I lost my cool with a bandmate.

[petrus61]

If it festers with him and he brings it up, maybe admit to him you have something to learn in this situation too.

Be careful about singling him out for too many compliments to compensate for feeling like you need to make it up to him for snapping at him. Some take that as condescending. Maybe focus on the whole band sounding better.

That's a very good point. People will often site "artistic approach" as an excuse for not wanting to, or just being incapable of doing certain parts. One band member busts their hump all week trying to nail a part, only to show up to practice with someone that is perfectly content with faking or even butchering said part and it can be incredibly frustrating. Laying out what everyone expects to get out a band at the outset can nip this in the bud. It helps when there is a cohesive goal in mind.

 

[lfmn16]

OP says this is a casual band, and seems to feel he crossed the line. A little different from a working band. Correct the personal issue so they can move to correct the the music.

I wasn't there so I'm making some assumptions. I guess it depends on how hard OP came down on the guy, but getting all butt hurt because you are told you're playing the wrong part seems a little snow flakey to me. Despite his protestations, I'm still unsure if he can't play the part, or is just too lazy to learn the part. Even in a casual band, you have some obligations.

I was in a band that was working with a drummer who was an issue. I talked to him multiple times politely and tactfully about his issues. It was clear that he was capable of playing the tunes, he just chose not to practice. Finally I just had enough and read him the riot act. I thought he was going to start crying. He buckled down and practiced and after the second practice I said, "I knew you could do it, you've shown about 1000% improvement and the band sounds infinitely better. We all appreciate your effort." He thanked me and I don't think he ever practiced again. About a month later we kicked him out.

 

[MYLOWFREQ]

I feel you, have been there.. Here's my take: if the project is for fun, don't take it seriously. It's totally normal for you to expect your bandmates to do their job well, but at the end this is not a job, and you should either not be a part of it, or take it easy. I don't think you did something wrong really, but still you owe an apology to your guitar player as his feelings got hurt a little it seems like. I think that you also feel a little regret so get it out of your chest and apologize. You'll feel much better.

 

[lfmn16]

That's a very good point. People will often site "artistic approach" as an excuse for not wanting to, or just being incapable of doing certain parts. One band member busts their hump all week trying to nail a part, only to show up to practice with someone that is perfectly content with faking or even butchering said part and it can be incredibly frustrating. Laying out what everyone expects to get out a band at the outset can nip this in the bud. It helps when there is a cohesive goal in mind.

I've noticed that when people "make it their own" or take "artistic liberties" about 99.999% of the time it's actually just the part getting dumbed down because they are too lazy to learn it. I almost never see someone bring in a "cool" version of a tune that's harder to play than the original.

 

[JohnMCA72]

I have a general rule: Praise in public, criticize in private.

If you need to call somebody out on something wrong, try to do it one-on-one, so as not to embarrass them in front of others. If you have something good to say, make sure as many people can hear it as possible for a similar reason.

For better or worse, when you try to tell somebody how to play a part, you're assuming a leadership role in the band. It's important for leaders to help the others, both with technique and motivation. I believe positive reinforcement works better than negative for most cases & try to use negative reinforcement as a last resort. In your example, rather than telling somebody they were doing something "wrong", you could suggest a way that they could do it better, as in something like, "How about trying it this way?", etc. Put a little sugar on it & it goes down easier.

 

[Rolling Thunder]

What I hear is that your band is like a pick-up game of basketball made up of whoever is on the court at that moment. You played ball in college years ago and some kid in jeans is on your team because without him someone has to sit out.

He passed the ball to someone on the other team. You can't believe he forgot who was on his team.

In the end, your words may have hurt but that should make him practice more or he might decide to leave.

 

[Peteyboy]

Dang. I grew up playing in bands with my older brother as the drummer. You know how I knew when I screwed up? Drumstick projectile to the back of the head.

 

[lfmn16]

Dang. I grew up playing in bands with my older brother as the drummer. You know how I knew when I screwed up? Drumstick projectile to the back of the head.

That may be a little over the top (or not ) but you aren't doing anyone a favor by not letting them know if they are playing a part egregiously wrong.

 

[acid bass]

The flip side is that others have been using the rehearsal time to learn the song. That leaves me sitting there while they practice the chords and progression.

I had this problem in one of my previous bands. I'm very driven to be perfect and super critical of my performance (as well as everyone else's). My bandmates could not have been more opposite, they were really slack and constantly trotted out "let's keep things fun, don't worry about it" as an excuse for "I don't want to work on this anymore."

Now granted, we weren't just a "for fun" band, we were quite busy gigging. That made things much worse. Eventually the personality divide caused the band to divide. I've learned that I can't be in a serious project with people who don't take their craft as seriously as me. Since your band is mainly for fun maybe you can let things go a bit. But it may also benefit you to find a different group of people who are a bit more like-minded. You'd be surprised how much your attitude towards rehearsal improves when you're not constantly worrying about whether your bandmates will know their parts or not.

 

[mrcbass]

There's nothing wrong with talking about a how a song should be played - whichever way is chosen, you all need to be on the same page.

But your words seemed harsh. I can come off that way as well some times, so I always try to make these kinds of comments more about me than the other person: "I heard something different in that spot - can we review it?" This provides a non finger pointing way to get on the same page. I'm usually right but I've also been wrong, so I try not to make it about "your" approach: let's figure it out together.

My attitude does get a little less agreeable if we have the same discussion several times though...

Definitely apologize for your choice of words. It'll go a long ways towards providing some comfort for him. Even if he waves it off, he'll see that you just had a bad moment. And you'll feel better as well.

 

[Eric Swaim]

I have called a few people out before for not being prepared in a band that plays out for money. If your just doing it for fun, everyone may want to realize it is for fun and not an audition for "America got Talent." Don't beat yourself up for it. He now realizes you are working hard and he needs to do the best he can for the next rehearsal.

 

[Lava]

We're all human and fallible. The key is realizing that and making true apologies to those people. I would absolutely rather have someone criticize me and apologize for it than not. That person is probably already very aware of his shortcomings.

 

[Cut the middle]

Great post.

The only thing I see that may be missing is an "i'm sorry" to him and your pals.

 

[SubHuman]

I don't play in bands anymore since I'm older and the whole COVID thing but one thing we would do early on as in your case...is have 1 or 2 really easy songs we could all bang out and enjoy. If we were stuck on a new or harder song we would bash out a fun tune to get us all back in sync.
Sometimes getting hung up on a part or phrase of a song can become almost obsessive and put undue pressure on why you're all doing it...for fun and creativity. If you don't have any simple 3 or 4 chord songs you all can easily play pick out a couple. A little success can feed a music session and turn it into a good time!

 

[lfmn16]

I had this problem in one of my previous bands. I'm very driven to be perfect and super critical of my performance (as well as everyone else's). My bandmates could not have been more opposite, they were really slack and constantly trotted out "let's keep things fun, don't worry about it" as an excuse for "I don't want to work on this anymore."

Now granted, we weren't just a "for fun" band, we were quite busy gigging. That made things much worse. Eventually the personality divide caused the band to divide. I've learned that I can't be in a serious project with people who don't take their craft as seriously as me. Since your band is mainly for fun maybe you can let things go a bit. But it may also benefit you to find a different group of people who are a bit more like-minded. You'd be surprised how much your attitude towards rehearsal improves when you're not constantly worrying about whether your bandmates will know their parts or not.

+1

To me anyway, one of the biggest frustrations is that the difference between playing the song and playing it right is often very little effort, but some people can't even be troubled to put in the tiny amount of effort. I played in a Rockabilly band before the virus and we learned (meaning I learned) Hank Williams Sr. Honky Tonkin' which is basically one chord, but there is a measure or two of 2/4 in the chorus and the bass player couldn't play it right to save his life. He wouldn't write it down and forgot how it went between each rehearsal. Finally, after trying to be nice about it I just got really snotty and told him to write it down and refused to play a note until he'd written it down. Then when we'd rehearse I'd have to tell him to get his notes and if he didn't have them I wouldn't play the song.

My preference is that everyone acts like an adult, but if you act like child, that's how I'm going to treat you. This was a working band, just no excuse not to know these very simple songs. I used to say, "I don't care if you have to write it down, but I do care if you play it wrong." I don't like being the bad guy, but I'm not going to be embarrassed on stage because someone can't get their shirt together at rehearsal.

 

[Sixgunn]

We're not really in a band (at this point) just trying to build a small set list and have some fun playing in a no-pressure environment. Were all old dudes (and a dudette) having some fun (at least that's the idea).

Well, I actually work on this stuff at home and try to get it right. We all have varying degrees of talent/time/and inclination to work on this stuff. I guess I'm just here to get it off my chest that I told the rhythm player that what he was playing wasn't right, and it it's not right the rest will fall apart and it will be a train wreck. That rattled him and he said that he only really became familiar with his part two hours prior, and that he only considers himself a beginner guitar player anyway and how he didn't expect to hear "that isn't right...you're messing everything up" (referring to me) in an exaggerated accusatory impression of me obviously.

So anyway, I felt about this low and tried to make amends as the rehearsal went on to encourage him and say how much better it was sounding and "yeah, you got it now...you really held us together there, etc..."

I feel bad because I actually consciously TRY to remember that we are just there to have fun, but my ambition to be good and be right still got to me in a weak moment of frustration.

I may just not be a very good person for these situations. I have basically avoided playing with people most of my life. The thing is, I have sometimes been the weak link in a jam situation so I certainly empathize with this guy. He's being asked to play chord and rhythms he's not comfortable with, and that's the whole point here...to get better.

So this is not a defense of my actions, more like an opportunity to vent so I can stop beating myself up over it and try to use this whole endeavor to develop more patience with people and stop transferring how hard I can be on myself to others.

People need to stop being so sensitive and delicate. The real world eats people like that, alive.

 

[AllFifths]

Wow! LOL! I've been in this exact place a few times… Not always about music sometimes just about function. I haven't read the whole thread so maybe this has already been said on some levels, but an honest apology while still expressing your concerns can really fix a situation. "I" statement as opposed to "you" can help too. Sometimes even stopping and saying "can we go over that part? Does it go like this or that?" That can help because the person may not understand the part or know they even have it wrong per se...

We all mess up though! The fact that you're even concerned about it and seem to want to rectify the situation excludes you from being a bad person...

 

[consectaneus]

I appreciate every comment. This thing is still shaking out so I think it's some beginning growing pains. We are all over the map stylistically. It started as an acoustic band, then we moved to a really nice practice space so we had room for drums. Then I decided we didn't need three acoustics strumming away, so I went to my preferred instrument, the bass. All of the sudden we had something resembling a real band and got pretty excited and got ahead of our skis a little. At least that's my diagnosis. That's a good suggestion above to build with simpler songs. We have a couple of country songs, and I see we have some CCR in the pipeline that could be confidence builders.

The rhythm guitarist has made comments about being the weak link, so I know he's aware. It's kind of crazy to hear people with similar experiences here. It's like you were in the room. Especially the part about "I play it this way--we can do our own version", which triggers my OCD. The particular song in question in this case is "Wish You Were Here". The leader is a Pink Floyd fan, and I thought, two acoustics, electric bass and drums...perfect. That song (as cliche as it is by now) still moves me, and I practiced to get the bass and vocals (I sing too). I wanted this one a little too badly, I guess. So when the rhythm guitarist shows up saying he just learned it that morning, and yes, started in about doing it "his way", and that even though the accents aren't the same, it's still in time, etc., I lost it little. The weird thing is, he really is sincere. He wants to get better. We have just come up against the limitations of ability pretty quickly. I need to research beginning rock/pop with a few open chords. I know there are countless like that.

 

[7615]

In the passive aggressive victimhood society we now live in it is next to impossible to be good if you have to tip toe. That you have to tip toe at all is the problem.

Telling a drummer that there is a difference between rehearsal and practice - er the guitarist, myself know our parts - we rehearse to put it together. Explain to the drummer in even tones the difference and we don't need to help him with mechanics - butt hurt. Nose out of joint. As long as you explain your position thoughtfully and technically - if they can respond to the substance fine - butt hurt? Don't say sorry - say grow up.

Play sports but don't get rough - they would laugh you off the field. Goes with the territory. Music is about bringing ideas together and some are accepted others are discarded.

Learning to disagree , articulate the disagreement, listen, is a forgotten skill. To play music well it's imperative.

Always being the accommodator becomes a very tiresome role. A slippery slope being the sorry guy.

 

[LBS-bass]

OP says this is a casual band, and seems to feel he crossed the line. A little different from a working band. Correct the personal issue so they can move to correct the the music.

A band has a purpose, though. Even if the purpose is just to have a good time, how are you supposed to do that if people aren't doing the minimum amount required to make actual music? It is absolutely not fun to show up at a rehearsal and find out that no one can play the material. What are you there for?

I wrote a long post about this last night and then didn't send it because I think people are tired of hearing me go off about this, but rehearsal is not a place where you waste everyone else's time to learn songs you had an entire week to learn on your own. If it's strictly a jam band where you're playing the same three or four chord songs that everyone has heard a million times, that's one thing. But if there is music to be learned, the time to learn it is before everyone gets together. Even if it's "just for fun" because knowing the music is a prerequisite for the fun to happen.

For me, if I were the OP, I would have been disappointed. I probably wouldn't have said anything, but I'd tuck that in the back of my mind as a red flag and if it keeps happening I'd be looking for someone else to play with.