agedhorse said:
Ok, I listened to the video and this is an easy one that in fact is covered in the owner's manual too.

First, there is a difference between drive and drive VOLUME.

With a higher output bass, with the drive volume. The DRIVE control adjusts the amount of GAIN within the overdrive engine, and in the lower gears (specifically 1 and 2), since there is so much available gain and the compression compliance is high (ratio low), it's possible to drive the O/D engine into clipping which is a completely different mechanism than overdrive. That's what the low sensitivity switch position is for, to accommodate higher output basses at high drive gain settings.

The drive VOLUME adjusts the level OUT of the overdrive engine, and it's used along with the clean volume to balance the two signal paths. When using the lower gears, it's a lot easier to hear the overdriven signal tone and texture with much lower amounts of clean signal.

I have attached a copy of the owner's manual, please read through it because there is a lot of information that will be helpful to addressing this.
Click to expand...
Thank you for the explanation. The clipping was the part that was really worrisome. I have dealt with some guitar pedals in the past and had never pushed any pedals to a clipping point just from the output of a guitar. Understanding that these have a limit in those lower gears makes sense based on everyone's input.

I excited to use the pedal now that I understand the features.

Thanks for the manual as well. I had read through it previously but didn't see the mention/possibility of clipping the pedal. The clarification of this helped greatly.
 
#187
Start out in the low sensitivity position first if you plan on high drive gain in lower gear positions. Another way to increase the headroom under these conditions is to use an 18V power supply.
 
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#191
entryLevel said:
Sorry I don't know if I was clear. The video was with an 18V power supply.
Click to expand...
Ok, than your bass must have a pretty hot output so the low sensitivity position is going to be needed for the lower gears and high drive levels. Also, try turning down the clean level since it will tend to mask the O/D in the lower gears, and is most often used to add a little clean dynamics along with higher drive levels using the higher gears where the compression effect is greater.
 
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#192
agedhorse said:
Ok, than your bass must have a pretty hot output so the low sensitivity position is going to be needed for the lower gears and high drive levels. Also, try turning down the clean level since it will tend to mask the O/D in the lower gears, and is most often used to add a little clean dynamics along with higher drive levels using the higher gears where the compression effect is greater.
Click to expand...
Sweet! I'll give that a go. I'll have try it out once I get back in town. I'll report back what I find. Again your insight is greatly appreciated.
 
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#193
agedhorse said:
Ok, I listened to the video and this is an easy one that in fact is covered in the owner's manual too.

First, there is a difference between drive and drive VOLUME.

With a higher output bass, with the drive volume. The DRIVE control adjusts the amount of GAIN within the overdrive engine, and in the lower gears (specifically 1 and 2), since there is so much available gain and the compression compliance is high (ratio low), it's possible to drive the O/D engine into clipping which is a completely different mechanism than overdrive. That's what the low sensitivity switch position is for, to accommodate higher output basses at high drive gain settings.

The drive VOLUME adjusts the level OUT of the overdrive engine, and it's used along with the clean volume to balance the two signal paths. When using the lower gears, it's a lot easier to hear the overdriven signal tone and texture with much lower amounts of clean signal.

I have attached a copy of the owner's manual, please read through it because there is a lot of information that will be helpful to addressing this.
Click to expand...
Interesting. I always used the switch as hi/low versions of the same distortion. Never thought about input level. I need to read the manuals, lol
 
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#194
odarellmc said:
Interesting. I always used the switch as hi/low versions of the same distortion. Never thought about input level. I need to read the manuals, lol
Click to expand...
It depends on the output level of the bass, if low enough it can be used for that purpose, but for higher output basses it has another purpose.

Also, you might try running the drive gain around the 2:00 to 3:00 position with less clean volume blended in, turn up the drive volume a little more to compensate and that may suit your needs better.
 
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#195
So I was thinking about getting the sushi Undergorund Accelerator. I love that alembic tube sound, but I’m NOT looking for pure distortion more just 80s rock sn funk. Tube sound a little ya know if it makes sense. Inknow a want having a LFP an HPF would be nice to have a the 4 on floor seems to have way more options eq wise. Anyone have experience with the UA or PA from sushi. I think the 4 on floor could get me
There an maybe be better for EQn the sojnd idk but the sushi gets good results it seems like. I was wondering about gettitn the UA an then eventually the re/q for dialing it in better if needed? thoughts?
 
#196
PhishPhan22 said:
So I was thinking about getting the sushi Undergorund Accelerator. I love that alembic tube sound, but I’m NOT looking for pure distortion more just 80s rock sn funk. Tube sound a little ya know if it makes sense. Inknow a want having a LFP an HPF would be nice to have a the 4 on floor seems to have way more options eq wise. Anyone have experience with the UA or PA from sushi. I think the 4 on floor could get me
There an maybe be better for EQn the sojnd idk but the sushi gets good results it seems like. I was wondering about gettitn the UA an then eventually the re/q for dialing it in better if needed? thoughts?
Click to expand...
If you run their re/EQ in front of the 4OTF you'll have all the distorted tones you'll ever need.
 
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#199
PhishPhan22 said:
Would you say the genzler pedals or the 4 would be better than the sushi pedal? I think i want the re/q for the sculpting features. I just wonder what combo to get. I wish I could demo these most places around me don’t have em.
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just my opinion, but i think that the genzler 4OTF has a nicer sounding distortion than my sushi pedals. whenever i use one of my Sushi's i basically run it clean or barely driven.
 
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#200
PhishPhan22 said:
Also I want something that’s a DI also incase my head DI acts up some night. The re/q isn’t a DI is it as well?
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Neither the 4 on the Floor or RE/Q pedals are a DI.

The only Genzler pedal with a DI is the Magellan Pre-DI.
 
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