Hybrid vs Tube

[woody357]

I think you are under-estimating the grasp of some of the TalkBass player's comments you have received.

I really respect the information I get here on TB, but most of what I have read about my post alludes to tone, and a few just flat out insulting me because I dare ask this question. I would not be here asking if I didn't think I could get good information. I'm just trying to get the best information I can without being able to try things for myself.

 

[baxter_x]

but most of what I have read about my post alludes to tone

Wat a post about amps could be about then, if not tone?

 

[MVE]

Well, for “physical presence” I stick with the Demeter, but the newer case design.
It physically looks like a tube amp, albeit a tiny one.

 

[Chickenwheels]

I use a GK800RB when I want focused punch.
I use a ‘78 Fender Studio Bass head when I want that all-tube feel and sound...because it’s a hand wired 200watt all-tube amp.
This blurb from an 80’s Mesa D-180 advert pretty much sums up the sound from an all-tube head:

and...


When I turn up the GK it gets “louder”.
When I turn up the Studio Bass it gets “bigger”.
My effects sound clearer and more dynamic with the tube amp, too.
Is there really a non-tube amp out there that can match all-tube? I’ve yet to experience it.

 

[Hundred proof]

I concour with the more 3D sound, elusive and hard to describe, as stated it comes down to feel. But virtually every one on this site will tell you it doesn’t matter, just send a clean DI signal to the house, after all “it’s only bass”.

 

[hennessybass]

I’ve played my fair share of tube amps,, and they are all different, so hard to generalize... but

As far as a general tube amp feel from a non-tube amp, the Streamliner has it. I’d also mention my Fender TBP1 pre that I was using with a big ole power amp.

Heft, feel, touch response, sag, compression when you dig in, etc...

 

[agedhorse]

I really respect the information I get here on TB, but most of what I have read about my post alludes to tone, and a few just flat out insulting me because I dare ask this question. I would not be here asking if I didn't think I could get good information. I'm just trying to get the best information I can without being able to try things for myself.

I think that if you listen, there are many good answers. In some cases tube preamps and power amps can make a difference and in other cases it may not. The common factor in much of the discussion and information given is that the design of the amp might impact what you hear and what you feel as much or more than the devices themselves.

 

[Nighttrain1127]

I have an amp that sounds very much like a tube amp IMHO and not a tube in sight. Infact I was playing through my Fender Super bassman at rehersal one night and when we were taking a break the BL switched my Class D amp in , Inplace of my Super bassman and when we started back playing I went to make adjustments on the Bassman that is how close it sounded.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

Is this an actual or rhetorical question?

This topic has been literally beaten to death. If you can’t do a simple search and find hours of reading pleasure, then you aren’t half trying. Weekly popcorn munch; but, it’s getting a little old.

I’ve used most amps out there on the gig over the past 49 years. For a long time, it was exclusively tube amps. There is so much more to making an amp great than whether or not it has tubes.

If you play original punk music and want tube power section distortion as part of your “sound,” then no, solid state amplification does not do that.

Played clean, most agree the SVT has “heft,” whatever that exactly means. But, my experience has been that any of the high quality tube pre’s, Alembic or Demeter etc, running into a quality solid state power amp will easily produce a similarly forceful clean bass tonality. The details of the preamp design actually do matter.

To cut to the chase, this is my “big rig,” which I would happily put next to an SVT on any backline, with the caveat that I wouldn’t be overdriving the power section on the SVT for my needs. Different strokes &YMMV.

View attachment 3454102

Nice rig!

 

[bucephylus]

I really respect the information I get here on TB, but most of what I have read about my post alludes to tone, and a few just flat out insulting me because I dare ask this question. I would not be here asking if I didn't think I could get good information. I'm just trying to get the best information I can without being able to try things for myself.

Hey, brother; we are all there for each other.

Unfortunately, there really isn’t any substitute for trying a lot of gear. I wish there were shortcuts; but, I haven’t found them. You really just need to try stuff and trust your own ears. GL

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

Is there a hybrid amp that come close to the heft of the notes of a tube amp, or the physical presence that you get from a tube amp.

I know I sound like a broken record, but IMO the Aguilar Tonehammer 500 is all solid state, but it does an amazing job at providing tube-like tone and feel. I also loved the tube preamp in the Ampeg SVT 4-Pro.

I haven't had the pleasure of trying an Aguilar DB750/751, but many folks here who's opinions of tone I trust say both models are fantastic.

If you can get a chance to try the Mesa WD800 definitely do it. I only briefly played through one; it's eq settings made the amp sound more in the solid state realm, but it had a smooth tone that reminded me a lot of the Demeter HBP-1 tube preamp that I own.

If you decide to go the tube preamp/solid state power amp route, Ampeg's SVP-Pro and SVP-CL preamps get great reviews. They're no longer made, but they're available on the used market.

I'm very fond of my Demeter HBP-1, but IMO it's forte is a clean tone. It's single 12AX7 tube provides a slight bit of warmth, and it's solid state parametric eq is killer, and is it's strong point, IMO.

I've owned an Alembic F1-X tube preamp, and IMO it's quite a bit warmer sounding than the HBP-1, although I personally feel the F1-X's preamp isn't as versatile as the HBP-1's. This aside, the F1-X is a fantastic sounding preamp.

There's other new offerings that have been mentioned here by other folks that I haven't tried. If you can try them out, definitely do so.

The Monique preamp also gets high praise here; unfortunately I haven't heard it myself. My area is somewhat limited in that regard. I used this forum much in the same way you are: I researched a TON here, then I ordered online the gear that I thought would work best for me. So far, I've had good results.

Best regards!

 

[Downunderwonder]

Heft comes from wattage and the ability of the speakers to use it. Use a big enough micro and you got heft covered.

Physical presence means many different things and none are exclusive property of tube power stages ( except the mass of transformers ). So stop shooting messengers.

 

[woody357]

Hey, brother; we are all there for each other.

Unfortunately, there really isn’t any substitute for trying a lot of gear. I wish there were shortcuts; but, I haven’t found them. You really just need to try stuff and trust your own ears. GL

I agree, but unfortunately for me there isn't any place where I live that I can try this stuff. Back when I had a store order my Epifani PS410 they said they had never heard of Epifani. I knew what I was getting so that wasn't a problem.

 

[woody357]

Heft comes from wattage and the ability of the speakers to use it. Use a big enough micro and you got heft covered.

Physical presence means many different things and none are exclusive property of tube power stages ( except the mass of transformers ). So stop shooting messengers.

I disagree with the whole wattage thing. The Ampeg v4b is just 100 watts and it is all that I am asking about, it just isn't loud enough. Messengers not shot!!

 

[woody357]

I use a GK800RB when I want focused punch.
I use a ‘78 Fender Studio Bass head when I want that all-tube feel and sound...because it’s a hand wired 200watt all-tube amp.
This blurb from an 80’s Mesa D-180 advert pretty much sums up the sound from an all-tube head:
View attachment 3454571
and...


When I turn up the GK it gets “louder”.


When I turn up the Studio Bass it gets “bigger”.
My effects sound clearer and more dynamic with the tube amp, too.
Is there really a non-tube amp out there that can match all-tube? I’ve yet to experience it.

This is what I am talking about. THANK YOU!!!!!!

 

[Downunderwonder]

I disagree with the whole wattage thing. The Ampeg v4b is just 100 watts and it is all that I am asking about, it just isn't loud enough. Messengers not shot!!

You need another word that isn't heft.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

I agree, but unfortunately for me there isn't any place where I live that I can try this stuff. Back when I had a store order my Epifani PS410 they said they had never heard of Epifani. I knew what I was getting so that wasn't a problem.

Like I previously posted, I also have a hard time finding a lot of the gear I read about here locally. Just keep asking questions!

 

[Nighttrain1127]

I have never heard any SS amp no matter the power rating that has the Bottom end Authority of a properly functioning tube amp. Don't get me wrong I love me some SS amps But I love my tubes even more .

 

[Downunderwonder]

I have never heard any SS amp no matter the power rating that has the Bottom end Authority of a properly functioning tube amp. Don't get me wrong I love me some SS amps But I love my tubes even more .

I like tubes as much as the next guy. You are ascribing the term Bottom End Authority to tube amps like it means something. It just means you like tube amps.

 

[D.A.R.K.]

I really respect the information I get here on TB, but most of what I have read about my post alludes to tone, and a few just flat out insulting me because I dare ask this question. I would not be here asking if I didn't think I could get good information. I'm just trying to get the best information I can without being able to try things for myself.

My post is based on experiences owning Ampeg SVT, V4B, Fender Bassman, Mesa Boogie 400/ 400+, Ampeg tube power amps, Aguilar DB359, Marshall tube bass heads. And probably a few others I've forgotten about.