I love my 112b. I just wish I had a head that would accommodate 2 of them. Sadly, 2 ohm stable class D heads are tougher to come by nowadays. The Rumble 800 is looking pretty enticing though. Shame the TX600 doesn't work at 2 ohms.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Yeah, the 112b has an incredible punch and even if I think that Hartke designed it for stand-alone use, two of them will be so powerful. Unfortunately, there are not so many class d amp able to work at 2 ohms, that's another reason why I love the LH 1000, the incredible versatile of the cab set options!
Greetings Enrico and Talk Bass.com community,
My name is Mariano Giannino and I'm a professional bass player from Argentina. I read the whole thread and just signed in to make some questions.
Enrico, I love Hartke hybrid cabs and I am about to buy the new HyDrive HD cabs. I need your recommendation on matching cabs to get the maximum power from my bass head and avoid phase issues or power distribution problems among the different speakers sizes involved (I am not an expert in this field and I read in different forums that choosing the right matching cabs is not easy and could lead to problems).
I've been playing a HyDrive 4x10" cab (1000w @ 8ohms) with a Markbass Little Mark Tube 800 head (800w @ 4 ohms / 500w @ 8 ohms) for 15 years. In addition to maximizing head power, my other main objective is to improve the bottom end by making it bigger and rounder (sub low kind of sound). I'm thinking of replacing my HyDrive 4x10" (lack of bottom end depth to my taste, especially when playing the low B string either finger or slap styles) by one of the following combinations (all of them being the new HyDrive HD cabs) and here is were I need your advice according to your experience:
A) 1x15" (500w @ 8 ohms) + 2x10" (500w @ 8ohms).
My Markbass head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms and power distribution will be even. 400w will go to the 1x15" speaker (rated 500w) and 400w will go to the 2x10" (200w for each speaker...rated 250w each).
B) 2 cabs 1x12" (setted up at 300w @ 8 ohms each).
As in A) the head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms, power distribution will be even (400w going to each cab) but it will exceed the speakers rating (400w going to a 300w cab).
C) 1x15" (500w @ 8 ohms) + 1x12" (setted up at 300w @ 8 ohms).
As in A) the head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms, power distribution will be even (400w going to each cab) but it will exceed the 12" speaker rating (400w going to a 300w cab).
D) I am not considering a 1x15" + 4x10" because of the size and weight.
I've never tried or heard the sound of A) and C) configurations but I've read amazing comments about using 2 cabs 1x12" regarding the lows depth and punch. You are also using this configuration in some of your videos and it sounds really great. My only concern if going with this choice is exceeding by 100w the rating of each cab as explained in B). I've never had to set my Markbass head more than 4 (gain) and 6 (master) using my active Yamaha BBNEII, though. I also read many forums that recommends pairing two identical sized cabs instead of 1x15" + 2x10" for example, because the sound of one cab could prevail over the other one instead of being complemented sounds. But again, as I am not an expert in this field...
What configuration do you think could help me replace the 4x10" cab and get a richer bottom end without compromising punch and definition? Unfortunately I cannot go and try different cabs since there is only one small music store in my hometown. I would greatly appreciate any thought or advice you can give me.
Best regards
Mariano
My name is Mariano Giannino and I'm a professional bass player from Argentina. I read the whole thread and just signed in to make some questions.
Enrico, I love Hartke hybrid cabs and I am about to buy the new HyDrive HD cabs. I need your recommendation on matching cabs to get the maximum power from my bass head and avoid phase issues or power distribution problems among the different speakers sizes involved (I am not an expert in this field and I read in different forums that choosing the right matching cabs is not easy and could lead to problems).
I've been playing a HyDrive 4x10" cab (1000w @ 8ohms) with a Markbass Little Mark Tube 800 head (800w @ 4 ohms / 500w @ 8 ohms) for 15 years. In addition to maximizing head power, my other main objective is to improve the bottom end by making it bigger and rounder (sub low kind of sound). I'm thinking of replacing my HyDrive 4x10" (lack of bottom end depth to my taste, especially when playing the low B string either finger or slap styles) by one of the following combinations (all of them being the new HyDrive HD cabs) and here is were I need your advice according to your experience:
A) 1x15" (500w @ 8 ohms) + 2x10" (500w @ 8ohms).
My Markbass head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms and power distribution will be even. 400w will go to the 1x15" speaker (rated 500w) and 400w will go to the 2x10" (200w for each speaker...rated 250w each).
B) 2 cabs 1x12" (setted up at 300w @ 8 ohms each).
As in A) the head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms, power distribution will be even (400w going to each cab) but it will exceed the speakers rating (400w going to a 300w cab).
C) 1x15" (500w @ 8 ohms) + 1x12" (setted up at 300w @ 8 ohms).
As in A) the head will deliver the full 800w @ 4 ohms, power distribution will be even (400w going to each cab) but it will exceed the 12" speaker rating (400w going to a 300w cab).
D) I am not considering a 1x15" + 4x10" because of the size and weight.
I've never tried or heard the sound of A) and C) configurations but I've read amazing comments about using 2 cabs 1x12" regarding the lows depth and punch. You are also using this configuration in some of your videos and it sounds really great. My only concern if going with this choice is exceeding by 100w the rating of each cab as explained in B). I've never had to set my Markbass head more than 4 (gain) and 6 (master) using my active Yamaha BBNEII, though. I also read many forums that recommends pairing two identical sized cabs instead of 1x15" + 2x10" for example, because the sound of one cab could prevail over the other one instead of being complemented sounds. But again, as I am not an expert in this field...
What configuration do you think could help me replace the 4x10" cab and get a richer bottom end without compromising punch and definition? Unfortunately I cannot go and try different cabs since there is only one small music store in my hometown. I would greatly appreciate any thought or advice you can give me.
Best regards
Mariano
Hey Mariano, happy to meet you and thank for watching my videos.
You made a very important point, a lot of players underestimate the correct match between speakers and the amp, especially with more than one cab, anyway let's go through your questions.
First of all, as probably you noticed the hydrive and hydrive HD doesn't sound exactly the same, generally speaking, the latter is just a little bit excited on the lows.
Let's start with the solution that I will probably avoid first, the C combination. The 12" speakers are a very nice and extremely versatile cabinet for size and tone versatility, you can cover most of the music styles especially in professional scenarios as you are. But probably, paired with the 15" cabinet (even if your goal is to reach more bottom with a kind of sub-bass tone) you will get the minimum amount of definition only with high volumes because the 15" will always overtake the 12", a sort of double knife I will avoid especially if you wanna reach more bottom having at the same time, a versatile rig.
A scenario could be one of the first solutions for your goal. Back in the days, my first big rig was an Eden 2x10" + 15". Overall the sound was very nice, but I always felt a lack of mids with that type of combination. In the last years, I had the chance to go through some similar backline rigs, different brands, new cab concepts but, even that, I felt the same about the overall tone, the 2x10" paired with a 15" cover a lot of highs and mid-highs but you have to deal with a mid scoop, for this reason probably the best pair with the sub cab, is still the 4x10.
Maybe with your bass that, I know very well, great axe, you can compensate it.
Another solution could be to use just the 15" cab, I know a couple of fellas more in the dubstep style scenario, that use only that sub cab.
The B solution probably will be the perfect match in my opinion, especially for what you're looking for.
Two 12" cabs are very punchy, not as 4x10" but extremely versatile and they can reach together the right bottom that fits so many music and work scenarios, even if my favorite cab is still the 4x10.
For example, I usually use the high drive on both cabs, I like hifi modern tone, but even that, the bottom, the punch, and a good mids definition is still there. Sometimes I also use the drive off on the lower cabinet, especially if your head has a balance control, to get more sub tone.
Also, the 112 HD is the only cabinet from Hartke that has an impedance switch that gives you a universal option for rig combinations. Indeed you can switch easily from 4 to 8 ohm depends on whatever you need to use, two cabs or just one for small rigs. Of course in the last scenario you need to watch out the volume used...
I suppose that you will use your MarkBass in bridge mode, making the extension directly from the cabinets, so in this way, you will be able to send 250w to each speaker with a good ratio cab-head power.
The other cabs we mentioned, are all 8ohm native so you shouldn't have any problem with the power distribution.
I hope I answered all your questions and if you need more help just let me know.
Caio. Enrico
Hi Enrico, thanks a lot for reading the whole message and taking the time to answer.
My MarkBass head can deliver 500w @ 8Ohms and 800w @ 4Ohms. I was thinking of switching each 1x12" cab to 8Ohms in order to get a total load of 4Ohms when connecting together (daisy chain as shown in picture attached). Is this connection you are referring to as "bridge mode"?
My main concern was that hoocking up the system in this way the maximum power of the bass head will be 800w splitted in two and distributed 400w to each cab, being each cab able to handle only 300w. Is this analysis correct?
I sent an email to Hartke technicians to have their input on this and they told me the following "The RMS ratings of the speakers are lower than your amp's output on most of these setups however you can still use these speakers effectively so long as you avoid clipping and excess volume for long periods of time".
So either I replace my amp with a smaller one (600w @ 4Ohms like TX600) or I keep the volume in a safe setting when playing. Nowadays, I have a HyDrive 4x10" rated 1000w @ 8Ohms so my bass head would be delivering 500w with the Master knob all the way up. I've never set the Master knob more than 1 or 2 o'clock so actually the head must be delivering around 300-350w and for me this is more than fine. Is very loud for some gigs. I might be ok using two 1x12" cabs daisy chained if I keep the Master in a safe setting. Besides, the Little Mark Tube is a beautiful sounding bass head and it would be a pity to replace it. What's your thought about this?
Attachments
Hey Mariano,
sorry, I miss confused your MarkBass amp with some other Damp that feature two different type of connections, bridge and parallel mode.
The second give you the chance to split the power of the amp in two equal and independent half.
I checked your mark bass and it seems that you can have only the bridge mode, basically a single output with full power of the amp depending of the cab impedance.
And yes, bridge mode is the popular way to connect two or more different cabs in daisy chain where the minimum load don't have to exceed the amp specs, in your case 4 ohm.
Yes, if you connect two 8ohm cabinet as the 1x12 you will exceed the maximum watt each cab can handle. So in theory that's wrong but as the Hartke wrote you, if you use a safe set on your head you will be fine.
I experienced many many times this scenario, power amp more powerful of the cabinet, so volume in safe mode is one of the vital thing that you have to care about it but, is also important how you use the preamp.
For example if you have a master volume set on safe 12' o'clock but then you excite your tone especially with more bass and mids than you will risk your cabinet as well if you set the head with higher volume.
On reality anyway I think you will more than fine, be sure, if you go for the two 1x12, that the woofer don't make too big movement, because that is the signal that your cab is working bad.
Last edited:
Hi Enric.
I read in the manual of the amplifier (hartke tx600) that the direct out is Post EQ: "DIRECT OUT Jack - Use this electronically balanced XLR jack to route signal from the TX600 to a professional mixing console, as a tap to a main PA system via a mic input on the console, or to an external amplifier. The DIRECT OUT signal is post EQ." But I tried to connect the Direct Out to an interface and the equalization of the amplifier does not affect the signal, will my applier have any failures?
CIA
I read in the manual of the amplifier (hartke tx600) that the direct out is Post EQ: "DIRECT OUT Jack - Use this electronically balanced XLR jack to route signal from the TX600 to a professional mixing console, as a tap to a main PA system via a mic input on the console, or to an external amplifier. The DIRECT OUT signal is post EQ." But I tried to connect the Direct Out to an interface and the equalization of the amplifier does not affect the signal, will my applier have any failures?
CIA
Hi Pedro,
unfortunately I don't think you made any mistakes. The XLR out is definitely a preEQ, takes the signal just after the tube step and the only control that does work is the mute button. I think the manual has a print mistake, it seems that they fixed in the TX300 manual, saying that the XLR out is pre EQ.
If you want a signal affected by the preamp EQ, the only out you can use is the preamp-out (effect send) on the back.
If you need more help just let me know.
Ciao.
unfortunately I don't think you made any mistakes. The XLR out is definitely a preEQ, takes the signal just after the tube step and the only control that does work is the mute button. I think the manual has a print mistake, it seems that they fixed in the TX300 manual, saying that the XLR out is pre EQ.
If you want a signal affected by the preamp EQ, the only out you can use is the preamp-out (effect send) on the back.
If you need more help just let me know.
Ciao.
Hi Enrico, I have used a Hydrive HX112 for a while now and wanted to buy another one. Since it has been replaced by the HD112, another HX is very difficult to find. So I have ordered the HD112. It is still in a delivery process, but what do you think of using them together? As you described, there are some differences. What do you think?
Hi Walter,
I think you should be more than fine, the HD sounds to my ears just a bit punchy/warm on the lows but mids and highs are still similar to the HX lines.
Depending on your head, you can experiment two ways of use them.
The first is try to "balance" the tone, for example using the HD as the top cab and the HX as the sub one, in this way you should get a similar tone from both of them, the top will have less lows and the sub will get a bit of the fat tone using the ground as "acoustic room".
Or you can use the HX on the top to get mo clean and hifi tone and the HD as the sub. For example when I use them with the LH 1000 I usually use them in stereo mode with the balance control more on the top cab.
if you need more help or more info just let me know.
Ciao. Enrico
I think you should be more than fine, the HD sounds to my ears just a bit punchy/warm on the lows but mids and highs are still similar to the HX lines.
Depending on your head, you can experiment two ways of use them.
The first is try to "balance" the tone, for example using the HD as the top cab and the HX as the sub one, in this way you should get a similar tone from both of them, the top will have less lows and the sub will get a bit of the fat tone using the ground as "acoustic room".
Or you can use the HX on the top to get mo clean and hifi tone and the HD as the sub. For example when I use them with the LH 1000 I usually use them in stereo mode with the balance control more on the top cab.
if you need more help or more info just let me know.
Ciao. Enrico
Hi Enrico, thanks for the great advice! By the way, I will be using it with an Ashdown RM 500. I also have an old ABM 300 but the thing is heavy! As are my Ashdown ABM 410 and 115 cabs. That's why I have changed to lighter and more compact gear. Cheers!
Last edited:
Hi, i have a question to you about hartke tx600 and hd112. I have tx600 and i want to connect it with 2 x hd112 soon. What ohms should i put on each cab to set it properlly ? As i know tx is can cower automaticly 4 or 8 ohm cab.
Hi nilorius, as written from dbase, connecting the two hd112 in bridge mode on the tx600, you need to set each cab at 8 ohms. Even if you want to use the head with just one cab you have to set to 8ohms, it will be a bit outpowered but if you don't work with high volume, the cab can handle smoothly.
Ciao. Enrico
I don't play a 5 string but every video I watch that hd112 puts out some serious low end, like a 15" w/ more clarity.
