Help with MIDI switcher choice?

[smo]

Hi guys & gals,

I love pedals, and I'd like to branch out into MIDI.
I'm looking for a programmable loop/MIDI switcher for not only MIDI pedals, but also analog non-MIDI pedals.

About me;
This switcher would be for a stay-at-home / recording / rehearsal / fun board. Read: Ridiculous
I have Strymon Mobius, Future Impact, Bass Whammy, Hog2 and a couple others. These are MIDI pedals I've collected, not intentionally for MIDI, just organically, that are either too large or seldomly used on my gigging bass board. I have plenty of analog pedals too. I intend to play both guitar and bass through this board, so I thought a MIDI switcher could help me simply switch banks from guitar settings to bass settings.

So far I'm looking at the BOSS ES-5 & 8, RJM PBC 6X, GIGRIG G2, Disaster Area DPC-8EZ & DPC-5 & Musicomlab EFX-LE. Of course a few others too, but I'm favouring controllers that can incorporate analog pedals into the loops.

Anyone used any of these? Anyone able to offer any comparison information?
I'm looking for ease of use, being able to change things on the fly relatively speaking, and hopefully being able to copy patches/presets from one bank to another without too much effort.

Cheers

 

[GMC]

I can only vouch for the Boss ES-5. It's quite small compared to the ES-8...but less loops, no stereo though and you loose a 2nd expression pedal option (or singe expression and extra 2 aux buttons). Plus you loose the fantastic expression loop. However....it's a LOT smaller and in the post Midi world...how many loops do you need? The ability to swap the order of the loops is a massive benefit in the Boss world. If it was a stay at home rig...then I'd go for the ES-8 and have the best and biggest available. If like me...space is at a premium and this rig also needs to be gigged with...then the ES-5 is an excellent compromise.

I use mine with a
Loop 1: Source Audio C4 & EBS Multi Comp
Loop 2: EHX Hog2
Loop 3: ZFx Mastotron and Source Audio Aftershock
Loop 4: Primary Eventide H9 Max,
Loop 5: Strymon Mobius
On the output I have my 2nd Eventide H9 which covers delays and verbs for me. I also use it to stereo out or split my signal (into dual mono) and line one to the desk and the other to my amp.
I love the fact that any of my 5 loops can be in any order per patch and so far I've not needed any more loops. My L1 with my C4 is the loop that I've finding that I'm moving the most. Sometimes I want my organic sounding Octaver at the beginning of my chain. Other times (when I have it as a synth in a box or as a filter) I want it just before my modulation.

 

[smo]

I can only vouch for the Boss ES-5.....it's a LOT smaller and in the post Midi world...how many loops do you need?

Your board must look pretty cool

Good question.
I'm looking at using this board to pull double duty essentially, so I would need a few loops just for guitar drives etc. that I love. I don't have MIDI dirt pedals, but that may change....

How good is the Aftershock at replicating lots of old fave pedals out there?

 

[smo]

Anyone else with MIDI switcher experience?

 

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Anyone else with MIDI switcher experience?

Not with these, sorry. I had one of the early MusicomLabs and it worked fine, but generally I’ve handled switching pedals with general MIDI foot controllers and outboard MIDI-controlled loop boxes.

 

[GMC]

Your board must look pretty cool

Good question.
I'm looking at using this board to pull double duty essentially, so I would need a few loops just for guitar drives etc. that I love. I don't have MIDI dirt pedals, but that may change....

How good is the Aftershock at replicating lots of old fave pedals out there?

Here's my current board layout. Yeah, I like it

I really like the Aftershock. But it needs to be set up with a Neuro Hub to access the 128 patches and midi capability. It's pretty good at modelling generic classics like Muffs, Rats, Klones, etc. While some xotic clones might have a bit more charector, it pretty much nails 99% of my dirt needs. I still have a Mastotron on my board as I can't seem to simulate that particular pedal.

 

[mdalamond]

Not sure if it’s what your looking for but have a look at the Morningstar. MC6 controller and ML5 loop switcher.

 

[smo]

Here's my current board layout. Yeah, I like it
View attachment 3595522
I really like the Aftershock. But it needs to be set up with a Neuro Hub to access the 128 patches and midi capability. It's pretty good at modelling generic classics like Muffs, Rats, Klones, etc. While some xotic clones might have a bit more charector, it pretty much nails 99% of my dirt needs. I still have a Mastotron on my board as I can't seem to simulate that particular pedal.

Ok cool - this is useful info. Thanks. I'm gonna have to take a good look at this one. I already have a Future Impact, so not looking for the C4, but the Aftershock could definitely shrink my board substantially. My board is for dual-duty for guitar and bass generally, so it would be interesting to see how close the Aftershock can get to all my analog dirt pedals.

Do you use the H9's to cover octave tones?

Not sure if it’s what your looking for but have a look at the Morningstar. MC6 controller and ML5 loop switcher.

Thanks. Yeah I've seen that one in that config too. Definitely considering it aswell. This combo is about the same price as the Boss ES-5 where I live, so it's definitely one I'll consider.

 

[GMC]

Do you use the H9's to cover octave tones?

.

Actually, my Source Audio C4 does a pretty amazing digital recreation of an OC-2. It's easily the most analogue sounding digital octaver ever built, but it's also an amazing filter(s) and a synth. Octave / harmony / pitch wise...I can use a H9, Hog2 or my C4. I kind of like specific sounds on each device. While they all can do similar things, they all offer different sound pallets. The Hog2 has freeze and gliss options and the filter sliders make a really nice mellow and slow sound.
A H9 is way more than a pitch based pedal. It has a very nice new synth algorithm, some of the best delays and verbs in the business...and the Chorus and modulation is pretty killer too. An H9 is a box of top draw everything.
I use two, one early in my chain and one on the out put for verbs, synths and delays. Filter wise, I can use a H9, C4 or my Mobius. My preference is my C4. Modulation wise, I can use my C4, H9 or Mobius depending on the sound I want. Although my main go-to is my Mobius. Dirt can be done by either my C4, Aftershock or H9. But primarily my Aftershock.
I like my options.

 

[HelpImaRock]

Actually, my Source Audio C4 does a pretty amazing digital recreation of an OC-2. It's easily the most analogue sounding digital octaver ever built, but it's also an amazing filter(s) and a synth. Octave / harmony / pitch wise...I can use a H9, Hog2 or my C4. I kind of like specific sounds on each device. While they all can do similar things, they all offer different sound pallets. The Hog2 has freeze and gliss options and the filter sliders make a really nice mellow and slow sound.
A H9 is way more than a pitch based pedal. It has a very nice new synth algorithm, some of the best delays and verbs in the business...and the Chorus and modulation is pretty killer too. An H9 is a box of top draw everything.
I use two, one early in my chain and one on the out put for verbs, synths and delays. Filter wise, I can use a H9, C4 or my Mobius. My preference is my C4. Modulation wise, I can use my C4, H9 or Mobius depending on the sound I want. Although my main go-to is my Mobius. Dirt can be done by either my C4, Aftershock or H9. But primarily my Aftershock.
I like my options.

How does the pitch shifting/harmonizing in the C4 compare to the H9?

 

[GMC]

How does the pitch shifting/harmonizing in the C4 compare to the H9?

The H9 is far more accessible and a wide array of tones. It's got so many great Algorithms to choose from and a massive history of great and usable sounds. Adding a delayed 7th is really easy. But, the C4 can make analogue octave sounds that the H9 can't dream of. Both need to be edited using a USB connection to a phone / ipad or Laptop. The C4 needs Midi to access more than the stock 6 presets...and it really works best with something like a Boss ES-5 where you can label each patch and call various midi units. The H9 has 99 patch bays that can be selected using an up or down button. So again, Midi calling is the way forwards. However, the H9 is easier to call up patches due to the large LED screen. It's got less control though...one knob and 4 selectors....but it's a bit like setting up 99 presets. Everything is customization once it's edited via bluetooth / usb. Pedals like Strymon are easier than the Eventide H9 to tweek settings on the fly...but it's really quick to edit the H9 on my phone. The C4 has four great control knobs and two additional functions...so it's easy to adjust on the fly as long as you've sent time in the editor to choose useful functions assigned to the various knobs. The C4 also has the advantage of an awful lot of community downloadable patches...some of which are amazing. I haven't delved into the C4's step filter but I've downloaded 4 killer patches that are a lot of fun and sound great. I could program something identical into my H9's Armadillo....but I've not got my head around it yet. The Hog2 has another take on the whole harmoniser thang too.
So like many similar pedals, they might do similar things but they sound different, behave different and have vastly different user interfaces.

 

[HelpImaRock]

The H9 is far more accessible and a wide array of tones. It's got so many great Algorithms to choose from and a massive history of great and usable sounds. Adding a delayed 7th is really easy. But, the C4 can make analogue octave sounds that the H9 can't dream of. Both need to be edited using a USB connection to a phone / ipad or Laptop. The C4 needs Midi to access more than the stock 6 presets...and it really works best with something like a Boss ES-5 where you can label each patch and call various midi units. The H9 has 99 patch bays that can be selected using an up or down button. So again, Midi calling is the way forwards. However, the H9 is easier to call up patches due to the large LED screen. It's got less control though...one knob and 4 selectors....but it's a bit like setting up 99 presets. Everything is customization once it's edited via bluetooth / usb. Pedals like Strymon are easier than the Eventide H9 to tweek settings on the fly...but it's really quick to edit the H9 on my phone. The C4 has four great control knobs and two additional functions...so it's easy to adjust on the fly as long as you've sent time in the editor to choose useful functions assigned to the various knobs. The C4 also has the advantage of an awful lot of community downloadable patches...some of which are amazing. I haven't delved into the C4's step filter but I've downloaded 4 killer patches that are a lot of fun and sound great. I could program something identical into my H9's Armadillo....but I've not got my head around it yet. The Hog2 has another take on the whole harmoniser thang too.
So like many similar pedals, they might do similar things but they sound different, behave different and have vastly different user interfaces.

I'm still using an Eventide Pitchfactor. But it's synth sounds aren't great and I feel like I could program everything I needed into the C4 for both bass and guitar, so long as I can still get the harmonized voicings.

 

[sunbeast]

The H9 is far more accessible and a wide array of tones. It's got so many great Algorithms to choose from and a massive history of great and usable sounds. Adding a delayed 7th is really easy. But, the C4 can make analogue octave sounds that the H9 can't dream of. Both need to be edited using a USB connection to a phone / ipad or Laptop. The C4 needs Midi to access more than the stock 6 presets...and it really works best with something like a Boss ES-5 where you can label each patch and call various midi units. The H9 has 99 patch bays that can be selected using an up or down button. So again, Midi calling is the way forwards. However, the H9 is easier to call up patches due to the large LED screen. It's got less control though...one knob and 4 selectors....but it's a bit like setting up 99 presets. Everything is customization once it's edited via bluetooth / usb. Pedals like Strymon are easier than the Eventide H9 to tweek settings on the fly...but it's really quick to edit the H9 on my phone. The C4 has four great control knobs and two additional functions...so it's easy to adjust on the fly as long as you've sent time in the editor to choose useful functions assigned to the various knobs. The C4 also has the advantage of an awful lot of community downloadable patches...some of which are amazing. I haven't delved into the C4's step filter but I've downloaded 4 killer patches that are a lot of fun and sound great. I could program something identical into my H9's Armadillo....but I've not got my head around it yet. The Hog2 has another take on the whole harmoniser thang too.
So like many similar pedals, they might do similar things but they sound different, behave different and have vastly different user interfaces.

can you use the ES-5 to scroll through presets on an individual pedal? I haven't seen this about the Boss

 

[cosmicevan]

ES-8 all day. I have just discoveted the power of reassigning switches per patch which means I can take over all the buttons to do different things including sending MIDI...and then make a button that sets everything back to normal for patch selection.

I keep my MIDI pedals out of the ES-8 or group them in a single patch so I can reorder because I can control them via MIDI and not have to rely on the ES loops keeping them always on.

ES-8 is so powerful. You can make a single distortion patch that within the patch you can stack and reorder stuff by reassinging the buttons to do up to 12 things...even turn on/off LEDs.

 

[GMC]

can you use the ES-5 to scroll through presets on an individual pedal? I haven't seen this about the Boss

You can on the ES-5 but un-assigning the Mute or bank switches and assigning a Midi CC message to the pedal you want to cycle through. This works per patch on the ES-5. However...the ES-5 only has 2 top buttons (bank and Mute). You can re-assign the 5 patch number buttons...but that's a crazy idea (although it's ok to re-use the patch number, then it sends a 2nd midi CC on a second press).
The ES-5 has a single stereo input / control jack that allows either an Expression in (converting to expression over midi - which is way cool) or two external buttons in. If you choose the latter then yes you can custom midi assign these two buttons to a page up / down via midi CC for each patch on the ES-5. The Boss ES-8 is better in this regards...you can have TWO expression pedals...or an expression pedal and 2 external buttons. But that's a much bigger and expensive unit.

 

[doran.dragic]

I used to own an ES-8 which I sold and I'm using MusicomLAB EFX-LE at the moment.

Boss ES-8 does a lot of great things, but it took a lot of effort to learn to programme it. Also worth mentioning - it was my first switcher and I'm not a tech guy so maybe this is just me being stupid.

I find the manual not particularly user friendly and some of the videos on Youtube are complete garbage (EytschPi42). It was also to big for me so I decided I was going to get a different looper. The software is good and copying banks and patches is easy and fast.

ES-5 has less features and no stereo output which was an issue for me, so I decided to get the MusicomLAB EFX-LE (same size as ES-5, but with stereo output). I find it easy to programme and the software is good.

If size is not an issue and if you're ready to invest some time, the Boss ES-8 would likely be a great choice. MusicomLAB MK-V would obviously be another alternative. If I'd be buying a bigger switcher again I'd most likely get the MusicomLAB. Their customer support was great so far which I can not say for Boss (at least where I'm from). On the other hand, there's much more material available on the Boss products, including Youtube videos and an excellent Facebook group. If I didn't find that group I'd most likely end up burning the ES-8.

If you're looking to get a smaller switcher than than the MusicomLab EFX-LE offers more compared to the Boss ES-5.

 

[yberwaffe]

Morningstar is releasing the MC-8 soon.
Just saying...