I hate all amplifiers

[Savoury Salmon]

I’ve been playing bass for 15 years now, and I can’t say I’ve loved an amplifier. I have no complaints about my bass, strings, tuner, compressor and other effects, but amplifiers? I dislike them all.

My first amplifier was an Eden World Tour. It worked for the time, the late 90s and early 00s, but I’d sooner wear a bucket hat and oversized jeans with a chained wallet before going back to that hi-fi ton of brick.

The GK 700RB-II sounded like a sterilized scalpel falling on the tiled floor of an operation room. It stripped away all that made basses sound different from one another and made them sound all similarly clean. Loud. And growly when pushed.

The Mesa WD-800 seemed to have everything. Build quality, warranty, HPF, tube, etc. But it had that sort of gritty baked-in tone I disliked and couldn’t get rid of.

I’ve played through an Aguilar Tone Hammer 700, but I hate the drive circuit. I know you can turn it off, but I can’t get my bass loud enough without turning in some of the gain.

I’ve hated every SVTs and SVT preamp pedals I’ve played through. But I recently needed a preamp DI and after comparing the two Origin Effects BassRigs, I went home with the Super Vintage, certain it would’ve been the 64 Black Panel.

Output and blend at 6 o’clock, drive at 8, bass and mid (800) at 2, treble at noon and the switch in the ultra hi position, it’s the best tone I’ve ever had.

So, now what? Should I try playing that setup through a power amplifier or will the pedal not drive it?

Should I get the new GK and hope the pedal over-colours the GK?

I heard the Aguilar AG700 was like a clean Tone Hammer. Maybe I’d like it, and, if not, maybe the SV can over-colour it?

Any other suggestions? Help!

(I’m not trying to be a pessimist here. Thousands of people love their Mesa, GK and Aguilar. There’s nothing wrong with any of them. They’re just not for me.)

 

[J Wilson]

IF you want to 'freeze' that tone (in other words, not take a chance with a conventional bass amp adding anything to it you don't want), that pedal through a conventional stereo power amp would be the ticket with two big IFs:

1) If the output of the pedal is enought to drive the inputs of the power amp, and . . .

2) a rack based rig with a QSC or something similar would work for you. These style amps add the least coloration of any of your choices, save what's put through them.

There may be, however, one of those bass amps you didn't like that you could go pedal to power amp input (again if the input output signals will play nice) which on a lot of amps bypasses the preamp section (which you didn't like) and goes straight to the engine room and out to the speakers. There may be a dedicated bass amp with that structure that would work that's 'neutral' enough in that mode to suit.

You'll just have to try a few out and do some homework and see where you're at.

 

[Stevorebob]

Maybe try turning a knob or two.

(Welcome to TalkBass.)

 

[paskisti]

You didn't say anything about speaker cabinets. In most cases the bass cab colours the tone as much or more than the amp itself in flat setting.

Try to find one of the flat response type bass cabinets. I have understood that Greenboy designs, Vanderkley and Barefaced cabinets are pretty flat response and not colouring your sound. There must be many others too.

 

[Sid the Kid]

It sounds like you would love a Genzler Magellan.

 

[Wasnex]

A few months ago someone made a great suggestion: "Lower your expectations!" IMHO this is really an essential thing to do if you plan to be a professional music. It typically range from difficult to impossible to get a good live bass sound IMHO. But there are occassional gigs where you get an accidental gestalt and the sound is near perfect. People frequently draw false assumption from these exeriences. The attribute it to whatever amp was provided in the backline. But in reality they just got really lucky.

When I was a kid I made the mistake of rigging up an adapter and plugging my bass into my stereo. I went down the rabbit chasing that sound and eventually came to the conclusion that it can't be done with either musical instrument rigs or PA-based speakers and rack gear. But IMHO you get a lot closer with PA-based speakers and some nice rack gear. To be fair and IMHO, modern bass gears tends to get closer. As far as why a your rig cannot be like a good HiFi system, I think it's because most musical instrument speakers and PA speakers prioritize SPL over sound quality. And I have had the pleasure of mixing on some very high end PA gear from companies like Apogee Sound and Meyer Sound.

Unfortunately even if you build a rig that produces perfect sound, as soon as you put it in the typical acoustic environment you experience at gigs, it frequently becomes impossible to get a great tone. The reverberant energy bouncing around the room tends to mask all of the wonderful qualities you are hoping to hear in your direct sound. This is where the "lower your expectations" comes in.

Depending on how you like to monitor, you might be happier with an nice IEM-based system. Wearing headphones or IEMs is really the only way you can take room acoustics out of the equation. But some people hate this type of sound. Also the results are often limited by the quality and capabilies of the PA and the person who is running it.

Good luck finding your way through the rabbit hole. I hope you enjoy the journey .

 

[paskisti]

@Wasnex Very true. Plus player needs sound that steps out in the mix, while FOH wants sound that sits in the mix. Better to accept that rehearsal or monitor bass sound is not the same as FOH/studio/home sound.

Only way to make your monitor sound constant and close to FOH/studio/home is to use IEM in every situation.

 

[Zbysek]

You didn't say anything about speaker cabinets. In most cases the bass cab colours the tone as much or more than the amp itself in flat setting.

This.

IME, the speaker cab has a bigger impact on the sound than the amp. When I don't like the sound of a specific rig, it's usually the cab to blame...

If I were the OP, I would start with trying to identify what I like. How did the OP listen to the Origin pedal he liked? That might show the OP which direction to look at... If he listened to the Origin pedal through earphones/studio monitors/PA speaker cabinet, it might be an evidence that he prefers FRFR speaker cabinets...

 

[rodl2005]

I’ve been playing bass for 15 years now, and I can’t say I’ve loved an amplifier. I have no complaints about my bass, strings, tuner, compressor and other effects, but amplifiers? I dislike them all.

My first amplifier was an Eden World Tour. It worked for the time, the late 90s and early 00s, but I’d sooner wear a bucket hat and oversized jeans with a chained wallet before going back to that hi-fi ton of brick.

The GK 700RB-II sounded like a sterilized scalpel falling on the tiled floor of an operation room. It stripped away all that made basses sound different from one another and made them sound all similarly clean. Loud. And growly when pushed.

The Mesa WD-800 seemed to have everything. Build quality, warranty, HPF, tube, etc. But it had that sort of gritty baked-in tone I disliked and couldn’t get rid of.

I’ve played through an Aguilar Tone Hammer 700, but I hate the drive circuit. I know you can turn it off, but I can’t get my bass loud enough without turning in some of the gain.

I’ve hated every SVTs and SVT preamp pedals I’ve played through. But I recently needed a preamp DI and after comparing the two Origin Effects BassRigs, I went home with the Super Vintage, certain it would’ve been the 64 Black Panel.

Output and blend at 6 o’clock, drive at 8, bass and mid (800) at 2, treble at noon and the switch in the ultra hi position, it’s the best tone I’ve ever had.

So, now what? Should I try playing that setup through a power amplifier or will the pedal not drive it?

Should I get the new GK and hope the pedal over-colours the GK?

I heard the Aguilar AG700 was like a clean Tone Hammer. Maybe I’d like it, and, if not, maybe the SV can over-colour it?

Any other suggestions? Help!

(I’m not trying to be a pessimist here. Thousands of people love their Mesa, GK and Aguilar. There’s nothing wrong with any of them. They’re just not for me.)

I'll try my TH500 for clean n loud and let u know. I thought if u kept the drive off, use the mids and bass up a li'l, it'd go pretty good. I mean, it's always done enough for me.
But I'll try next time and report back


Tube amps - Fender Super Bassman is a beaut.

 

[gtirard]

Have you tried the Quilter Bass Block 800 or 802? From what I read, you may love it. I think it is neutral but not sterile, it sounds great as is but it also takes external preamps really well. I also agree that the cab is also very important, what cab are you using?

 

[Nashrakh]

Unfortunately even if you build a rig that produces perfect sound, as soon as you put it in the typical acoustic environment you experience at gigs, it frequently becomes impossible to get a great tone. The reverberant energy bouncing around the room tends to mask all of the wonderful qualities you are hoping to hear in your direct sound. This is where the "lower your expectations" comes in.

Your post really speaks to me as someone who has fiddled around with their sound for years. I'm at my wits end to get a consistent tone anywhere I go, and whatever I sound I build at home never seems to translate that well (and I've tried everything - from a modern hifi sound to P bass with flats).

Now here's the kicker: I am willing to lower my expectations - but apparently, others are not. Which puts me in a bad spot sometimes. In one band, I'm constantly struggling with the room acoustics and a band that masks all kinds of frequencies, but the band leader just doesn't get it.

 

[gtirard]

Your post really speaks to me as someone who has fiddled around with their sound for years. I'm at my wits end to get a consistent tone anywhere I go, and whatever I sound I build at home never seems to translate that well (and I've tried everything - from a modern hifi sound to P bass with flats).

Now here's the kicker: I am willing to lower my expectations - but apparently, others are not. Which puts me in a bad spot sometimes. In one band, I'm constantly struggling with the room acoustics and a band that masks all kinds of frequencies, but the band leader just doesn't get it.

Most of the time that happens if you set a scooped sound at practice level: it sounds great (flattering) at low volume when you play solo, but it is buried in a band mix and the bass frequencies can become boomy at loud volume, especially if the room accoustics is bad.

Solutions:
- Avoid scooped sounds,
- Use High Pass Filter to remove useless boomy frequencies

 

[Sparky Mark]

I’ve been playing bass for 15 years now, and I can’t say I’ve loved an amplifier. I have no complaints about my bass, strings, tuner, compressor and other effects, but amplifiers? I dislike them all.

My first amplifier was an Eden World Tour. It worked for the time, the late 90s and early 00s, but I’d sooner wear a bucket hat and oversized jeans with a chained wallet before going back to that hi-fi ton of brick.

The GK 700RB-II sounded like a sterilized scalpel falling on the tiled floor of an operation room. It stripped away all that made basses sound different from one another and made them sound all similarly clean. Loud. And growly when pushed.

The Mesa WD-800 seemed to have everything. Build quality, warranty, HPF, tube, etc. But it had that sort of gritty baked-in tone I disliked and couldn’t get rid of.

I’ve played through an Aguilar Tone Hammer 700, but I hate the drive circuit. I know you can turn it off, but I can’t get my bass loud enough without turning in some of the gain.

I’ve hated every SVTs and SVT preamp pedals I’ve played through. But I recently needed a preamp DI and after comparing the two Origin Effects BassRigs, I went home with the Super Vintage, certain it would’ve been the 64 Black Panel.

Output and blend at 6 o’clock, drive at 8, bass and mid (800) at 2, treble at noon and the switch in the ultra hi position, it’s the best tone I’ve ever had.

So, now what? Should I try playing that setup through a power amplifier or will the pedal not drive it?

Should I get the new GK and hope the pedal over-colours the GK?

I heard the Aguilar AG700 was like a clean Tone Hammer. Maybe I’d like it, and, if not, maybe the SV can over-colour it?

Any other suggestions? Help!

(I’m not trying to be a pessimist here. Thousands of people love their Mesa, GK and Aguilar. There’s nothing wrong with any of them. They’re just not for me.)

First of all, welcome to Talkbass.
You say you've been playing bass for 15 years but were using an Eden back in the 90's; that's over 20 years isn't it?
Anyhow, my experience is that speaker cabinets are also important to getting the desired sound. Which cabs have you been using?

 

[two fingers]

I’ve been playing bass for 15 years now, and I can’t say I’ve loved an amplifier. I have no complaints about my bass, strings, tuner, compressor and other effects, but amplifiers? I dislike them all.

My first amplifier was an Eden World Tour. It worked for the time, the late 90s and early 00s, but I’d sooner wear a bucket hat and oversized jeans with a chained wallet before going back to that hi-fi ton of brick.

The GK 700RB-II sounded like a sterilized scalpel falling on the tiled floor of an operation room. It stripped away all that made basses sound different from one another and made them sound all similarly clean. Loud. And growly when pushed.

The Mesa WD-800 seemed to have everything. Build quality, warranty, HPF, tube, etc. But it had that sort of gritty baked-in tone I disliked and couldn’t get rid of.

I’ve played through an Aguilar Tone Hammer 700, but I hate the drive circuit. I know you can turn it off, but I can’t get my bass loud enough without turning in some of the gain.

I’ve hated every SVTs and SVT preamp pedals I’ve played through. But I recently needed a preamp DI and after comparing the two Origin Effects BassRigs, I went home with the Super Vintage, certain it would’ve been the 64 Black Panel.

Output and blend at 6 o’clock, drive at 8, bass and mid (800) at 2, treble at noon and the switch in the ultra hi position, it’s the best tone I’ve ever had.

So, now what? Should I try playing that setup through a power amplifier or will the pedal not drive it?

Should I get the new GK and hope the pedal over-colours the GK?

I heard the Aguilar AG700 was like a clean Tone Hammer. Maybe I’d like it, and, if not, maybe the SV can over-colour it?

Any other suggestions? Help!

(I’m not trying to be a pessimist here. Thousands of people love their Mesa, GK and Aguilar. There’s nothing wrong with any of them. They’re just not for me.)

Welcome to TalkBass!!!!

Time may have slipped away from you. If your first bass rig, the Eden, "worked for the time", and you owned it in the late 90s, you've been playing for closer to 25 years.

If the pedal doesn't drive a power amp, you just need a DI box. Simple as that.

 

[tvbop]

The OP's missing a couple of very important points when going down this tone rabbit hole.

Are you a famous musician? If you are then you will have your tone whatever anyone says, and good luck. However if your a working musician then your "tone" whatever that is will be shaped not by your amp but by the FOH dude or the studio dude and producer.

All musicians get hung up on their stage sound cause thats the tone only you hear on stage...but out in the auditorium or on the record its a whole different bag of chips and frankly matters not much what amp your using.

 

[MtManiac]

I’ve been playing bass for 15 years now, and I can’t say I’ve loved an amplifier. I have no complaints about my bass, strings, tuner, compressor and other effects, but amplifiers? I dislike them all.

My first amplifier was an Eden World Tour. It worked for the time, the late 90s and early 00s, but I’d sooner wear a bucket hat and oversized jeans with a chained wallet before going back to that hi-fi ton of brick.

The GK 700RB-II sounded like a sterilized scalpel falling on the tiled floor of an operation room. It stripped away all that made basses sound different from one another and made them sound all similarly clean. Loud. And growly when pushed.

The Mesa WD-800 seemed to have everything. Build quality, warranty, HPF, tube, etc. But it had that sort of gritty baked-in tone I disliked and couldn’t get rid of.

I’ve played through an Aguilar Tone Hammer 700, but I hate the drive circuit. I know you can turn it off, but I can’t get my bass loud enough without turning in some of the gain.

I’ve hated every SVTs and SVT preamp pedals I’ve played through. But I recently needed a preamp DI and after comparing the two Origin Effects BassRigs, I went home with the Super Vintage, certain it would’ve been the 64 Black Panel.

Output and blend at 6 o’clock, drive at 8, bass and mid (800) at 2, treble at noon and the switch in the ultra hi position, it’s the best tone I’ve ever had.

So, now what? Should I try playing that setup through a power amplifier or will the pedal not drive it?

Should I get the new GK and hope the pedal over-colours the GK?

I heard the Aguilar AG700 was like a clean Tone Hammer. Maybe I’d like it, and, if not, maybe the SV can over-colour it?

Any other suggestions? Help!

(I’m not trying to be a pessimist here. Thousands of people love their Mesa, GK and Aguilar. There’s nothing wrong with any of them. They’re just not for me.)

What’s the application? Are you in a band, and if so, what sort of band? What’s the instrumentation? What size venues?

 

[Dave W]

What cabinet(s) are you playing through?

If you love the Origin SV, you should be loving an SVT into an Ampeg 8X10 too...

 

[el murdoque]

Quilter Bass Block or GSS Baby Sumo are two possible options then. I have not tried the Origin preamp yet but I'd be surprised if the good people at Origin did forget that option and made their output too weak.

I don't know how much juice you really need, but I've driven my Baby Sumo countless times with a pedal that's officially too weak to drive a power amp, but even with the reduced power I got sufficient volume from the cabinets.

 

[Iroquoisroadwarrior]

Get a Hartke

 

[Katoosie]

Your post really speaks to me as someone who has fiddled around with their sound for years. I'm at my wits end to get a consistent tone anywhere I go, and whatever I sound I build at home never seems to translate that well (and I've tried everything - from a modern hifi sound to P bass with flats).

Now here's the kicker: I am willing to lower my expectations - but apparently, others are not. Which puts me in a bad spot sometimes. In one band, I'm constantly struggling with the room acoustics and a band that masks all kinds of frequencies, but the band leader just doesn't get it.

I will die on this hill - you EQ to the room with your cabs and amps, nothing else. A lot of people don't think about that, I guess. But the acoustics, shape, material of the room etc you are playing in matters.

Not to mention how you can be next to the cab and it sounds fine, you step away and you're like - wha happun.