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I think I stop believing in expensive basses!
- Thread starter FunkyMan
- Start date
- Status
- Jun 3, 2009
- 3,330
- 399
- Disclosures
- Bassgearu, Music Industry Consulting and Sales. Tech 21, NBE Corp, Sonosphere.
I'll pop in again.
What you get with an expensive bass that you don't get with a cheap bass is personal attention to detail. No SX has a luthier hand planing and sanding the necks to shape, fitting the neck and body together, really crafting it. Inexpensive imports are mostly machined, then some manual labor then out the door. With the skill of machines and operators today, you get a decent product at a reasonable price. But you will never get the same as a boutique.
Feel and response are usually the biggest difference in expensive basses. The necks on my Kubickis are probably the best production necks I've ever played. And Phil touched everyone that was ever made, with the exception of the few made at Fender for a couple of years. They play much, much better then just about any other bass I own.
I recently purchased a Gibson 20/20 bass from 1987. I did a play comparison with a Gibson Victory bass of about the same time, and the neck on the Steinberger designed bass was far superior in feel, even though it was made in the same plant. Ned had personal oversight of these basses, and it definitely comes through.
A great way to understand this would be to go to any music store by you that has ALL of the Ibanez from the starter/micro all the way up to the new SR Prestige. All of those designs have the same basic shape and the same basic everything. Now, if you play each one, I am positive you will definitely find the more expensive they get, the better feel they have, the better playing they are, and the smoother and more responsive to you they are.
Go try it.
That having been said, in doing the same test, at a point you will notice diminishing returns in tone after a certain price point.
What you get with an expensive bass that you don't get with a cheap bass is personal attention to detail. No SX has a luthier hand planing and sanding the necks to shape, fitting the neck and body together, really crafting it. Inexpensive imports are mostly machined, then some manual labor then out the door. With the skill of machines and operators today, you get a decent product at a reasonable price. But you will never get the same as a boutique.
Feel and response are usually the biggest difference in expensive basses. The necks on my Kubickis are probably the best production necks I've ever played. And Phil touched everyone that was ever made, with the exception of the few made at Fender for a couple of years. They play much, much better then just about any other bass I own.
I recently purchased a Gibson 20/20 bass from 1987. I did a play comparison with a Gibson Victory bass of about the same time, and the neck on the Steinberger designed bass was far superior in feel, even though it was made in the same plant. Ned had personal oversight of these basses, and it definitely comes through.
A great way to understand this would be to go to any music store by you that has ALL of the Ibanez from the starter/micro all the way up to the new SR Prestige. All of those designs have the same basic shape and the same basic everything. Now, if you play each one, I am positive you will definitely find the more expensive they get, the better feel they have, the better playing they are, and the smoother and more responsive to you they are.
Go try it.
That having been said, in doing the same test, at a point you will notice diminishing returns in tone after a certain price point.
That price point could be pretty low in terms of tone, too. However, I played my Fodera (as usual) at my acoustic trio's rehearsal today, and there's just something about that bass that makes me feel like I have a responsibility to make the best music I can. I feel better playing it, too. I know, it's all psychosomatic, but what the heck.
OK, I'll show you a couple. Now do you believe?
You need to do something about those basses the wood is rotting.
They look amazing.
I'd like to add my 2 cents. first off I've been a guitar player for 20 years and recently decided to give it up and switch to bass. mainly because of an increasing boredom and staleness with guitar. not to mention the egos involved with guitar and the fact that every d bag plays guitar now it seems. so I went and sold all my gear. 6 guitars 5 amps 20 effects etc. I used the money to buy a fender American standard jazz bass from a major guitar chain the first one that arrived blew me away with the horrible craft ship. I wouldn't have accepted that quality on a squier let alone a $1300 instrument i have never seen a worse neck pocket! I had them get me a me a replacement. the second one was no better and had them get me another. the third had one of the worst feet jobs I've seen not to mention that it was new and was $1350! so I said screw it and asked them to write me a check and went and bought a used mim 2004 standard jazz bass in sage green and it blows away the 3 American standards in craftsmanship. what else is there to say? I saved 1000 and received a better made instrument, that I feel plays better and sounds just as good.
Of all the ways to take what I wrote, I figured this would be yours. Again, no surprise based on what I've read in this thread alone.
Name a pro builder who would contend they've never build something that disappointed them. Just one will do. What you contended was so over the top it's almost amazing that anyone would seriously say it.
Just one. Shouldn't be too much to ask.
Can't watch whatever this is on my phone. No doubt it's a video of every boutique bass ever made, performing flawlessly as usual.
You still don't seem to get that how you feel about a bass does not apply to every bass in that genre. For as worked up as you get over people saying an SX compares to high end basses, you've gone off the deep end in the other direction with your proclamations. And apparently don't even see it and just feel victimized... again.
Which is cool. This is definitely cheap entertainment.
Not a bad sound to be found, right? If that really is your reality then you must be very easy to please. Which is cool but doesn't really support your proposition.
They fit my playing style very well and consistently give me exactly what I'm looking for performance-wise. A big, controllable sound, a finesse instrument that can also hit hard.
The first one I bought here on TB used for $1100. Took it on a gig and it just killed in the mix. That's what I look for... repeatable killer sound, easy playability... I dial my action in fairly low and need the bass to play cleanly but still sound aggressive. Much, much easier said than done IME with most basses. That's why I favor Brubakers.
Currently I'm also gigging with my Fodera, F bass, Glasstone, R Bass and used my Fender FMT a couple of weeks ago. I favor the Brubakers, they get the lion's share of gig time. Because of how much I travel, the low action I prefer and the fact that my basses are wooden, I might sometimes have to tweak the rod on any of them... and I don't consider that a flaw.
I'm perfectly happy to admit that I haven't had the luck that some others have had with all boutique basses. I've had extensive experience with at least 90% of them. And I'm pretty good at figuring out how to get what I want out of just about anything within reason. They're not all created equal... some basses just fight you. Every builder doesn't do great consistent fretwork. Every electronics package doesn't sound good. If someone hasn't experienced an expensive bass with harsh highs, missing mids, indistinct lows, hit or miss fretwork or any of the other things I've come across, they're probably either not as critical as I am or haven't played that many examples of what's been out there over the last several decades.
The funny thing is that I'm not critical enough to automatically dismiss a bass because of a low price. Price tags continue to leave me unimpressed.
Exactly. Your experiences are normal. And knowing several luthiers, they're perfectly willing to note that every bass they've built haven't been winners, particular compared to basses they built that they thought better represented their work.
Just did a post or so ago. And I will be the first to say that what works for me may not work for someone else. That would be delusional and people who tell you that you'll love something regardless of anything don't do anybody any good. Its a waste of words.
I think you meant to say that they're perfectly willing to note that not every bass they've built has been a winner.
You need to do something about those basses the wood is rotting.
They look amazing.
Thanks. The wood has been chemically stabilized with polyurethane or polyester or something. It really is diseased wood, though.
There are all sorts of boutique basses. They run the gamut from spectacular to pretty good to good to what the heck where they thinking IME. I found the price to only be a barometer of the price. I've played $300 basses with a good setup that smoked some boutique basses with a good setup. The trick may be that I don't assume a bass will do anything, I actually play it and see. Based on that, the more expensive = a better bass thing has failed so many times IME to render it practically pointless.
My advice... figure out what you like and why. Learn how the instrument works and how to set it up. Learn how to amplify your instrument. I can easily see a player realizing that for what they're really looking for, the price tag may actually be low. The main problem is often not gear related.
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