Intonation problems with GHS Precision Flats

[Boneless]

I bought a medium scale set for my Guild Starfire I (as suggested by the GHS rep). I mounted them. The G and D strings sound fine, although they are *very* bright. (I assume these strings need lots and lots of breaking in). The A and E strings sound all over the place. Very nasty overtones, unclear fundamental, also hard to tune as the tuner has lots of trouble stabilising (as expected by the sound I'm hearing). I stretched the strings. I checked for string torsion (there didn't appear to be any). Setup was fine, no fret buzzing or whatever. The E string also sounded a bit choked (it's a .095, I know Precision Flats are old school and with a very thumpy E, but the lower tension on the E as opposed to a regular .105 should mitigate the issue?). Am I doing something wrong? It's not as if I'm a novice at bass.

 

[michael_t]

I stretched the strings...

Something I would never do personally is to stretch new strings manually right after installation in order to avoid overdoing it. One thing I do make sure to do is to set the witness points properly, and once they're tuned up to pitch, I let them sit quietly and settle naturally (usually overnight).

The 45-95 set I installed on my P bass (34" scale) two months ago have had no issues whatsoever.

 

[Boneless]

Something I would never do personally is to stretch new strings manually right after installation in order to avoid overdoing it. One thing I do make sure to do is to set the witness points properly, and once they're tuned up to pitch, I let them sit quietly and settle naturally (usually overnight).

The 45-95 set I installed on my P bass (34" scale) two months ago have had no issues whatsoever.

They sounded awful *before* stretching. I stretched them in order to see if it would fix the issue.

 

[michael_t]

They sounded awful *before* stretching. I stretched them in order to see if it would fix the issue.

What about setting witness points?

I used to have problems with new strings not staying in tune or not intonating properly. That was before I knew anything about "witness points".

Witness Points: The Pictorial

No more issues with new strings ever since.

 

[FunkHead]

I would make sure the strings aren’t twisted. The witness point thing he’s little blown out of proportion around here.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

I agree. First, make sure the strings aren’t twisted. And I also agree on witness points. In 46+ years of playing, I’ve never done it, and I’ve had zero problems not doing it. And I just watched a setup video with Michael Tobias and Roger Sadowsky, where they both advise against doing it.

 

[michael_t]

And I also agree on witness points. In 46+ years of playing, I’ve never done it, and I’ve had zero problems not doing it. And I just watched a setup video with Michael Tobias and Roger Sadowsky, where they both advise against doing it.

I first learned it from Scott Devine (scottsbasslessons.com). The simple fact is it has made a huge difference for me, so I will continue doing it. Just my experience...

 

[HaphAsSard]

I would make sure the strings aren’t twisted.

First, make sure the strings aren’t twisted.

The OP says they're not (that's what he means by "torsion")

And I also agree on witness points. In 46+ years of playing, I’ve never done it, and I’ve had zero problems not doing it. And I just watched a setup video with Michael Tobias and Roger Sadowsky, where they both advise against doing it.

If you're referring to the discussion at the 30:30 mark, IIUC they don't really advise against it: they just advise not to do it before finalising intonation at the saddle.

@Boneless: any chance they're simply too fresh still? The Fender 9050 also had lots of nasty overtones in the first month or so. Or, as logdrum says below, you may just have been unlucky with that packet.

 

[logdrum]

You could have bad strings. GHS will probably send you new set. It happened to me with D'Addario black tapes. On the A string winding was messed up. Won't intonate. And when I loosened the string the, winding unraveled. I think one of the GHS CS reps, Mr Moody? is a member here.

 

[mikeward]

I bought a medium scale set for my Guild Starfire I (as suggested by the GHS rep). I mounted them. The G and D strings sound fine, although they are *very* bright. (I assume these strings need lots and lots of breaking in). The A and E strings sound all over the place. Very nasty overtones, unclear fundamental, also hard to tune as the tuner has lots of trouble stabilising (as expected by the sound I'm hearing). I stretched the strings. I checked for string torsion (there didn't appear to be any). Setup was fine, no fret buzzing or whatever. The E string also sounded a bit choked (it's a .095, I know Precision Flats are old school and with a very thumpy E, but the lower tension on the E as opposed to a regular .105 should mitigate the issue?). Am I doing something wrong? It's not as if I'm a novice at bass.

get yourself some curt mangan strings . i have a fender p bass 77 and a 97 stingray i play a low action and small gauge 40 to 90 dave fowler signature set! great stuff!!

 

[mikeward]

hi i highly reccomend a new string called curt mangans . i used ghs for yrs till quality problems i noticed quite often i switched to these dave fowler signature set ! light gauge small dia. low action 97 stingray and a 77 p bass!

 

[Bassnkeys]

You could have bad strings. GHS will probably send you new set. It happened to me with D'Addario black tapes. On the A string winding was messed up. Won't intonate. And when I loosened the string the, winding unraveled. I think one of the GHS CS reps, Mr Moody? is a member here.

This. You likely have a bad set. I used these strings for awhile. “Bright” and GHS Precision flats have never been uttered in the same sentence. I stopped playing them because (as first intended) they were indeed chocolatey dark, but I wanted more versatility.

Have them send you a new set.

 

[MrBassman22]

One's had an issue with these strings were there was a little bend in them around the pickups. The higher I played the more the intonation was off. Way beyond the reach off the saddles. Got a new set from shop.

 

[Geogio]

They sounded awful *before* stretching. I stretched them in order to see if it would fix the issue.

 

[Geogio]

I have read on this forum that occasionally the inner core wire gets twisted or bound and that could be the reason for a string sounding off. It would be a reasonable assumption to perhaps contact the manufacturer, and see what it would take would to replace the defective strings.

 

[Zooberwerx]

If you're referring to the discussion at the 30:30 mark, IIUC they don't really advise against it: they just advise not to do it before finalising intonation at the saddle.

@Boneless: any chance they're simply too fresh still? The Fender 9050 also had lots of nasty overtones in the first month or so. Or, as logdrum says below, you may just have been unlucky with that packet.

Highlighted for emphasis. There's actually a procedure for addressing this when installing a "foreign" set of strings.

Riis

 

[mcnach]

Something I would never do personally is to stretch new strings manually right after installation in order to avoid overdoing it. One thing I do make sure to do is to set the witness points properly, and once they're tuned up to pitch, I let them sit quietly and settle naturally (usually overnight).

The 45-95 set I installed on my P bass (34" scale) two months ago have had no issues whatsoever.

This.

I never found that 'stretching' does anything much. It may reduce/remove any slack introduced at the tuners but if you're careful there won't be any to start with. However setting the witness points was a revelation to me.
I was always mystified how it could take me a day or two to get my guitar stably in tune, but I'd watch these guys on stage being given freshly strung guitars again and again and never having an issue with stability. On a video I watch a guitar tech explain what he did... he did stretch a bit (nothing too harsh) and then set witness poiints. I've been doing that ever since and it works well. Only nylon strings on a classical guitar seem to take a bit longer.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

….If you're referring to the discussion at the 30:30 mark, IIUC they don't really advise against it: they just advise not to do it before finalising intonation at the saddle.

I can see where you come up with that conclusion from watching the video. I’m simply saying I don’t set witness points with my strings, and I’ve never had problems from not doing so.

And I’m not disagreeing with anyone who does otherwise, nor am I’ll telling anyone not to do it.


When I put new strings on one of my basses, I gently tug each string as I’m winding it around the post, then I tune it up to pitch. And I’ll wait a couple of days, to let the strings settle in, before I check intonation, and then if necessary, I’ll adjust intonation at the bridge.

As I previously posted, I do pay close attention that I’m not twisting the strings as I install them.

Best regards.

 

[HaphAsSard]

I can see where you come up with that conclusion from watching the video. I’m simply saying I don’t set witness points with my strings, and I’ve never had problems from not doing so.

And I’m not disagreeing with anyone who does otherwise, nor am I’ll telling anyone not to do it.


When I put new strings on one of my basses, I gently tug each string as I’m winding it around the post, then I tune it up to pitch. And I’ll wait a couple of days, to let the strings settle in, before I check intonation, and then if necessary, I’ll adjust intonation at the bridge.

As I previously posted, I do pay close attention that I’m not twisting the strings as I install them.

Best regards.

Oh, I don't have strong opinions for or against the practice, myself. I've been known to do all kinds of shoit to my strings.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

I first learned it from Scott Devine (scottsbasslessons.com). The simple fact is it has made a huge difference for me, so I will continue doing it. Just my experience...

Definitely keep doing what works for you. I’m not trying to tell anyone that what I do is the “End all, Be all” for installing new strings.

I’m only that I’ve never experienced problems by not setting my witness points. And quite possibly both RS and MT do set the witness points later down the line in doing a setup. But I can see where it could possibly damage the string, and alter how it vibrates, -provided that it’s done before the string has finished settling in.