I'm aware. Labels always mean something. I have nothing to honor or live up to.
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Ideal Bass for Bluegrass - Challenging Preconceptions
- Thread starter M-Mittlesteadt
- Start date
I'm aware. Labels always mean something. I have nothing to honor or live up to.
I’m just using this thread as an excuse to post some bluegrass on the electric side.
Your ideas and approach are not groundbreaking. You could certainly make some cool music. Which would be cooler if you played an upright. Haha
I'd be interested to know if some of the lineups involving players like Sierra Hull and Molly Tuttle count as Bluegrass.
Heck, the couple of times I've been called to dep on Bluegrass gigs, I worried I'd seem out of place just because my double bass has modern steel strings that sustain and growl, rather than gut or faux gut.
Granted, that’s more of a Django Reinhardt line-up, but why do you necessarily have to have mandolin or banjo? He’s obviously not sweating other ‘traditional’ aspects.
Look, I'm not out to disparage Bluegrass, either for the casual listener or hardcore purists. Keep it. I don't want it.
I've been playing music full and part time for over 45 years, playing almost every genre, in any kind of venue you can imagine. But...
To quote Hunter S. Thompson - "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There is also a bad side."
I took a hiatus from the bs. I came back to playing bass, but only will if it's on MY terms. I'm old, tired, cranky and sick of the state of an awful lot of crappy, soulless music. I have health issues and honestly don't know how much longer I have left to play (or live for that matter).
Many of you,. bless your hearts and passion (I sincerely mean that) are still young and healthy enough and may choose to make a living playing music and in many cases still willing to prostitute yourselves for the money and enjoyment of gigging. It's a job to be done to the satisfaction of those that hire you (and whatever that may entail). More power to you. I did that. No more.
I don't need the money, and don't need the gigs. I'm in bed before most of you even start your gig. It's a big world loaded with opportunities and I did it myself for most of my life. I no longer have to subject myself to anything that does not satisfy me or my love for playing. It's on MY terms and I call the shots now. It's liberating.
I've been there/done that. I'm not some bedroom hack. I've been around here on TB for a long time, but lost my info for my previous profile (aka - Sundogue) so I created a new one. I was a traveling professional in my younger days, then after marriages, kids, grandkids, jobs, other career paths and just a change in lifestyle I could only play music part time before I called it quits.
It took a lot of contemplation before I decided to come back to it at all. Time will tell if I regret doing so. But I have an opportunity to still contribute music to the world, albeit in a Bluegrass band. I really dislike stereotypical, traditional bluegrass, My friend (who I've written music with for all these past 45+ years off and on) approached me about writing some new music and play in this "bluegrass" band he was a part of. I initially declined. But when he told me I could play the bass part in any manner I wanted (much as I had with all the other cross-genre music we'd written together), I though sure, I'll give it a try.
I kind of posted this thread in jest. If I were younger and needed the gig, I'd probably at the very least, get an EUB or a fretless Precision with flatwounds. But now? No way.
I'm at that stage of my life where (to give an analogy) "I'm about four songs left in the last set before packing up". I'm not done yet, but I sure ain't playing "the game" any longer. I'll leave that to the rest of you.
If you're a bluegrass purest and want to give me a hard time about it...get off my porch!
I've been playing music full and part time for over 45 years, playing almost every genre, in any kind of venue you can imagine. But...
To quote Hunter S. Thompson - "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There is also a bad side."
I took a hiatus from the bs. I came back to playing bass, but only will if it's on MY terms. I'm old, tired, cranky and sick of the state of an awful lot of crappy, soulless music. I have health issues and honestly don't know how much longer I have left to play (or live for that matter).
Many of you,. bless your hearts and passion (I sincerely mean that) are still young and healthy enough and may choose to make a living playing music and in many cases still willing to prostitute yourselves for the money and enjoyment of gigging. It's a job to be done to the satisfaction of those that hire you (and whatever that may entail). More power to you. I did that. No more.
I don't need the money, and don't need the gigs. I'm in bed before most of you even start your gig. It's a big world loaded with opportunities and I did it myself for most of my life. I no longer have to subject myself to anything that does not satisfy me or my love for playing. It's on MY terms and I call the shots now. It's liberating.
I've been there/done that. I'm not some bedroom hack. I've been around here on TB for a long time, but lost my info for my previous profile (aka - Sundogue) so I created a new one. I was a traveling professional in my younger days, then after marriages, kids, grandkids, jobs, other career paths and just a change in lifestyle I could only play music part time before I called it quits.
It took a lot of contemplation before I decided to come back to it at all. Time will tell if I regret doing so. But I have an opportunity to still contribute music to the world, albeit in a Bluegrass band. I really dislike stereotypical, traditional bluegrass, My friend (who I've written music with for all these past 45+ years off and on) approached me about writing some new music and play in this "bluegrass" band he was a part of. I initially declined. But when he told me I could play the bass part in any manner I wanted (much as I had with all the other cross-genre music we'd written together), I though sure, I'll give it a try.
I kind of posted this thread in jest. If I were younger and needed the gig, I'd probably at the very least, get an EUB or a fretless Precision with flatwounds. But now? No way.
I'm at that stage of my life where (to give an analogy) "I'm about four songs left in the last set before packing up". I'm not done yet, but I sure ain't playing "the game" any longer. I'll leave that to the rest of you.
If you're a bluegrass purest and want to give me a hard time about it...get off my porch!
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EdwardofHuncote
I Still Dream of Jeannie
- Aug 21, 2013
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- I privately own and operate a local musical instument repair shop.
Neo-oldtyme ensemble.
Newgrass/Jamband scenario, same bass...
But when I get to the Fiddlers Convention... it's all about the doghouse...
If there's a point, it's more about what notes you play, rather than what bass you play. Fit into the scene, whatever it is.
Newgrass/Jamband scenario, same bass...
But when I get to the Fiddlers Convention... it's all about the doghouse...
If there's a point, it's more about what notes you play, rather than what bass you play. Fit into the scene, whatever it is.
It doesn’t sound like you are considering upright at all, and probably just as well. It’s not something you take up later in life and achieve much other than sore hands.
Other than upright, I’ve played a lot of bluegrass on a Fender Mustang with flats, but that’s when I was trying to achieve a somewhat traditional bass tone for bluegrass. It’s clear that’s not your objective.
Acoustic bass guitars are another choice, but might as well play a solid body if non-traditional bluegrass tone is good to go.
If the guitars are D-28s or D-18s info condenser mics, don’t discount thumpy bass tone to fit in well. It’s a good contrast to the bright ringing high end. You can get that in a lot of ways, but for a solid body bass with magnetic pickups, a rubber mute under the strings at the bridge works well. “Rubber” like the door seal material on a car.
If the guitars are all equipped with piezo bridge saddle pickups plugged in to amps or PA, about any bass tone fits…
Based on your replies to suggestions that took the term “bluegrass” into account, I think a Dingwall Combustion 6 should work.
Other than upright, I’ve played a lot of bluegrass on a Fender Mustang with flats, but that’s when I was trying to achieve a somewhat traditional bass tone for bluegrass. It’s clear that’s not your objective.
Acoustic bass guitars are another choice, but might as well play a solid body if non-traditional bluegrass tone is good to go.
If the guitars are D-28s or D-18s info condenser mics, don’t discount thumpy bass tone to fit in well. It’s a good contrast to the bright ringing high end. You can get that in a lot of ways, but for a solid body bass with magnetic pickups, a rubber mute under the strings at the bridge works well. “Rubber” like the door seal material on a car.
If the guitars are all equipped with piezo bridge saddle pickups plugged in to amps or PA, about any bass tone fits…
Based on your replies to suggestions that took the term “bluegrass” into account, I think a Dingwall Combustion 6 should work.
Just ask yourself WWJBD and the answer will appear:
You are the one to give the keytar its long overdue moment in Bluegrass.
You are the one to give the keytar its long overdue moment in Bluegrass.
I don’t know what Andrew and Emily call it, but this is a bluegrass fest, and the P Bass seems to blend perfectly. Imagine that!
I hate that people keep spreading the myth that you need an upright in bluegrass. It's not true and and it never was true.
Many of the 1st generation bluegrass bands used electric bass. Idk why this misconception keeps getting rehashed.
You don't need your electric to sound like an upright either. Get good tone out of your instrument and play well and it'll be fine. Just like any other genre
Many of the 1st generation bluegrass bands used electric bass. Idk why this misconception keeps getting rehashed.
You don't need your electric to sound like an upright either. Get good tone out of your instrument and play well and it'll be fine. Just like any other genre
It's the Hee-Haw, hayseed, washtub bass and jug on the porch, no electricity out in the sticks, Deliverance, Dueling Banjos stereotype. And given that, how many UB's were even around to play in those scenarios? I'd say zilch.
I totally get purists (of all genres) wanting to maintain a sense of historic reverence, but really if it weren't for evolution of instrumentation and musicians using that in their creative pursuit where would music (of all kinds) be today?
Everybody steals a little bit of influence and incorporates it into their playing style and songwriting. My influences came from many different bass players, across many decades and different music, cultures and those who play entirely different instruments, across all genres. I don't have "a" style. I have "my" style which is a blend of everything I've ever heard and/or played.
I just so happened to stumble into a bluegrass band with very open-minded musicians who don't feel threatened by having a different influence in their "band".
One thing I am not, is a "poser", pretending to be something I'm not just fit in to get the gig. All I can (and want) to be, is me...take it or leave it.
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To what bands are your referring? 1st gen bluegrass bands formed prior to the availability of the mass produced electric bass guitar.
The most common strings on basses played in bluegrass are spirocores. I think that Zyex is catching up, and they can be pretty growly too.
Ist generation bluegrass bands used electric? Do you consider Doyle Lawson 1st generation?
I know of quite a few bluegrass band leaders who prefer electric bass. Doyle did. Little River Band always used an electric as far as I know. Doc Watson, not really bluegrass, but anyway he used the same electric player on most of his recordings and shows. Hot Rize used an electric. One of the current bands, Authentic Unlimited, uses either an electric or electric upright. Larry Sparks used a double bass in his shows but usually recorded witb electric.
I think that electric is tolerated, but double bass is still more or less expected.
Good for you!
Last weekend, I attended the "50th annual SPBGMA (pronouced "Spig-ma") Bluegrass Music Awards, & 41st National Covention and Band Championship". I prefer Spig-ma. Lol. It's a pretty big event for those into bluegrass and old time country music. Traditionally it was uprights all the way, but as time goes by (and possibly the due to the amount of younger people getting inovled in this genre... Very cool to see.) more and more bass instruments are being accepted.
The event was held at a pretty large Nashville hotel, and in the evening you can walk through the entire hotel, and find small groups gathered, and playing. I was impressed that everyone kept volumes in check, there was no competiton, just everyone enjoying good music. The groups contained young and old alike. you could go through the floors of the hotel almost every room had their door open with another group playing.
I saw a number of different instruments. Uprights of couse, with a lot of 1/2 size basses. Next, there was several (a few?, but more than the other alternatives) ABG's, all accompanied with a small amp. This was followed by solid body basses, most Fender shape objects, again with a small amp.
I also saw a few EUB's, one was a Zeta Crossover, and I also saw at least one NS Cello, which sounded amazing. Not here, but I have seen resonator basses, washtubs, and even the occasional banjo bass.
Thankfully, I think the majority of the bluegrass community has gotten over the idea of the upright being the blugrass standard.
Have fun!
Last weekend, I attended the "50th annual SPBGMA (pronouced "Spig-ma") Bluegrass Music Awards, & 41st National Covention and Band Championship". I prefer Spig-ma. Lol. It's a pretty big event for those into bluegrass and old time country music. Traditionally it was uprights all the way, but as time goes by (and possibly the due to the amount of younger people getting inovled in this genre... Very cool to see.) more and more bass instruments are being accepted.
The event was held at a pretty large Nashville hotel, and in the evening you can walk through the entire hotel, and find small groups gathered, and playing. I was impressed that everyone kept volumes in check, there was no competiton, just everyone enjoying good music. The groups contained young and old alike. you could go through the floors of the hotel almost every room had their door open with another group playing.
I saw a number of different instruments. Uprights of couse, with a lot of 1/2 size basses. Next, there was several (a few?, but more than the other alternatives) ABG's, all accompanied with a small amp. This was followed by solid body basses, most Fender shape objects, again with a small amp.
I also saw a few EUB's, one was a Zeta Crossover, and I also saw at least one NS Cello, which sounded amazing. Not here, but I have seen resonator basses, washtubs, and even the occasional banjo bass.
Thankfully, I think the majority of the bluegrass community has gotten over the idea of the upright being the blugrass standard.
Have fun!
I have found a P bass always works well with acoustic instruments (I’m not getting into the genre fight)
I'm in the UK - without a direct connection to what's happening on the ground in the present-day US scene, guys playing older US styles here can sometimes get very orthodox, almost like a re-enactor situation.
I'm a Spirocore enjoyer myself, and the gig went off fine just by keeping things clean and simple and not trying to do anything flashy. It was more me overthinking my pre-gig nerves, really!
Reno and smiley, Jim and Jesse, Osborne Brothers, Doyle Lawson, jimmy Martin, Scruggs, Larry Sparks.
There might be some debate on who's truly first gen but these are all classic artists. They may not have used electrics initially but we're all happy to adopt it pretty early on.
