I think I stop believing in expensive basses!

[alaskaleftybass]

I'm very happy for the people who use boutique basses. There should be a higher art form for the bass, and something quite exceptional for those who want to spent some well earned money on something that's truly unique. Like Rolls Royce's. Every piece of wood is hand made and polished and buffed to suit the car. These kinds of works of art tell yourself and people around you "I've arrived." There are probably special nuances and tones that people's ears heard AND FEEL with their fingers that makes them very happy. That's a good thing.

For me? I bought and Ibanez Roadstar in 1980, still have it, and pull it out on occasion for special shows. But for regular work, I have an Ibanez SR500. Could I afford a more expensive bass? Absolutely! Would my wife kill me? Absolutely! But once I got the Ibanez SR500 set up the way I liked it, I just kept playing it. It sounds beautiful and only asks for a 9 volt battery and new strings now and then. Can my ear hear the special nuances of a boutiqe bass? Prolly not, cuz I burned out the high end of my poor ears from too many years of standing next to drummers lol.

If you want a boutique bass, may you find your perfect bass. If you are like me and run of the mill works for you, good for you too. Just remember to wash your hands before you play. Hey wait-- didn't Jaco eat fried chicken right before he played? lol...

 

[MikeBass]

For the record, I firmly believe there is a breaking point, as I stated before.
I feel these days it's about $2000.

And I have picked up the rare Squire CV Jazz and it smoked every other Jazz style bass that GC had hanging on the wall.
Be it CS, MIA, MIJ, MIM or what ever.
And bested a few Skylines IMO as well.

Is this a rarity? Sure.
But sometimes everything comes together and it just totally works.

Was the fit/finish good? By that price range standards yes.
By $4000+ standard? Oh hells no.

But where it matters most, sound and feel, it had it.


This local GC had a trans orange MIA standard Jazz a few years back.
It was flat out one of the best Jazz styled basses I ever played. To this day I wish I would have found some way to get it. I just didn't have the coin at the time.
And when I finally did, it was long gone.
I went in there a number of times and every time I picked it up I shook my head.

 

[MrBEAR]

Been there, played many, owned many, and still have not found 100% satisfaction from any of them.

However I did purchase a Used Brubaker NBS Extreme 5 that got me 95% there.
Since that purchase I have played more than twenty other BOUTIQUE basses and 30 + off the self classic models, both import and domestic.

I am now down to one early 60's Fender, original owner that paid less than retail in 1965 for a NOS Jazz, and the previously mentioned Brubaker.

Call it $2,800.00 for the benchmark pricing on the used Brubaker.

I have yet to play any bass that comes close to my NBS Extreme 5.

Would I buy another USA Brubaker at retail/direct pricing?

Possibly, ........................

 

[grendle]

A lot of the arguments here depend solely on what your idea of a "quality" bass is. I hate to pick on a brand , but if your idea of a top quality instrument is a us fender. Your missing the boat, and paying for the name imo.
If its something along the lines of a pedulla, alembic, status, warrior, Roscoe, Fodera etc, your paying for a much higher quality instrument in materials and craftsmanship. The differences between the construction of the 2 groups are night and day. There are some things worth paying for ( wood, construction, materials etc.) And some that aren't (the name) . Just my .02.

 

[ShonnaFan]

If you play it and are happy with it, then it's all good. If a bass has mojo to you, then that goes a long way, too.

That being said what the previous poster said about woods, construction, etc. has a lot of truth. Also about paying for Fender marketing costs when buying a Fender

I am no where near the point of appreciating a truly fine bass, and am happy with my Fenders.

I held two handmade Italian 6 string bass guitars yesterday, one made from an individually selected piece of redwood. Lord knows what they cost, and I was too polite to ask, but they screamed quality. I was scared sh*tless of dropping one. The care and detail that went into the crafting of these instruments was obvious to even my ignorant senses.

I think that those who can appreciate and bring the most out of a fine bass usually go in the direction of custom instruments. I am many years from being in that group, but have an incredible amount of respect for them.

 

[sopirate55]

I needed a bass just to noodle around with and play some at church. I definitely did not want to sink a lot of money into it to play every once in a while. I've had jazz basses in the past, but sold them to help fund my GAS addiction. I went against my normal routine and I ordered a SBMM ray 34 from GC. I played a friends and it was nice enough for what I needed. I had it shipped to the store to open it in front of them so if there were any problems. Double boxed and not a scratch on the boxes. Pulled it out of the gig bag and there was a dent big enough to lay your thumb in. Obviously it hit something while in the bag before it went in the box. I don't believe they would've sent it out like this. Anyhow, could find anything to trade it for at GC that i liked, so they refunded my money. (BTW, GC in Raleigh NC is one of the better ones. Friendly staff and very helpful. Merchandise is not as beat up as other GC stores either) I went to a local store to buy a MIA jazz bass they had in, and it was very nice. While there, I picked up a VM Squier just to screw around with because it was quirky looking. I ended up with VM Squier. The MIA jazz was nicer but, for a 1000 difference, there was real value in that squier and it sounded better than most of the MIM standards they had, plus it's a maple body and actually has a little figuring to it which is nice.

IOW, use your fingers and eyes, and ignore the price tag. There are some real grabs out there for great prices if you avoid the cork sniffery.

 

[MixBass]

Don't stop believing!

 

[MikeBass]

oh come on guys.

like when u could afford a 15,000$ bass u would rather play a 400$ mim Fender cause there is no difference ... sheesh. some people have the money or the endorsement to play boutique, and if i had one of the two, hell yes, i would play boutique basses too.

cause i dont have an endorsement or big money, i tried to get the best bang for the buck for me, my opinion,my play and my personal needs. simple as that.

you know in the bottom line, it is about what makes YOU happy. can be a boutique bass, can be a 60$ fender as long as you love that thing and play it.

At one point I did basically just that.
Had a Matt Garrison Fodera that was optioned pretty good.
But LOVED playing both my Guild Pilot and a Warmoth J4 with Barts.

And Lucas, my point is yes there is a difference that is obvious when solo'd. But not as much when in context.

I had a chance to play the Fodera that was on their site that was known as "the Beast".
If I recall, it was at the time it was pretty much the top dollar one they built.
IMO (and plenty other Detroit guys who played it) it was awful.
Lifeless, dull and really didn't play very well.
I wold have rather have had ANY MIA Fender on a gig than that thing.
But it did look flat out balls deluxe amazing.

 

[Just Thumpin']

My daughter plays a $160 Squire Bronco. She bought it when she decided to play bass. I offered to her that she could play any of mine but she wanted a shorter scale (she's a small girl) and wanted to pay for it with her own money.

I can hear the difference between her bass and one of my Monarchs blindfolded, two rooms away. But that is me. Some people won't care about the difference and that is fine. I am sure that some will even say that there is no difference. Nowhere in any of my posts will you see me saying that what we do here at Fodera is right for everyone. Far from it. We build at the level that we do because it gives us tremendous pleasure to continually push the envelope. We are a constant work in progress and we will always be trying to squeeze every possible bit of tone, response and playability out of our instruments. Some players care and some don't. I will NEVER place a value judgment on either. That said, for me, telling the difference between my daughter's bass and one of mine is beyond simple.

Jason, several of the posters here are saying that as regards tone, the 180 dollar cheapo budget bass is identical to yours, and that no one can tell the difference blindfolded. What do you have to say about that? or is the statement they are making so ridiculous that it doesn't even deserve a response?

 

[labrador]

I think there are well made low priced basses but theres a reason the top dollar basses sell for top dollar. So yes there's a market for them and most of us who own a bunch love them dearly. My Modulus is my baby I've had it since 1993 and it never goes out of tune.

 

[iJazz]

GregC--enjoying the irony.

You might have to dumb it down several notches to explain it to him.

You know guys, if you're going to do it, do it right. You forgot your smugs. Here, let me help...



The fact that my perspective is lost or misunderstood by the both of you is neither here nor there to me. Just as I won't change your minds in this issue, you will be unable to change mine. That's cool. If you want to pay some ungodly amount of money for any overpriced object and feel you got good value out of the deal, that is your right. Have fun. Just don't expect me to toady along going "OOOH! AAAHHH!", nor to silence whatever criticism I may feel is appropriate.

iJazz - No angora-lined goat scrotum gig-bags for me; nor coffee table to carry in one.

 

[Harpo61]

I hate any bass that someone else owns

LOL

 

[chuck norriss]

I still believe in expensive basses. The suck with Squiers even some Fenders is you play one it's great. The same bass right next to it is lifeless . They're inconsistent. It degrades consumer confidence. You have to go through a few of the same inexpensive bass until you find a good one. Too arduous & tedious. At least the CIJ's are consistent.

 

[Roy Vogt]

I hate any bass that someone else owns

LOL

85% of bassists own a bass that's better than yours. The odds are 50/50 that it either cost under $200 and is made of scrap lumber in China or cost over $10,000 and has extinct Siberian Mammoth ivory inlays on a 900 year old Ebony fingerboard hand polished by Tibetan Monks and a Narwhal tusk nut.

 

[MikeBass]

My daughter plays a $160 Squire Bronco. She bought it when she decided to play bass. I offered to her that she could play any of mine but she wanted a shorter scale (she's a small girl) and wanted to pay for it with her own money.

I can hear the difference between her bass and one of my Monarchs blindfolded, two rooms away. But that is me. Some people won't care about the difference and that is fine. I am sure that some will even say that there is no difference. Nowhere in any of my posts will you see me saying that what we do here at Fodera is right for everyone. Far from it. We build at the level that we do because it gives us tremendous pleasure to continually push the envelope. We are a constant work in progress and we will always be trying to squeeze every possible bit of tone, response and playability out of our instruments. Some players care and some don't. I will NEVER place a value judgment on either. That said, for me, telling the difference between my daughter's bass and one of mine is beyond simple.

And so could I. Or really anyone of us.
A single pick up short scale passive bass will always sound different than any Fodera or anything else. I see your point but really, that comparrison is rather weak.
But a MIA DLX "Jazz" vs. an NYC Empire "Jazz" and it gets tougher. Quickly.
And really, of all people you should be able to tell....you work there. Especially between a short scale single pickup passive bass vs your Fodera ......

Like I said, a multi humbucker'd pre-amp'd bass is naturally going to sound significantly different from a passive Jazz. From any price point.

 

[MVPBASS]

Mike, you play expensive basses, yet you seem to be on the other team here. You used to be Mr. Sadowsky

 

[bass_study]

One of the best session players in my area told me the manufacturers of most of the high end bass now try to imitate the sound of vintage jazz bass, but with more possibilities. It maybe the reason why the sound like jazz bass for you .

 

[GregC]

You know guys, if you're going to do it, do it right. You forgot your smugs. Here, let me help...



The fact that my perspective is lost or misunderstood by the both of you is neither here nor there to me. Just as I won't change your minds in this issue, you will be unable to change mine. That's cool. If you want to pay some ungodly amount of money for any overpriced object and feel you got good value out of the deal, that is your right. Have fun. Just don't expect me to toady along going "OOOH! AAAHHH!", nor to silence whatever criticism I may feel is appropriate.

iJazz - No angora-lined goat scrotum gig-bags for me; nor coffee table to carry in one.

*shrug* My post simply pointed out that you criticized someone for an ad hominem attack and spelling errors when you've done the very same things yourself. (If you're going to take on the owner of a boutique bass builder in the thread, don't misspell the company's name all three times.) It had nothing to do with comprehension of your viewpoint.

The funny/sad part here is, almost no one in this thread is calling inexpensive basses worthless or junk. Yet here you are, larding on the florid, stereotypical criticism of boutique basses over and over again.

As for your "perspective", let's take a look at this sample:

Oh, and by the way, although "wood is wood," having rubbed my knuckles raw any number of times tapping hundreds of pieces of it when selecting material for our instruments...you would be flat out amazed at just how different a great piece of wood and a mediocre one sounds. When we build our instruments, the mediocre pieces get cut up and put into the trash...heck we have cut up and rebuilt entire instruments that we did not like the sound of. I am virtually certain that this hyper attention to detail is not part of the build process for a $199 instrument (or for many $1,000 instruments, for that matter).

Having read the post twice as suggested I learned that people who have 30 years of experience are some times unable to bring that experience to bear in anticipating the outcome of their efforts, to the point that they will sometimes destroy their own final work product because it came out so poorly.

I guess I'm supposed to be impressed by this. In fact, I am. It supports my belief that boutique bass builders are over-hyped.

iJazz - Just following directions.

Now you have a right to voice your opinion. But you laud your own posts such as this as "critical thinking"? Oh hellll naw. That's simply twisting part of what someone said and willfully ignoring the rest in order to fit your desired, predetermined conclusion. As was said earlier in a post you didn't respond to:

Dude... wow...

Never done something out of love, passion, drive to perfection? Can't recognize it in others?

 

[petrus61]

Two of the most unimpressive basses I have ever played have been a Fodera Yin-Yang and a Squier CV P-Bass. Both equally hyped..., IMO, both equally sucked. So what does that do to either side of the argument? Nothing. It's perspective, plain and simple.

 

[MVPBASS]

The worst basses that I have ever played have been on the wall at Guitar Center, so mostly Squier, Fender MIMs, Epiphones and Music Mans. Nothing against those brands but since they were at Guitar Center, they weren't set up, which is why they played like turds. Unfortunately, that was my first impression of done of those basses and I base my opinion on those experiences.