How often do you have PA support?

[scottbass]

-How often do you have PA support?

About half the time. The other half of the time we are playing smaller venues, bring our own PA and use it only for the vocals - and maybe the kick drum.

-Where do you typically play (small club, medium club, bar, outdoors, etc.)

All of the above, plus larger indoor venues (auditorium/concert hall/civic center, etc.)

-How many watts do you typically pack?

My "head" consists of an Ampeg tube preamp and an old Crown CE 1000 power amp. My cabs are both 4 ohm, so I can drive two cabs with 450 watts each (900 total watts) or I can bridge it to drive one cab with 1,100 watts. It's enough.

-What size/how many cabinets do you typically bring?

Small venue without PA support: single Carvin 1x15

Larger venue without PA support: Carvin 1x15 + Schroeder 2x12

Any venue with PA support: just the Schroeder 2x12

 

[BurningSkies]

if I didn't have a reputation to protect, I might put that in my sig.

I'd like to make an addendum to the question. When you do have PA support, who is running the sound? you, band member, dedicated sound guy, house sound guy?

I'll take even a marginally acceptable dedicated sound guy over a band mixing from the stage any day. At least around these parts, if the band is mixing themselves, they sound painful unless they are a true pro band, in which case they'd sound 10x better with a decent sound engineer.

Robby

In the 'old days' (meaning for me from the late 80's through late 90's) I almost always had full sound provided... unless it was an occasional house party. Often at that time I was playing some bigger rooms, 9.30 Club in DC, Mama Kin in Boston, Limelight in NYC, etc., Since about 2000 until now, it's patchy at best. Lots of times the bands I play in will be carrying a PA to cover vocals, some keys and maybe some guitar if needed. Small bars, coffee houses, benefit shows, small college gigs, I'm mostly fronting my own sound from my amp.

I would guess about 3/4ths of my gigs these days don't have me in the front of house sound. The ones that do, I've had a number tell me that my rig sounds better and have pulled me out of the front end and asked me to carry the room with my own rig.

When we carry a small PA, I run the sound from the stage. When we're in a club that has full sound, they have their own sound person for the gig. In smaller houses that do have sound but not huge, I often help the sound person get what we need out front because they're seldom a pro.

For benefit gigs, or smaller college gigs, I'll help them arrange what's happening for PA once I get there and load in...sometimes I'll volunteer part of our system for monitors or to beef up the front end, etc.

 

[oldbassplayergu]

Almost never. we play pub-restaurants, outdoor bars, last night we played a new place with a sound man. we thought, cool we don't have to lug a PA. Don't get me wrong we sounded good but, we were so loud I just could not enjoy any of it. It was like some arena rock nightmare. My ears are still ringing. I know what your thinking. Oh this guy's a wimp. I see it this way. we play to the older crowd. Lets face it classic rock is now what used to be called oldies. these people want to hear the songs they grew up with, have a beer,and be able to have a conversation with each other. not scream at the top of their lungs at one another. Cover bands are a business, and beating the #$%^&* out of the patrons is bad for business. I'm not saying all places are like this, or pa support is bad. I just think for us its overkill.

 

[JimmyM]

About half the time. The other half of the time we are playing smaller venues, bring our own PA and use it only for the vocals - and maybe the kick drum.

this i don't get. the reason for micing the kick is to get those low frequencies the kick doesn't produce by itself. but in order to make it work, you have to have a pa that's as capable on the lows as it needs to be for bass.

 

[BurningSkies]

this i don't get. the reason for micing the kick is to get those low frequencies the kick doesn't produce by itself. but in order to make it work, you have to have a pa that's as capable on the lows as it needs to be for bass.

Its usually at the request of the drummer, who most likely doesn't really understand that...or speak english (or any language for that matter) very well. I've had a lot of drummers demand kick in the PA...even when the PA is 12's on stands and I've got all the lows rolled off to keep the vocals clean.

 

[JimmyM]

Its usually at the request of the drummer, who most likely doesn't really understand that...or speak english (or any language for that matter) very well. I've had a lot of drummers demand kick in the PA...even when the PA is 12's on stands and I've got all the lows rolled off to keep the vocals clean.

you're making a good point.

 

[Robby Hoinsky]

Its usually at the request of the drummer, who most likely doesn't really understand that...or speak english (or any language for that matter) very well. I've had a lot of drummers demand kick in the PA...even when the PA is 12's on stands and I've got all the lows rolled off to keep the vocals clean.

Been there done that. Sometimes you get some click definition out of it, but it won't be hitting you in the chest like it ought to be.

The kick doesn't have to go as low as the bass, usually it is centered closer to 80 Hz, bout an octave up from low E.

If it does go as low as the bass - sweeeeeet.

Robby

 

[BurningSkies]

Been there done that. Sometimes you get some click definition out of it, but it won't be hitting you in the chest like it ought to be.

The kick doesn't have to go as low as the bass, usually it is centered closer to 80 Hz, bout an octave up from low E.

If it does go as low as the bass - sweeeeeet.

Robby

I usually hear it around 60hz when I'm mixing... But yeah, 80 works too. I do tend to roll off anything below the mids when I'm running a vocal PA though.

 

[countrybass007]

Most festivals have sound provided, but we carry a large PA with 18in. bass bins and several 15in. mains, plus five 15in. monitors and several power amps. It pays to be prepared, but 90% of the time not a must. Lots of the gear never leaves the trailer at the smaller gigs, as stage room is often very limited, and massive sound set-ups aren't needed. If you've got decent backlines and a reasonable PA everything will work out fine.

 

[Robby Hoinsky]

All this talk of PA's makes me want to run sound. I would do it for free except as will all things, the less you get paid the worse you get treated

 

[JimmyM]

Been there done that. Sometimes you get some click definition out of it, but it won't be hitting you in the chest like it ought to be.

The kick doesn't have to go as low as the bass, usually it is centered closer to 80 Hz, bout an octave up from low E.

If it does go as low as the bass - sweeeeeet.

i have seen a resurgence of the bass being the bottom instrument in a mix instead of the bass drum. but stuff like hard rock, r&b, and dance music still puts the bass in the mix at somewhere between 60 and 80 and lets the bass drum dominate on the bottom.

 

[Sundogue]

i have seen a resurgence of the bass being the bottom instrument in a mix instead of the bass drum. but stuff like hard rock, r&b, and dance music still puts the bass in the mix at somewhere between 60 and 80 and lets the bass drum dominate on the bottom.

Kick drum don't dominate in our PA!!!

I mean, it's present and kicks you in the chest, but my bass is the low end overlord.

 

[countrybass007]

Robby, I do sound for open mike night for a local charity, and they treat me great. Free somtimes works out.

 

[vivifiction]

Rarely play without PA. Very rarely we'll play a small bar and I'll just push. I run about 500W through a 4x10, easily big enough to blow out a small bar. Typically i play at medium-large venues (as in places that a few hundred people) and they always have house soundguys. Occasionally the outdoor show, but those have always had pro. sound guys run sound for the event.

 

[BassBob1]

I almost never have PA support only at legit music venues which doesn't happen often. Played a gig last night in a very large "ballroom" with out it. It was a benefit show. But I play and have played gigs from coffee house stuff to large outdoor festival type things. For the last year i have been running an SVT 7pro and 410hlf. Was more than loud enough last night. Volume was probably at about 10 o'clock. I was playing with a very would drummer, two guitars, and a keyboardist.

Hey JimmyM, play that 7pro a few more times and you probably won't need to be talked into doing a big wattage rig.

 

[TomB]

Its usually at the request of the drummer, who most likely doesn't really understand that...or speak english (or any language for that matter) very well. I've had a lot of drummers demand kick in the PA...even when the PA is 12's on stands and I've got all the lows rolled off to keep the vocals clean.

If you're running the PA, just say no. Why should drummers who don't provide the PA or band leadership get to demand anything? I do agree that there's a boundary line between vocals only and full band support where drums go in the mains and not bass, but IME it's the sound tech (on stage or off) who makes that call.

 

[JimmyM]

Hey JimmyM, play that 7pro a few more times and you probably won't need to be talked into doing a big wattage rig.

i'm holding out for them to put a tube pre in the micro vr

 

[Robby Hoinsky]

Robby, I do sound for open mike night for a local charity, and they treat me great. Free somtimes works out.

I'm sure it happens, glad that it happened to someone at least. Every time I ran sound for free, the band will say something like 'thanks for bringing the PA, good night' as they count the door money in front of me

But you're right, I need to get me in some good volunteer work. Do the world a favor and bring some good sound to good people for a good cause

Robby

 

[seanm]

So I was curious with all these threads about mini rigs of doom and people's go-to rigs being 1x15s or 1x12s how everyone's getting away with such a small rig. So, humor me:

-How often do you have PA support?

The majority of gigs we don't. But I really appreciate it when we do. I usually bring the same rig either way.

-Where do you typically play (small club, medium club, bar, outdoors, etc.)

All of the above.

-How many watts do you typically pack?

About 95% of the time I use my iAMP which is 500W. If the gig is outdoors and I am worried about rain, I will bring the 300W 800RB.

-What size/how many cabinets do you typically bring?

Two 1x12 cabs.

I'd like to make an addendum to the question. When you do have PA support, who is running the sound? you, band member, dedicated sound guy, house sound guy?

All the places I play that provide PA support also provide a house sound guy.

One band had a PA that could handle the entire band. For that band I ran the PA with some help from the drummer during sound check to get the drums right.

I'll take even a marginally acceptable dedicated sound guy over a band mixing from the stage any day. At least around these parts, if the band is mixing themselves, they sound painful unless they are a true pro band, in which case they'd sound 10x better with a decent sound engineer.

Ouch! For the gigs with a vocals/acoustic guitar only PA (this includes the bands PA), I run the sound... I try not to suck

 

[G-Unit 01]

I always run through the P.A, but then I own it

1800 Watts all active HK system. Small, light and powerful.

Loud enough for mid size bars but allows us to fit into the small spaces that bar owners call the stage

So much better then my "younger days" playing in cover bands lugging a three way P.A comprising W bins, 4560s and horns with a heavy rack full of amps and out board gear.

No future in that