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Got fired from my church gig...

I feel for you Brad, I just started a church gig and they gave about 40 tunes on a 3 CDs but oddly enough the ones we wind up playing on Sunday aren't on any of them. :eek: So on Sunday morning we go through what they're going to play before the service begins, I chart out the changes and then work the magic.

Sounds to me like they want to replace you with someone else or maybe you're not christian enough for them. Man if the true believers act this way I hate to see the aethist in action. :D

As an atheist, I am often asked why I believe so much in love, in treating others as I would like to be treated, and in what makes me moral. IMO knowing that I don't have a second chance, that gains made in life are efemeral and ultimately unimportant, and that people are important, not things makes me more focussed on really living my life well, as it is the only thing I have. So, to answer your question, real atheists would probably act much better. After all, we don't lie (no stories about virgin births, raising dead, or water into wine, although I like that one), don't argue about interpretations of myths, don't condemn others to death for disagreeing, don't fight over doctrinal points that are essentially opinions no more important than if you like red or blue best, and don't impose upon others our belief system, even if it seems pretty ludicrous.


For $200K, I gotta know...was it a Meyers Sound Lab system?

Peace and love to you all!

"People think love is an emotion...love is good sense"
Ken Kesey

If you have to suspend reason to believe something, there is something wrong with what you are trying to believe.
 
Being a huge fan of the music of the Grateful Dead, I thrive in that atmosphere!

Thing is church crowds thrive on order. Open jamming in church would deviate from everything I've ever experienced in church, such as it is. Seems to me, the 'let's jam' approach would open the door for a good ole-fashioned stoning (or a more civilized, genteel equivalent).
 
I meant to ask what these guys were, forgot... I was also going to ask if my hat was ok, forgot... Noticed I was the only guy wearing a hat, but when I asked about dress code, the keyboardist said jeans are ok, they're casual, so maybe not a problem.

Pastor called me out in the service, caught me by surprise, very public thanks, greatful for your talents, etc... I was kind of embarrassed... everyone was clapping... Kind of funny, they switched up one of the songs, I had never heard it, had to follow by ear, I'm sure I blew a few changes... said I'm just good at covering up mistakes, the true mark of a professional..... Talked to him after the service, wants to get together to talk, maybe for dinner.

Wonder if this is the sales pitch to join the church, or to just get to know me better, see where my head's at?

Trying to roll my hand cart up 2 steps to get to the church, I managed to dump some of it (the guy helping me didn't realize the handle came off, cotter pin is missing, can't lift on the handle....) I managed not to swear when it happened... No damage, didn't fall far,



Randy
 
Wow, sorry to hear that Brad.

A lot of you know that I'm pretty "deep" in my church.
I see it a LOT. There is always positioning and what-not going on.
Just because it's a church doesn't mean it's exempt from secular B.S., politics, favoritism, nepitism etc..which goes on at my church as well.
It happens everywhere. it's just how the elders of the church deal with it.

And it's just how you deal with it.
Sounds like you handled it perfectly Brad.

The difference between you and I, when the MM did lie, I would have called him out right then and there.
Not for any "finger pointing" or such. I'm just a pretty straight up guy and when it happens, I kinda mention it.


And in the bigger churches ("mega" church) $200K for a sound system isn't a lot of cash.
Trust me.

We have 5 or 6 Yamaha M7CL boards, equally as many new JBL line array systems to go with- as well as full compliment of mic's outboard gear, Motif's, full drum kits (nice Ludwigs), EAW & L-Acoustic's wedges, wireless IEM's. Full lighting/video as well.
And that's just for our portable campuses (we have 5 total in Michigan and one opening in Orlando later this year).

Our main campus is unreal from a sound/light/video angle (DigiDesign Venue board, L-Acoustic's FOH.....).
Check out the video's on my MySpace Page.

It's a business for sure.

But as much that is invested in things like that, more-so by and large is invested in ministries beyond the walls.
 
Thanks, Mike. Actually I did call the MM out on the lie about the amp he told at the final meeting. The pastor jumped in, saying he wasn't looking for the truth and I left it at that. It was obvious that he was cool with whatever was going down.

He said I told him I'd never bring my amp to church at that two people, including my "good friend" would attest to that. I asked why, if there wasn't an issue with the sound and he'd never asked me to bring an amp (his words a few minutes earlier in this meeting) was I refusing to bring an amp in? Why was it even being discussed?


The look on his face was priceless. Then the pastor threw him a bone and I sat there trying to contain my laughter at silliness of it all. Most garden variety liars aren't very quick on their feet. Never even consider that someone might throw their words right back at them.
:cool:

Agreed, $200k isn't alot of cash for some of the larger facilities. Not even close.
 
Thing is church crowds thrive on order. Open jamming in church would deviate from everything I've ever experienced in church, such as it is. Seems to me, the 'let's jam' approach would open the door for a good ole-fashioned stoning (or a more civilized, genteel equivalent).

The only person allowed to wing it music-wise in that church was the pastor. The former MM just called me about a gig last week and I filled him in on what had happened. He had quit under similar circumstances the end of last year. I told him the current guy had bragged that the pastor wouldn't just start singing something whenever he felt like it vs. sticking to the program. "I wish he would do that with me".

Wish granted.
:D

It took all of two weeks before he did just that and when the MM told him we didn't play that song the pastor told him, on his open mic:

"You'll play it today"
:eyebrow:

That was genuinely funny.
:D
 
Thing is church crowds thrive on order. Open jamming in church would deviate from everything I've ever experienced in church, such as it is. Seems to me, the 'let's jam' approach would open the door for a good ole-fashioned stoning (or a more civilized, genteel equivalent).
This Sun, I found out they changed one of the songs, instead of doing the ones I had practiced, so I had to do the one cold. Never heard it until we started.

Its up to us to make order out of the chaos.

Randy
 
Ugg. I read the first two posts from Brad. Well written, actually, and relatively clear and concise, considering the information and topic. Sorry to hear the woes. Makes me potentially rethink offering my musical services/abilities to any organization without asking some hard questions and getting down to nitty-gritty details. While there are always aspects of musical association we can't control, the situation that prompted the thread seems one of great stress, complication, and frustration. It seems more trouble than it's worth. I know the desire to serve and think of larger things than oneself can be strong, and I share that sensibility, but this seems to be a poster-child for the concept of "no good deed goes unpunished."

Sorry.

:(
 
I played for a church gig in high school. They kicked me out because I was "too busy" and they just wanted me to play and sustain the root note and nothing else. Being the classical/jazz/BRÜTAL METAL bassist I was at that age, this did not compute, especially when they replaced me with a tone-deaf middle-aged woman who couldn't (and still can't) tune her own instrument and buzzes all the time while playing late. Of course this is a moot point since they'd just turn the bass down to near-0 anyway. I was using my Ibanez at the time so I'd just adjust the volume/EQ on my bass and gradually add more volume as they turned me down.
 
This should be fun.
:D

I subbed at a medium sized church for most of 2009 and they asked me to come on full time for 2010. I took a lower saleary than I normally would because I was playing with another musician I work with on a regular basis. Throughout my time subbing I frequently got comments that I showed up more consistently on time and prepared than the regular members. people in the congregation seemed very happy with what I was doing.

By November 09 they had driven the then music minister out and the assistant MM took over. They decided to do away with all amps onstage and have the musicians only use monitors. I was told their equipment setup ran in excess of $200k. They decided to have myself and the guitarist share a monitor, which as the main source of sound seemed like a bad idea. It was in practice.

To go along with the $200k+ system they had a volunteer soundperson who knew nothing about digital boards... and yes, that worked out about as well as could be expected. For some reason the sound in the shared monitor was always distorted to the point where it was not only difficult to hear onesself, it was also extremely difficult to hear the keyboards. A bonus was having a keyboardist who would regularly play chord changes differently from one verse to the next and it was trying to say the least.

I offered many times to help them troubleshoot the sound problem and for some reason they never got around to doing it, repeatedly saying it must be a bad chord. I told them that while that might be a part of the problem, the instruments volume going up and down independent of each other, the complete dropouts and just generally bad quality of sound only when someone was sitting at the board were likely not coincidental.

On a fairly regular basis the MM would wait until Saturday, sometimes even very early Sunday before giving me the names of the music we'd be doing Sunday morning. Later on he found a hosting site for some of the music but even then he'd often tell me to just youtube the songs, not giving me an artist name nor version more often than not. This was in spite of me asking for music during the week so I could listen to it. In any event, even though I often worked Saturday nights I'd get on the music, chart it out and be prepared to play it each week.

There's a lot more that went on and I can get into that if needed. Because of the jacked up sound onstage at a full rehearsal we once again talked about how to fix it. I told them that for me the best thing would be to have a small amp that actually sounded like a bass guitar so I could hear what I was doing. The MM asked me if I'd use one of mine and I suggested they sell the big rig they were no longer using and get something smaller. The MM asked that I look into it and made it clear that we would try it with an amp.

I brought a small combo amp (smaller than the monitor we had) in the following Sunday and sounded 100% better. The guitarist still sounded distorted, so did the rest of the mix that we had in our monitor, I was just relieved that my sound for once didn't suck. I didn't play loudly, it was simply more clear.

Out of the blue a couple of days later the MM texted me and asked if I had left with my hat on Sunday. He also said the pastor asked what was up with me, I never speak to him. He also asked why there was an amp onstage.
:hmm:

I called the MM and asked what was going on. He told me what the pastor had supposedly said and I was pretty surprised, considering how I had spoken to him every time I was around him and we even talked about cars on one occassion. I asked how he answered the question about the amp, which he had told me to bring in and he didn't tell the pastor that he had okayed it. Typically when BS pops up it's for a reason. I talked to my friend, told him what happened and told him what I thought was going on: they're either trying to get me to quit or barring that, they're going to fire me. Never mind the fact that they had no reason to fire me, I was easily the most consistent performer there, I didn't create any problems and I dealt with the hand they gave me like a professional.

A couple of days later I got another text from the MM. He said he knew I was frustrated (even though I'd stopped saying anything about the sound) and that he and the new music director under him and the pastor were frustrated with me. I was not the fit they were looking for even though I was a great bassist so I was fired effective the end of the month.

Call me Kreskin. More to come...
if that's the kind of back biting crap that goes on in churches then i would say you're better off out of it.....i,m not sure what leaving with a hat means,but it sounds to me like the petty kind of stuff people say when they are trying to undermine someone.....i can think of lots of better things to do on a sunday than deal with that stuff....
 
I tend to stay away from Church. Full of hypocrisy. I bet your buddy told the pastor you were talking $h!#, and he didn't like that. It's all politics. Like in school, work, and life in general, if you don't kiss @$$ and have a mind of your own, then you're probably not going to be on the boss', teachers, or pastors good side. Well, I have to say congratulations for getting out of that predicament.

i only read the OP, not going through 11 pages.

Edit: 18 pages.
 

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