GK 800RB - new or old?

[SwitchGear]

Some TB'ers think the older (1980's versions, I presume) 800rb's are "better" than newer production models.

Can anyone provide evidence or research to back up this thought?

I have owned three different 800rb's from the 80's, 90's and now 2000's decades and have not found one to be "better" than another, btw.

 

[David Jayne]

I suspect, but have no data to back this up, that folks simply assume this is the case, for no good reason.
Perhaps their perceptions are colored by recent poor user experiences with other brands? Brands that clearly aren't where they used to be?

 

[Standalone]

I asked this same question in another thread. I have not yet heard a definitive answer.

 

[maxbass]

Some TB'ers think the older (1980's versions, I presume) 800rb's are "better" than newer production models.
...

They're different inside, this is a matter of fact.

Does this means they sound different and that some are better than others? To each his own idea.

 

[XtraLongScale]

I own a late 80's one and have played more recent ones and hear no difference at all.

 

[SwitchGear]

They're different inside, this is a matter of fact.

Does this means they sound different and that some are better than others? To each his own idea.

Do the internal differences make the newer models inferior?

 

[lbwdog]

Do the internal differences make the newer models inferior?

I doubt that's the case. I assume that any internal parts changes were implemented to replace older, less available parts, and to possibly improve performance in some areas, while maintaining the overall tone/power profile of the original.
This is just my theory, BTW.

 

[mpm32]

I do know that the new ones have a toroidal transformer vs a laminated core transformer in the old ones.

I had an old one - horizontal power switch, that I blew up - probably my fault. Now I bought a newer one (Owned by Jerry Only of the Misfits, so the seller says

I can't tell a difference.

 

[maxbass]

Do the internal differences make the newer models inferior?

According to my technician, there's a quality difference.
Older ones had more expensive components.

As said before, only ears can judge wheter this is relevant or not from a musician's point of view.

 

[mpm32]

Older ones had more expensive components.

Can't you pretty much say that about most consumer products these days?

 

[maxbass]

Can't you pretty much say that about most consumer products these days?

For sure

 

[K-Funk]

The old ones also had two output jacks for the 100W amp, but I heard it led to some confusion.

I miss my 800RB

 

[SwitchGear]

According to my technician, there's a quality difference.
Older ones had more expensive components.

As said before, only ears can judge wheter this is relevant or not from a musician's point of view.

The components are more expensive because they are now hard to find or even obsolete, which does not mean the new amps with modern components are less quality units.

 

[B-string]

"By today's standards it is still an expensive amp to make, but people still want the original 800rb. The voice of the amp has not changed." This has been stated by more than two G-K high level employees. My 99 sound the same as a friends 82, maybe a hair deeper in Biamp mode but I am very picky about sound.

 

[maxbass]

The components are more expensive because they are now hard to find or even obsolete, which does not mean the new amps with modern components are less quality units.

In the late eighties/early nineties a GK800RB was a very expensive head.
It was a high-end transistor head, together with the top of the line Trace Elliot heads
15 years later the price had dropped.

 

[SwitchGear]

Really no diff in the voice of the new heads vs the older ones. That is also been my observation.

So folks, quit callin' the older heads "better" than the newer models just because they are older, LOL.

 

[megadan]

I would assume it's the same as any vintage amp. If it's been around since 1987 and it's still working, you know it has high quality parts and isn't a 'lemon.' The best sounding examples (differences in component manufacturing etc.) have been preserved, while the sub-par units broke and weren't passed on.

Vintage is an insurance of long term quality. Newer amps may be just as good but they haven't passed that test yet.

 

[TripleDouble]

I hear almost no difference in my late 80's, horizontal switch 800rb and a new one thats at one of my practice spaces. The only notable difference in the pitch/tone of the bit of background hiss, and the "treble" amp on mine seems a bit louder(?)

More expensive meaning better quality, or these old, outdated versions of the components are more expensive to replace? I think this is another forum myth along the lines of "mojo".

 

[Grooveman1961]

I've been working on and using these 800's for quite a while. I own several, 1984 to a 99. The circuits are all very close, some changes through the years to different pot values, different opamps, but I doubt youd hear the changes. Power supplies were changed a couple of times on the +/- 15v section, again, no significant sonic difference.

One thing that is really neat, you can put any combo of the three internal boards together. These amps are like army jeeps. you can mix and matchtwenty years worth of components and run just as well with any of them.

The most important change i think is the switch to toroid power transformers. One of my 800's got converted, and it sounded the same, scoped the same. There was less hum with my jazz.

The newer ones use a more reliable output transistor set, Mj10024,25 as opposed to the older mj10022,23. Higher power ratings.

Ya know, adding a second pair of output transistors to the 100 watt section gets you the exact power section of the rb400, and 4 ohm capability. I'm just sayin...

I think the newerones are overall better. I like the chassis of the older ones, but thats just me being old school.

Be aware that the biamp feature doesn't work all that well with a modern cab where your running the little horn separately, the cross over goes from 100 to 1000 hz.

If your'e gonna run a a 15 and a 210, this guy will kick ass.

Or just run it straight up into an 810. Oh yeah.

Another interesting mod that I've done, is to switch the inputs on the power amp input board so the highs are going to the 300 watt section and lows to the 100watt. When you run with the biamp switch in, and the crossover all the way down, it will have a fuller bass response out of the high section, than when your running in normal mode. Strange but true. Plus in biamp mode, 100 wats to a single sub is often all that those cabs need because they are excursion limited at about 100 rms anyway. Check the eminence website for details.

Be aware that any 800rb is like a dragster in the amp world. Is has no overload protection. Short a speaker, kaboom. accidentally plug a 4 ohm load in to the 100 watt section kaboom. DO anything that gets dc on the outputs...kaboom.

I always carry an 800. I'm doing the tube thing these days, but the 800 always comes with, an usually gets fired up for the third set free for all.

Can you tell I like these amps?

 

[Grooveman1961]

I hear almost no difference in my late 80's, horizontal switch 800rb and a new one thats at one of my practice spaces. The only notable difference in the pitch/tone of the bit of background hiss, and the "treble" amp on mine seems a bit louder(?)

More expensive meaning better quality, or these old, outdated versions of the components are more expensive to replace? I think this is another forum myth along the lines of "mojo".

yup, major mojo. The construction method of the whole amp means it has to be hand assembled. Including the circuit boards. Hand stufed. Hand soldered. I think they are still made right here in the us in their entirity.

Geez I've just sold myself on one again.