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How do you play covers with many fills/variations live?

#61
Gravedigger Dav said:
Some would say that those who have to learn it note for note have no creativity.
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The age old debate. People who learn note for note have no creativity. People that don't learn note for note are lazy. There's probably a little bit of both going on.

Just my two cents, but if you are in a cover band trying to maximize income, you should learn the songs closer to the original recording. If you are just in it for fun and/or to make music, I wouldn't worry as much.

As to the audience or other musicians noticing, I know for a fact that many musicians don't notice. There have been many, many times over the years I've been told by people I played with that I nailed a part that I knew wasn't exactly right. To think that most non-musicians can tell the difference between a part played close and a part played exact is really just silly.
 
#63
I really don't care how anyone does it. What I object to is the condescending nature of the posts by the note for note aficionados.
As to earning money, for a weekend warrior bar band, we do pretty well. I average a little of $400 a month. In the early 70s, the band I was with was the second highest earning band in the Tidewater Virginia area. The only band that beat us was Bill Deal and the Rhondels. His band had several national hits.
 
#64
noagreement said:
All of this talk about Big Macs is making me hungry ...
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lol, me too.

I don't like it much, but that analogy is sadly appropriate. I've spent most of my time as an entertainer in the mainstream pop/rock/funk/cross-over country world. I made a decent living wage as a mobile DJ for about eight years, specializing in upscale events (weddings, corporate, etc.). I vividly remember a few times I tried to field a request by cleverly playing an alternate version of a song (live, re-mixed, cover version, extended mix). It seems my cleverness was not so well appreciated by the clients and their guests. A couple of times I cleared the dance floor, the kiss of death for a DJ. At least once the person who made the request was visibly angry at me and loudly inquired why the hell I wasn't playing "the REAL song?!?!?!?!"

Big Macs indeed.
 
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#65
electracoyote said:
Sheesh. I don't play "Mustang Sally" to be a creative artist, and I feel sad for any mainstream pop cover band musician who perceives themselves that way. I play it to be an entertainer, it gets girls shaking their asses on the dance floor, sells food and beverages, and gets me the most money I can squeeze out of the venue owner. I think the bass player on the Wilson Pickett hit recording plays it just fine, I'm certainly no more "creative" than he was or I'd be getting calls to track my bass lines on hit records. It was also played well enough for the bass player on The Commitments hit version, and for the mainstream audience that has it pretty much memorized by now.

No, I don't have to learn "Mustang Sally" note-for-note by any means. I could Billy Sheehan Victor Wooten that thing up if I wanted to. I choose to play it faithful out of respect for the original line, what it brought to the arrangement on the hit recording, and the audience who isn't nearly as stupid as some people think.
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Feel sad all you want. Maybe we have a different definition of creativity. I play Mustang Sally almost exactly like the Commitment version, but there are a couple of places I change it because I like it better the way I do it. And I feel sad for anyone who thinks when I do a chromatic run from the low E to the F an octave above the audience knows I'm doing it differently.
 
#66
Gravedigger Dav said:
What I object to is the condescending nature of the posts by the note for note aficionados.
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The condescension can go both ways, and the feeling is mutual.

I'm sure your band is doing quite well and glad to hear it, regardless of how faithful you are (or aren't) to the songs you choose. There is certainly more than one way to skin this cat, and a band that can really "own" the material and present it in a compelling way will succeed in being great entertainers with all the perks that go with it.

It takes really good players who communicate excellently. From what I've seen, that's kind of rare, but we have a few in the Denver area as well.

We also have many more bands who think they have that kind of musicianship and communication, and they just don't, and it shows in the type and frequency of gigs they take.
 
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#67
Gravedigger Dav said:
And I feel sad for anyone who thinks when I do a chromatic run from the low E to the F an octave above the audience knows I'm doing it differently.
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I'm sure we've both spent enough time in the audience and getting audience member's reactions to make our own conclusions about that. I know I have.

Usually, it's not a once-in-a-while variation. It's a chronic tendency that gets the audience's attention in a not-so-good way. They can't always tell me in detail what's wrong, but they will say it sounds different and like someone's making it up and doesn't really know the song.

It sounds like that's not the case with you, so kudos.

Also, as I mentioned above, it usually involves not one, but two or more musicians getting just a tad too "creative" and suddenly the arrangement goes to hell. The individual "creativities" are not compatible and don't fit well together. Audiences definitely pick up on that when it involves songs they know like the back of their hands.
 
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#68
Gravedigger Dav said:
I really don't care how anyone does it. What I object to is the condescending nature of the posts by the note for note aficionados.
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And they aren't doing it either. ;)

Let's have some of the 100% note for note aficionados post a youtube video of them playing an entire set note for note. We'll soon hear the excuses why they couldn't do it for this song, or that song.
 
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#76
JRA said:
do you suppose the OP left the building?
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OP still there :) It's great to see different opinions. Just to set the record straight, I never mentioned I play every tune note for note. I said I like learning the tunes like that because that way you get a feeling of how the song (or bassline in this specific case) was "built". I am for sure not the most creative person who ever lived but I don't see it as a lack of creativity: I feel that not transcribing a tune entirely would be make me miss subtil fills or variations which I would not have come up with myself. Sometime I transcribe the tune and don't like the variations for instance, and in this case, I just come up with my own so that it sounds like to my ear
 
#77
lfmn16 said:
Let's have some of the 100% note for note aficionados post a youtube video of them playing an entire set note for note. We'll soon hear the excuses why they couldn't do it for this song, or that song.
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I had this friend in a Hard Rock band...God, 20 years ago...I go see these guys & yeah, I was impressed 'cause everything sounded 'like the record'.
Here's what he told me: They never rehearse together. Everyone is expected to learn their part 'just like the record'...they gig & it works.

Eventually, he asked me to join-
a) I like practice/rehearsals
b) I spent most of my adult playing life in R&B or in originals bands with a lot of improv/free playing
c) No way would I have the discipline to learn those tunes note-for-note...I wish I did.
:)
 
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#78
JimK said:
Here's what he told me: They never rehearse together. Everyone is expected to learn their part 'just like the record'...they gig & it works.
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My band takes the same approach and we don't have to run a song more than once or twice before it's ready to roll. Unlike you, I'm not real fond of rehearsals; I like my band mates but I have better things to do with my time than run a song that I've already heard a billion times over and over until we finally get it "right." Most of the songs on our playlist are not my personal favorites, so every additional time I have to play them without getting paid is a real chore.
 
#79
JimK said:
I had this friend in a Hard Rock band...God, 20 years ago...I go see these guys & yeah, I was impressed 'cause everything sounded 'like the record'.
Here's what he told me: They never rehearse together. Everyone is expected to learn their part 'just like the record'...they gig & it works.

Eventually, he asked me to join-
a) I like practice/rehearsals
b) I spent most of my adult playing life in R&B or in originals bands with a lot of improv/free playing
c) No way would I have the discipline to learn those tunes note-for-note...I wish I did.
:)
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I believe close, I don't believe 100%.

Even when you can play an entire song exactly like the original, it's not a given that you should. Most recordings have multiple guitars, keys, horns, background vocals, extra percussion, etc. If you play only the notes on the original recording, it still won't sound like the original. If someone wants to play as close to the record as they can get, that's their business. If they think that other musicians and the audience will notice the difference between close and exact, I think they are kidding themselves.
 
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