Has anyone bought and NOT liked a Sadowsky??

[lomo]

Speaking from experience, I can say that Sadowsky owners may irk Non-Sadowsky types because they are so utterfly confident in their basses. They can sound sometimes like religious fundamentalists.

I think people who don't or can't own Sadowskys should just be happy for them. Like a religion, it is a wonderful when something helps you live your life and helps you make sense of what it is you do.

Like religion, Sadowskys will not light everyone's path, but for those who are lifted by owning one, more power to you!

Wise words from the Dr. I'd like to add that what can be irksome to me (and many) about any form of fundamentalism (religious or bass-related) is the all too frequent assertion by the believer that what he believes is an objective, absolute truth. Sads are great basses. Whether they are great for an individual is simply a matter of personal preference.

 

[Mike]

I've played many Sad's and once owned a Metro. They're great instruments all the way around in tone, build quality and detail. But, like everything, it's a matter of taste. I find strictly passive basses appeal to me more and, as of late, have been all over the new and improved American Standard series from Fender- P's and J's. Never would I have dreamt this just one short year ago...

 

[Boombass76]

I have owned three Sadowsky basses. An RJ5 (Tokyo 5-string Jazz), a NYC Vintage Jazz (4-string) and a MV4-HPJ (hybrid P/J 4-string).

In terms of build quality, there were all equally great! All could be setup to a low action with zero buzzing and still have a full tone – not many basses can do that as good as Sadowsky!

Tonally, they were quite different. The 5-string never really made it in the mix for me – and the B-string was not as impressive as I thought based on the many quotes in here. The other two were great, only they were not 5-string basses, which I preferred at the time.

In fact, my overall favorite among the three was the Metro. It had a unique voice, and it sounded amazing using the P-pickup only. The J-pickup soloed gave a very nice Jaco bite, and mixed, it sounded kinda jazz, but not quite (obviously!). Overall, a great bass that performed well in the mix (especially as a P-bass). However, even though I mention J, P and Jaco, I don’t draw any parallels to Fender at all. And that is exactly the reason I don’t have a Sadowsky today. I prefer the true vintage Fender sound, and that, you will never get from a Sadowsky. You will get a whole bunch of other things and a different kind of tonal greatness, though

For instance, Sadowsky build quality and fret work is second to none!

I guess what I am trying to say is that even though I respect Sadowsky basses and recognize that many love them, they were not the right basses for me! But that doesn't mean that i dislike them as such

 

[Hoover]

But when FOH engineers comment one way or the next, I listen and take note.

This. Ironically, I first heard about Sadowsky basses from other recording engineers, not other bassists. Several engineering friends as well as a number of nationally-known engineers all started dropping the name "Sadowsky" as being a brand of bass that when it shows up in the studio you don't have to do anything to it to get it to sound great.

 

[HMZ]

Had a Metros and a Fender mia....I kept the Fender and sold the Metro...

 

[Chasarms]

. . . .4) For those who think the Sadowsky B-string is lacking, what planet are you living on? Just kidding... but that one is VERY hard for me to understand. That's part of the Sadowsky mojo that comes close to voodoo for me - none of the other 5 strings I've EVER played with the single exception of Dingwalls and one very cool Zon could compete with the B on any of the Sadowskys I've played. Including most of the 35" scale basses. . . .

I guess it all depends on what you want out of those notes and what your tone goals are. All I can say is that I haven't owned 100 basses, but I have literally gone through dozens in the past several years using the same method you describe.

The Sadowsky B is fine. It is as solid as any 34" bass I have ever played. Probably the most solid. Further, the way Sadowsky has designed the geometry of the five string neck is a beautiful thing. They are a joy to play. But, among my other "top end" experiments, I would have to say the the Sadowsky B was the weakest. Those basses include Lakland JO5, Pedulla Rapture JJ, Modulus (Quantum and Genesis), Roscoe, MTD and now Dingwall. It's not that the Sadowsky B is bad, but IME, it does have a SLIGHT sense of the 4+1 character that I always got from some the Fender basses I wanted to love but never fully could.

I ABSOLUTELY wish it were not the case. If it were otherwise, I would still have them and be enjoying the MANY, MANY other things I absolutely loved about my Sadowskys. There were certain settings on the Sadowskys I had that are absolutely tone Nirvana. (especially the PJ5) But, when playing a big Gospel R&B number, and I want a low Eb to rattle the stage for two tied whole notes at 70-80 bpm, the Sadowskys simply wouldn't do it anywhere nearly as well as a Quantum or my ABII. It's not even close.

Further, there was a modest variance in the tone and texture of the B string notes on the Sadowskys that didn't happen to the same extent on some of the other basses and does happen AT ALL on the Dingwalls. I also have the added benefit that I am able to play B string notes higher up on the neck with greater confidence on both of the Dingwall basses I own.

If I was mostly or exclusively limited to rock/pop genres, I would have almost certainly have stuck with the Sadowskys. I think that is what they are designed for and no question what they do as well as or maybe better than anything else out there. But, there are plenty of reasons why other makers are cranking stuff out as well.

 

[KJung]

I guess it all depends on what you want out of those notes and what your tone goals are. All I can say is that I haven't owned 100 basses, but I have literally gone through dozens in the past several years using the same method you describe.

The Sadowsky B is fine. It is as solid as any 34" bass I have ever played. Probably the most solid. Further, the way Sadowsky has designed the geometry of the five string neck is a beautiful thing. They are a joy to play. But, among my other "top end" experiments, I would have to say the the Sadowsky B was the weakest. Those basses include Lakland JO5, Pedulla Rapture JJ, Modulus (Quantum and Genesis), Roscoe, MTD and now Dingwall. It's not that the Sadowsky B is bad, but IME, it does have a SLIGHT sense of the 4+1 character that I always got from some the Fender basses I wanted to love but never fully could.

I ABSOLUTELY wish it were not the case. If it were otherwise, I would still have them and be enjoying the MANY, MANY other things I absolutely loved about my Sadowskys. There were certain settings on the Sadowskys I had that are absolutely tone Nirvana. (especially the PJ5) But, when playing a big Gospel R&B number, and I want a low Eb to rattle the stage for two tied whole notes at 70-80 bpm, the Sadowskys simply wouldn't do it anywhere nearly as well as a Quantum or my ABII. It's not even close.

Further, there was a modest variance in the tone and texture of the B string notes on the Sadowskys that didn't happen to the same extent on some of the other basses and does happen AT ALL on the Dingwalls. I also have the added benefit that I am able to play B string notes higher up on the neck with greater confidence on both of the Dingwall basses I own.

If I was mostly or exclusively limited to rock/pop genres, I would have almost certainly have stuck with the Sadowskys. I think that is what they are designed for and no question what they do as well as or maybe better than anything else out there. But, there are plenty of reasons why other makers are cranking stuff out as well.

Good post. I've commented on the kind of 'different natures of B strings' a few times on the site, and this is a good summary.

I find it isn't so much the scale length as the pickup type and placement. For example, the B strings on the Sadowsky Moderns, with those big humbuckers sitting right on the bridge, is as big and forceful and huge as any B I've ever heard (having owned and gigged MTD's and even a Modulus back in the day).

However, on the J type models, the B string is, as I describe it, more of a 'logical extension of the E string', versus that 'HE"S PLAYING ON THE B STRING" sort of massive thing like on the Roscoe's, etc. that I've played.

For my pop/funk playing, I prefer the Sadowsky/Alleva-Coppolo type B string... just sounds like the E string with a few lower notes. I can see where some would want that much bigger, more 'fundamental oriented' B string tone of a bass with big soapbars (like the Sadowksy Modern or MTD).

 

[OPBASSMAN1994]

Never owned one, but played one. It just didn't feel right. It felt like just another J-bass copy. Didn't stack up to my jazz, and it's a SQUIER.

 

[Chasarms]

. . . However, on the J type models, the B string is, as I describe it, more of a 'logical extension of the E string', versus that 'HE"S PLAYING ON THE B STRING" sort of massive thing like on the Roscoe's, etc. that I've played. . .

I actually want BOTH!!!! I think that is why I am so impressed with the Dingwall basses. I get a sustain, texture and tone on the B that sounds as close to E string as I can imagine is possible and still get a ton of power and fundamental.

Sure if I hammer the B, I want to startle the elderly and frighten small children, but I don't want a lot of the "he's playing on the B string." I actually do want a degree of continuity in the notes.

It is my experience that the Sadowskys are fairly continuous but lose some degree of power and sustain. The Modulus has the power and sustain, but maybe a bit too much of the "he's on the B string" vibe. My ABII, and really even my Super J for the most part, have the right balance.

BTW, the last couple of gigs I have played my passive Dingwall Super J5 through my outboard Sadowsky preamp. I could write a lot about that experience. In short, I'll just say that it's pretty cool.

 

[MikeBass]

Good post. I've commented on the kind of 'different natures of B strings' a few times on the site, and this is a good summary.

I find it isn't so much the scale length as the pickup type and placement. For example, the B strings on the Sadowsky Moderns, with those big humbuckers sitting right on the bridge, is as big and forceful and huge as any B I've ever heard (having owned and gigged MTD's and even a Modulus back in the day).

However, on the J type models, the B string is, as I describe it, more of a 'logical extension of the E string', versus that 'HE"S PLAYING ON THE B STRING" sort of massive thing like on the Roscoe's, etc. that I've played.

For my pop/funk playing, I prefer the Sadowsky/Alleva-Coppolo type B string... just sounds like the E string with a few lower notes. I can see where some would want that much bigger, more 'fundamental oriented' B string tone of a bass with big soapbars (like the Sadowksy Modern or MTD).

Besides Dingwall, and maybe Smith (mostly because of Smith tone I would guess) almost every bass I've owned there is some difference from the E to the B.
Dingwall IMO is on a whole different level. Their B string is by far, again IMO, the best I ever heard.

Now, HOW noticable it is, well that's a COMPLETELY different thread.
I'm speaking only when sitting in front of my amp by myself can I really tell. And again, it may only be slight.

 

[KJung]

I actually want BOTH!!!! I think that is why I am so impressed with the Dingwall basses. I get a sustain, texture and tone on the B that sounds as close to E string as I can imagine is possible and still get a ton of power and fundamental.

Sure if I hammer the B, I want to startle the elderly and frighten small children, but I don't want a lot of the "he's playing on the B string." I actually do want a degree of continuity in the notes.

It is my experience that the Sadowskys are fairly continuous but lose some degree of power and sustain. The Modulus has the power and sustain, but maybe a bit too much of the "he's on the B string" vibe. My ABII, and really even my Super J for the most part, have the right balance.

BTW, the last couple of gigs I have played my passive Dingwall Super J5 through my outboard Sadowsky preamp. I could write a lot about that experience. In short, I'll just say that it's pretty cool.

The Dingwalls are not my thing, but I agree, they are very, very nice, and very even sounding.

I again, find my Sadowsky and Alleva E and B strings perfectly balanced, but agree that neither the E nor B strings are as 'big' sounding as most of the high end soapbar loaded basses, including the Sadowsky Modern. Just a different deal there for different tone goals.

A passive 1962 Fender J E string sounds nothing like a Modulus E string, but I like it much better in the mixes and contexts I play in. That is more of the vibe of the E and B strings on most of the 'J inspired' instruments. Just a different thing. Actually, the B string response was one of the reasons I moved away from the more modern sounding instruments like my Modulus and MTD. Different strokes!

Edit: GREAT discussion here IMO, and it hopefully makes clear to the OP that there are massive differences across almost every line of basses, and it isn't a 'good versus bad' thing, but rather finding the voice that matches your context and tone goals. Once you get up to the Sadowsky, Modulus, MTD level of components and construction, it becomes all about tone differences, and neck feel IMO.

 

[Boombass76]

The B-strings of the Sads, I have played have been dealbreaking for me. They just didn't cut it! I borrowed a NYC vintage Jazz 5-string for a gig a few years back, and when I switched to it from my Celinder J-Update 5, I simply disappeared in the mix... OK, I admit that the rig was set up for my Celinder, but still it was just awful - especially when using the B-string...

The Tokyo RJ5 I bought later on had the same problem... I did love my Metro MV4-HPJ, though...

 

[KJung]

The B-strings of the Sads, I have played have been dealbreaking for me. They just didn't cut it! I borrowed a NYC vintage Jazz 5-string for a gig a few years back, and when I switched to it from my Celinder J-Update 5, I simply disappeared in the mix... OK, I admit that the rig was set up for my Celinder, but still it was just awful - especially when using the B-string...

The Tokyo RJ5 I bought later on had the same problem... I did love my Metro MV4-HPJ, though...

I had pretty much the opposite experience with my two Celinder 5 updates and my Sadowsky's, but again, I agree, they sounded different, with the humcancelling pickups and VERY aggressive preamp (super deep bass voicing) of the Celinder resulting in a 'bigger' B string sound (more fundamental, versus the 'easily hearing the windings' on the B string of my Sadowsky basses). Again, different strokes!

As a side note, I also like my Sadowsky J MUCH better with the optional single coil J pickups than the stock HC's, so that is another variant that needs to be controlled for when evaluating these instruments. I've played some ash/maple Metro's with the stock HC pickups that where just awful to my ear... clacky up top, boomy but no punch down low.

 

[rockstarbassist]

I bought a black/maple Metro M24 5 string and kept it a little bit, but just didn't "fit" with me.
As a bass to actually keep in the stable it would've been nice, but as my #1 player, just didn't jive. Course, nothing with a Fender-ish neck does with me, so no surprise.
Sound was pretty FTW though. Was about as impressive an import as I've ever held though. Easily on par with the Spector NS4/5CRFMs.

I'd actually to try one out again in the future. Def had close to the sound I was after w/ the pickup and onboard controls.

 

[Chasarms]

. . .Dingwall IMO is on a whole different level. Their B string is by far, again IMO, the best I ever heard.

Now, HOW noticable it is, well that's a COMPLETELY different thread.
I'm speaking only when sitting in front of my amp by myself can I really tell. And again, it may only be slight.

When playing passing and pickup notes, it probably isn't very noticable at all. When playing big modern R&B and AC ballads, I think it is much more so. So the degree to which you have interest in and play that kind of music or other forms in which those notes are more "exposed", is probably the degree to which it matters.

 

[MikeBass]

I actually want BOTH!!!! I think that is why I am so impressed with the Dingwall basses. I get a sustain, texture and tone on the B that sounds as close to E string as I can imagine is possible and still get a ton of power and fundamental.

Sure if I hammer the B, I want to startle the elderly and frighten small children, but I don't want a lot of the "he's playing on the B string." I actually do want a degree of continuity in the notes.

It is my experience that the Sadowskys are fairly continuous but lose some degree of power and sustain. The Modulus has the power and sustain, but maybe a bit too much of the "he's on the B string" vibe. My ABII, and really even my Super J for the most part, have the right balance.

BTW, the last couple of gigs I have played my passive Dingwall Super J5 through my outboard Sadowsky preamp. I could write a lot about that experience. In short, I'll just say that it's pretty cool.

I would own a Sadowsky right now if it wasn't for my "need" for a 6 (plus I'm kinda liking the bit of extended range for the moment).

Actually, I would really REALLY love to gig a Dingwall. But I'm just nervous about the fanned fret thing up high.
Yes, I know I shouldn't play up there, but I do. Get over it...

You need to start a thread about the Dingy with the Sad pre-amp....love to hear about that.

 

[Boombass76]

I had pretty much the opposite experience with my two Celinder 5 updates and my Sadowsky's, but again, I agree, they sounded different, with the humcancelling pickups and VERY aggressive preamp (super deep bass voicing) of the Celinder resulting in a 'bigger' B string sound (more fundamental, versus the 'easily hearing the windings' on the B string of my Sadowsky basses). Again, different strokes!

As a side note, I also like my Sadowsky J MUCH better with the optional single coil J pickups than the stock HC's, so that is another variant that needs to be controlled for when evaluating these instruments. I've played some ash/maple Metro's with the stock HC pickups that where just awful to my ear... clacky up top, boomy but no punch down low.

Yeah, HC vs. SC makes quite a difference. Oh, and I should note that the Celinder I had back then was the 'old' model with the CP-I preamp which sounded very different from the CP-III aka Greengrove.

It was not nearly as boomy and the mids were more pronounced, which could have something to do with the amp set for a bass with string mids and then pluggin in a Sadowsky with HC pickups...

 

[jackcheez]

I saw a beauty in a local shop. An MS5. Played it and was falling in love... until I came upon a dead spot. The A string around the 8th fret.

A LOUD dead spot.

I was ready to slap down $2,500 on this thing but that killed it for me.

 

[Hoover]

'logical extension of the E string', versus that 'HE"S PLAYING ON THE B STRING"

I get a sustain, texture and tone on the B that sounds as close to E string as I can imagine is possible and still get a ton of power and fundamental...[snip]...I don't want a lot of the "he's playing on the B string." I actually do want a degree of continuity in the notes.

almost every bass I've owned there is some difference from the E to the B.

Warning, Thread Drift!

About ten years ago I penned an article for Recording Magazine called "Taming The 5-String Bass" that identified this disparity, this lack-of-sonic-continuity between the E string & the B string, as the #1 shortcoming in most extended range basses. It really is the element that Separates The Men From The Boys imho. An instrument where you can play a 4th string/1st fret F and then a 5th string 4th fret Eb and have those two notes sound "of a part", cut from the same timbral fabric, not have a listener go "huh? what just happened?" is a rare but beautiful thing.

 

[Chasarms]

. . . Actually, I would really REALLY love to gig a Dingwall. But I'm just nervous about the fanned fret thing up high.
Yes, I know I shouldn't play up there, but I do. Get over it...

You need to start a thread about the Dingy with the Sad pre-amp....love to hear about that.

Not going stear this thread OT, but I would say that the fanned fret issue is not a big deal at all. I tend to go up high (and get back quickly before anyone notices ) every once in a while and it hasn't stopped me at all.

As for the Sadowsky pre, I will try to share some thoughts on that. Probably over at the Dingwall thread.