How to bow this?

Why not play it as indicated (down on low F, up on slured 16ths etc.)?

 

this is a tricky one... perhaps:

down, up, down, up, down, up, down, up

 

"Irony is a clear consciousness of an eternal agility, of the infinitely abundant chaos."
-KWF Schlegel

 

My general advice is to play articulations exactly as written until you run into something that is awkward for you. Then you can either practice until it's no longer awkward (imagine that ), or use some sort of utility bowing like a "re-take" or double stroke to get into a more comfortable sequence of bowing.

 

I don't see a need for a re-take. Don't use too much bow on the low F or you will have to reset for the next couple of notes and keep your arm weight focused into the strings as you pivot the bow around to the d-string for the 16ths. Problems with passages like this often arise from too lengthy a bow stroke. Economize a bit and you will probably get the results you are looking for with a bit of practise.

 

I wouldn't bow it! I would ask the copyist what the dynamic was!
If the conductor asks for some goofy phrasing you might want to think about other bowings. In those 'original instrument' bands with authentic stylistic approach you might get asked to play a forte long first note with a buldge and then accent the first slur again down bow (retake) diminuendo over the 16 notes, then two upbows (linked) on the first pair of eighth notes 'poco staccato' and the last 3 notes as they come with a slight diminuendo so you would work up the bow (long stroke but still poco stacc on the first note, shorter up bow stroke on the second and finally a relatively pp down bow in the upper half on the last note).
If you think this is excessive then 'down up down up down up down up' will do the trick.
By the way, this is only partially ironic.
FC

 

I find that, suprisingly, re-take seituations would be more common in an odd time, like 3/4. While it hemiolizes (c) over two measures, there are some pieces (that Bach suite for his wife, whatever it was called, with that famous minuet) that had a lot of situations in the continuo part where you either need to re-take in every bar or face total anarchy.

 

What's a bassic??
TG

 

My online handle.

 

out of the whole post you only got that! now that's ironic considering the original question.....

 

What in the heck is going on in this thread?

 

OOPS! Sorry Andy! Let me set the record straight.
1.Don't talk to the conductor about bowings... They usually know less than us about the subject. Talk to the leader of the orchestra if you need to. (as section principal this is your privilage.)
2. Don't fall in love any particular bowings; you'll only groan about the one that got away. (we were asked to start the second act of Ballo in Maschera on an up bow and every time it comes up we groan and stare blankly at each other as if our dog just ot run over. Isn't that sad for a bunch of 50 year old guys!)
3. If you are doing Brandenburg 1 then just bow it out. There's just too much of it to do anything else.
4. My comment was really to show that some crazy people go to extarordinary lengths to inject what they think is musicallity into a piece even it might seem ugly to others. (authentic instrument guys are notorious for over phrasing and cooking up wierd bowings just to do some bizarre phrase. It is getting better but all too often it sound just like they're panicing)

I have learned, over the years, to take or leave bowings as they come. If my principal gives me a bowing then I do it even if I can think of something better. If I can't get round it I may suggest my version with an, "I think this might be even better" thrown in.
As I said, don't fall in love with bowings but do respect them. Practice the bowings you know your going to be asked to do in the orchestra (usually tutti strings or unison with the cellos type passages) until you can play them like a concerto in an audition!

Andy, if you have any (and I mean any) questions about bowing etc. don't hesitate to post them here and I, and of course all the other super dudes on the forum will be glad to help you out!

No hard feelings?
FC