Genzler 4 on the Floor

[Bartrinsic]

I finally zipped up (literally, with zip ties) the idea I've been noodling since I first bought the 4OTF. The JHS Switchback (top right hanging on the back and bottom right red stomp) switches between a clean loop (FEA labs compressor) and a dirty loop (tuner, re/Q and 4OTF). Since I can't see the light on the switchback, having the tuner mute in the dirty loop provides a quick indicator. After the Switchback loops follow the the delay, reverb, and, finally, the Messenger with both DI and line out having separate gains. If you're counting, including the Messenger, I have 3 low passes and 3 high passes--that should be sufficient! I often like the delay but I'm not using the reverb, so it will come off. Also zipped onto the back are two Mission Engineering 529i's, so this is a standalone, no A/C board. You can see above that the re/Q is pumping the 4OTF with clean bass, high mids and treble, which shapes the clean gain around the high pass and low pass, which are filtering some of those out of the drive circuit. So these settings give driven mids with lots of clean bass and top end. That is all independent of my master, always-on 4-band EQ on the Messenger. The two Genzler pedals together vastly increase the available tones, but not all are good. If you're considering running the pair, be prepared to spend some time finding the sweet spots. Some are monstrously awesome, and not easily on tap with the 4OTF alone--in particular pumping in trebles and hi-mids makes more aggressive distorted sounds. The 3 biggest boxes are all lightweight and so is the board, so it's not as chunky as it looks.

 

[Koldunya]

A Guitar Center near me has these on clearance for $150 >_> It was tempting, but I keep telling myself I have a B6 now.

But I figured I'd post this for anyone that wants one to look into it

**Edit** I don't see it on their website, though. I got a Darkglass Element for $180 on clearance from a local store that wasn't on their site

 

[Zbysek]

Question to 4OTF users: what is your favourite settings of filters on the drive channel? I am especially interested in the position of the LPF control.

Thank you.

Feel free to share your experience in my thread (see the link below).

Distorted mids (only)

 

[Zbysek]

Question to 4OTF users: what is your favourite settings of filters on the drive channel? I am especially interested in the position of the LPF control.

Thank you.

Anybody?

 

[PhinDog]

Anybody?

My HPF setting is about 8:00/8:30 to tighten up the low end and the LPF setting about 1:30/2:00. Using gear 1 and
2 mostly for the feel and a bit of drive if I dig in.

 

[Zbysek]

My HPF setting is about 8:00/8:30 to tighten up the low end and the LPF setting about 1:30/2:00. Using gear 1 and
2 mostly for the feel and a bit of drive if I dig in.

Thank you. So that would be roughly 45Hz and 9kHz?

 

[PhinDog]

Thank you. So that would be roughly 45Hz and 9kHz?

45hz is about right, I would say somewhere 7000-8000hz on the LPF. For me that seems to tighten and focus up the tone/drive. YMMV

 

[Zbysek]

45hz is about right, I would say somewhere 7000-8000hz on the LPF. For me that seems to tighten and focus up the tone/drive. YMMV

Thank you.

 

[DrThumpenstein]

Anybody?

I think this fits what you are looking for. I have seen absolutely no negative effects on tone by turning the LPF down to noon, and actually changes from there all the way down to 1K are pretty subtle to me.

I’ve been fiddling around with it recently and really exploring the interaction with the WD 800. There is definite interplay between the input on the WD and the 4OTF. I’m finding that if I crank the gain on the input anywhere beyond noon, it gets too hairy too fast for me. I have been gravitating towards keeping the preamp gain ~10:00, which gives a little more depth to the notes than lower gain.

The drive I get from the WD is actually plenty for my needs; I rarely crank the input all the way. But the 4OTF has different flavors/types of drive, each infinitely adjustable, so I can focus on that component of my tone while keeping the relative positions of the input and master consistent. Right now I’m focusing on getting just the right amount of drive I need when it’s active, balanced with the tones I need when it’s off, when I’m playing with rounder, thumpier tones for other tunes. The 4OTF gets into what I consider distortion levels if I push it hard, certainly well beyond any needs I’ll ever have, so it really fits my needs perfectly(YMMV).

I’m currently using all active basses pretty much wide open and find that I have a better range of control when I keep the pedal at low sensitivity. It’s set slightly hotter than unity gain, not much at all, just a hair. My own observation is that the WD really likes a hot signal, although too hot and you get too much drive too soon. I think I’ve found a good balance point, but what’s the use of having dials if you’re not gonna fiddle with them, right? (I’m running it on a 12 V power supply.)

 

[Zbysek]

View attachment 4843587
I think this fits what you are looking for. I have seen absolutely no negative effects on tone by turning the LPF down to noon, and actually changes from there all the way down to 1K are pretty subtle to me.

I’ve been fiddling around with it recently and really exploring the interaction with the WD 800. There is definite interplay between the input on the WD and the 4OTF. I’m finding that if I crank the gain on the input anywhere beyond noon, it gets too hairy too fast for me. I have been gravitating towards keeping the preamp gain ~10:00, which gives a little more depth to the notes than lower gain.

The drive I get from the WD is actually plenty for my needs; I rarely crank the input all the way. But the 4OTF has different flavors/types of drive, each infinitely adjustable, so I can focus on that component of my tone while keeping the relative positions of the input and master consistent. Right now I’m focusing on getting just the right amount of drive I need when it’s active, balanced with the tones I need when it’s off, when I’m playing with rounder, thumpier tones for other tunes. The 4OTF gets into what I consider distortion levels if I push it hard, certainly well beyond any needs I’ll ever have, so it really fits my needs perfectly(YMMV).

I’m currently using all active basses pretty much wide open and find that I have a better range of control when I keep the pedal at low sensitivity. It’s set slightly hotter than unity gain, not much at all, just a hair. My own observation is that the WD really likes a hot signal, although too hot and you get too much drive too soon. I think I’ve found a good balance point, but what’s the use of having dials if you’re not gonna fiddle with them, right? (I’m running it on a 12 V power supply.)

Thank you

 

[DrThumpenstein]

Thank you

You bet.

I didn’t post on the other thread since I’m never really going for actual distortion, just a little bit of drive.

These settings really focus the mids. I have a SPL meter that I use quite often when comparing settings, adjusting pickup heights, etc., to account for the fact that we tend to prefer louder when comparing musical variables. When I have it set to unity gain according to the SPL readings, the 4OTF still sounds louder and clearer in a mix than my raw signal (@band practice), and I attribute that to the mids being edgier and more prominent than the unaffected signal.

That said, when I use it for practices and performances, I generally need a little bit of boost as well, so that’s how I usually set it when I’m not experimenting.

 

[Zbysek]

When I have it set to unity gain according to the SPL readings, the 4OTF still sounds louder and clearer in a mix than my raw signal (@band practice), and I attribute that to the mids being edgier and more prominent than the unaffected signal.

I don't own SPL meter myself...but that's what I would expect. Overdriven mids help the bass be heard better...and cut through the mix better...

That said, when I use it for practices and performances, I generally need a little bit of boost as well, so that’s how I usually set it when I’m not experimenting.

That's what I plan to do with my own setup: leave the clean signal at unity and bring the additional ovedriven mids to fill in the empty space left by the guitar player taking solo...

I didn’t post on the other thread since I’m never really going for actual distortion, just a little bit of drive.

I guess I confused things a little by the title of my thread. I am not looking for full-on distortion, what I want is saturated/ovedriven mids.

 

[OldogNewTrick]

Is anybody running the 4OTF at other supply voltages than 9VDC (12, 18)?
Would there be any benefit to that? @agedhorse

I'm re-organising my messy pedal setup by adding a "proper" power supply.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

POWER JACK - This pedal contains circuitry that auto-detects both the voltage and polarity of the attached power supply. The pedal will function properly from 9V to 18V, center positive or center negative polarity. With very high output basses, you may notice a little more input headroom with 12V or higher power supplies. Be sure to use a low noise type power supply, general purpose power supplies can introduce noise into the signal path.

 

[agedhorse]

Is anybody running the 4OTF at other supply voltages than 9VDC (12, 18)?
Would there be any benefit to that? @agedhorse

I'm re-organising my messy pedal setup by adding a "proper" power supply.

This is an “it depends” answer…

If you have a higher output bass, you may find an increased openness associated with a higher voltage supply. If you play with a heavy touch, this might be an improvement, but it’s hard to say for sure. That said, this may not be desirable to some players, so I encourage you to try it and report back your own experience.

 

[OldogNewTrick]

This is an “it depends” answer…

it usually is

If you have a higher output bass, you may find an increased openness associated with a higher voltage supply. If you play with a heavy touch, this might be an improvement, but it’s hard to say for sure. That said, this may not be desirable to some players, so I encourage you to try it and report back your own experience.

Right now, the 4OTF is dead quiet with my current wall wart 9VDC supply and I have no complaints with any of my basses, but then, I don't know any better.
Question is basically, if I can get away with an 9V only supply, but more isolated outputs or should go for a multi-voltage unit, but with fewer outputs, so that I may have to daisy chain 2 pedals to one output.

Or I could just go ahead and throw more money at a problem, which may be not issue in the first place....

 

[odarellmc]

it usually is



Right now, the 4OTF is dead quiet with my current wall wart 9VDC supply and I have no complaints with any of my basses, but then, I don't know any better.
Question is basically, if I can get away with an 9V only supply, but more isolated outputs or should go for a multi-voltage unit, but with fewer outputs, so that I may have to daisy chain 2 pedals to one output.

Or I could just go ahead and throw more money at a problem, which may be not issue in the first place....

Ideally isolated output are preferred. However proper power is so important I don't know how anyone doesn't considers it to be. Having clean filtered power is step one. Especially with issues related such as this (elimination any chance for noise from power) ...I've learned this lesson so both of my board run DC7s....

 

[DrThumpenstein]

Is anybody running the 4OTF at other supply voltages than 9VDC (12, 18)?
Would there be any benefit to that? @agedhorse

I'm re-organising my messy pedal setup by adding a "proper" power supply.

I recently switched to a dedicated 18 V power supply for my 4OTF and I think it did add maybe a little more clean headroom. I play active basses almost exclusively, with the 4OTF sensitivity set to low. Since the change, I have found myself dialing out virtually all of my clean signal and pushing the Drive a little harder, more toward 2:00. Still have it set for a touch of boost. 3rd gear is my current flavor of the month. Sounds so good when I dig in!

The pedal settings changed a bit, but the character of the drive I get didn't change significantly to my ear with the change to 18 V. If I had to use a 9 or 12V supply again, I wouldn’t hesitate to do so, I’d just have to turn the knobs a bit. I think it works nicely and sounds great with any of those voltages.

 

[dagrev]

I should have been enjoying my new 4OTF for a week now. But FedMess lost the package (not uncommon with them), and after days if it not going anywhere once in town they admitted they can't seem to find it. In the meantime I've enjoyed the comments which have raised my expectations. I hope to report my impressions at some point, but it seems that is going to be down the road.

 

[agedhorse]

it usually is



Right now, the 4OTF is dead quiet with my current wall wart 9VDC supply and I have no complaints with any of my basses, but then, I don't know any better.
Question is basically, if I can get away with an 9V only supply, but more isolated outputs or should go for a multi-voltage unit, but with fewer outputs, so that I may have to daisy chain 2 pedals to one output.

Or I could just go ahead and throw more money at a problem, which may be not issue in the first place....

If you aren’t having any issues, I wouldn’t worry about it. The circuit and approach are quite robust performance-wise.