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how to tell the drummer??????
- Thread starter safeshow
- Start date
all good stuff,,,,I feel ok talking to him an the other guys 1 more time, at that time introduceing the metro.,,,,,
regarding the way I post is pretty lame,,,,,You know what I am saying,,,,,I just like to spread out my lines to make it easier to read,,,,,does it really bothers you that much you need to point it out?
regarding the way I post is pretty lame,,,,,You know what I am saying,,,,,I just like to spread out my lines to make it easier to read,,,,,does it really bothers you that much you need to point it out?
I am sorry my weak attempt at humor while also providing an example of how to handle such communication has put you off your feed. I now know that you are not one who catches subtle humor or irony. Weak as it was, I was really just ribbing you. Get over yourself before you get on someone else.
Use as many commas as you like, I really don't care. But if your ability to handle this conversation is any indication of how you plan to handle that one, I would suggest you leave it up to someone with a better grip on nuance.
Find a hallmark card with "SUCK!" on the front.
Line the inside with aluminum foil so it forms a mirrored surface.
Randy
Line the inside with aluminum foil so it forms a mirrored surface.
Randy
One thing is` you cant force the guy play in time.By the sounds of this it doesnt matter what you do or say it wont work.
Im a Drummer first then Bass player but i dont have this problem.
Maybe his very nervous when he plays infont of people ?
You can work on timing with him but again its gonna be hard if he aint got from the start...timing is the most important thing when it comes down to music.
Im a Drummer first then Bass player but i dont have this problem.
Maybe his very nervous when he plays infont of people ?
You can work on timing with him but again its gonna be hard if he aint got from the start...timing is the most important thing when it comes down to music.
Roy Vogt
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- Sep 20, 2000
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Record the rehearsals or gigs and play it back for him without saying anything. "The tape don't lie" as we used to say.....
Not true at all.
You can develop it if you work at it. Takes time, it won't happen overnight.
So the answer is new drummer.
Great idea to work with the current guy. But it won't work unless all of the following happen:
1) he can actually convince the drummer there's a problem
2) he can actually convince the drummer its a serious problem
3) he can actually convince the drummer to work on it diligently on his own time.
4) the drummer actually follows through, practices with a metronome and doesn't give up in a month due to frustration, and it not being nearly as much fun as drumming your heart out at your own pace.
If you guys are just weekend warriors with day jobs, and he's got a family, married, he doesn't have the free time to devote to fixing his timing issues.
The other issue is his feel. Is his feel screwed up because of the timing issues? Or is he going to still sound like mashed potatoes when his meter is solid? Are his instincts good, trying for a cool feel, just floating around on the time so you can't link up with him? Fills out of time, but the fills are based on cool ideas? You should be able to tell the difference if you think about it.
Its probably going to take months of practicing with a metronome to fix his meter. Are you willing to wait that long?
Is that only going to prolong the agony, cause his feel/ideas are still bad, even when the execution of those ideas is corrected so they're in time?
Randy
+1
Taping your gigs or rehearsals is the true test. It's a mirror to hold up to your drummer. Listen back to the recordings together and make notes.
Whether or not this is a drummer that is worth continuing to work with will depend on how he reacts to the recordings. Will it be something constructive, where he recognizes that he needs to work on things? Or will he deflect any responsibility to other members of the band when he may be the one who has issues with maintaining an even tempo? His reaction to those recordings will tell you how to proceed.
Jeff Berlin agrees with me, you either have time or you don't.
I'll go with him, (and myself) on this one.
People either have it or they don't. RIGHT NOW. People can either play music or they can't too.
That doesn't mean they can't learn to do it better.
People CAN work on time and get better. Practice at pretty much anything makes you better at it.
Jeff doesn't believe in metronomes to work on your time, that doesn't mean he doesn't believe there isn't any way to make it better.
My meter used to suck before someone told me about it, now I have good meter. Its a skill like any other, that takes time and work to improve. Metronome worked great for me.
You do realize that "appeals to authority" constitutes a logical fallacy? Because Jeff is a great bassist doesn't make everything he believes about bass playing true.
Randy
When you are first learning how to play, perhaps this is something to be developed.
Once you've been playing for X number of years, you are what you are in the time department. You either have groove, are in the pocket and on time or you aren't.
I associate it more with a confidence and feel thing. I believe it can be worked on, but you have to dedicate yourself to it if you don't feel it naturally.
The only issue I see if your playing with someone that needs time, is if you have the time for them to get it together without feeling the disappoint for too long, and how much effort they take in addressing something that usually marks the make or break, of a drummer or other. How dedicated are they? If they are not on the same level of enthusiasm as yourself to progress, then, that's some weight that you have to decide whether you want to carry or not.
This is the 'nice' way round, myself, I haven't got the spare time to give in a playing situation, only to the students I teach ; )
The only issue I see if your playing with someone that needs time, is if you have the time for them to get it together without feeling the disappoint for too long, and how much effort they take in addressing something that usually marks the make or break, of a drummer or other. How dedicated are they? If they are not on the same level of enthusiasm as yourself to progress, then, that's some weight that you have to decide whether you want to carry or not.
This is the 'nice' way round, myself, I haven't got the spare time to give in a playing situation, only to the students I teach ; )
It's visually annoying and makes your posts harder to read. Grammar exists for a reason. Dude, seriously, just use periods.
You realize you just admitted you are wrong. You can develop your timing when you start playing, then suddenly lose the ability to improve it? Really? What exactly changes that prohibits you from learning and improving at that point in time? What point in time is that exactly? Is it age, years of playing, number of lessons, number of notes read from sheet music?
So now you can't learn to play in the pocket, can't learn to groove either? After X number of years.. riiiiiight. So do you lose the ability to learn to groove at the same time as you lose the ability to get better time-wise? Or do you lose the ability to learn to groove at Y years, time at X years, and being in the pocket at Z years?
The only thing that changes is available time and desire to work on it once you're an adult. No reason they can't. Often reasons they don't.
Problem with meter is usually they can't tell their time sucks. They think they're fine. They need a stable time reference to prove when they're off, so they can adjust. Whether that reference is better players, playing along with recordings, or playing with a metronome, it can be detected. Once it can be detected, it can be worked on.
Randy
Jazzdogg said:
Sure if the disparity in ability is too great something will have to give.
But for every musician playing with someone better, there is a musician playing with someone worse - for example the drummer who tolerates your lesser bass playing because you only play with your betters. Not having a go at you but this is the clear implication of what you said.
It's good karma to care about others, and doesn't have to mean not setting high standards.
