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iOS, iPhone, iPad and music 101

#101
I received the Beats as a christmas gift and I can say they are great headphones. The bass isn't that loud as some said, in fact I was expecting deeper bass in the mix, it's a good level for me.

The thing is if they are worth the 300 dollars and I say no, for sure they are overpriced. I guess 150-200 would be a more accurate price range wih the brand and everything.
 
#102
Beats headphones are good sounding headphones for casual listening to music. They are way over-priced, but if you are willing to pay it, whatever floats your boat. If you want a headphone for mixing, they're terrible because they color the sound to be very bass heavy (Engadget has an article on them) instead of being neutral. Personally, I am a bass head and like to hear some thump in my ears, but you can reproduce what beats does for much less and have a more quality product.
 
#104
Still trying to get the big picture here.
So, is it accurate to say that both audio and midi can be recorded, manipulated and exported on an iPad (with additional hardware connectors and software programs)? And that the biggest differences between an iPad and a computer are that the iPad can't use sound cards and some of its popular programs such as Audiobus are currently limited in what they support although they intend to expand?

A friend of mine said that the biggest danger in buying technological gear is that you don't know what you're not getting. Salesmen tell you all the things it will do, but not what it won't do. That's what I'm trying to get learn.

Does anyone have experience with both computer and iPad and can say what an experienced computer user will find missing? For example, what about AU support, latency issues, connectivity with existing hardware I/O units, and compatibility issues? There's lots of info on what iPad will do. I'm trying to figure out what it won't do.

Excuse my inserting questions not specifically asked by the OP, but it does seem to fit with what he's wanting to know as well.
 
#105
You have to dig in and research. Some older audio interfaces will work with the camera connector. I know the Lexicon Omega will work with the iOS system plus a lot more will, also though many more don't. This is what I am in the process of making my next decision on in regards to my iPad. I am searching several places for info. I want an interface that is good live and for recording. I am very happy with Audiobus and the other apps that I have.
 
#106
Phil Smith said:
I can only speak for iGigBook :D.

The app will work fine on the original iPad which is what I still use though I also have an iPad 2 as well. If you scan your paper charts as a PDF they can be imported into the app. If you have more questions, come on over to the iGigBook forum - http://forum.igigbook.com
Click to expand...

thanks for all the replies to my questions, looks like I'll be fine with the old 1st gen til next bday gift of a new one if I take to this.

thanks Phil for the info too on the igigbook, definitely getting that first. I have a book of original jazz charts from a local artist that I need to use along with real book standards. These original charts will need to be digitized then imported, looks like this app is the way.

setlist maker sounds good too. Anyone know if it will randomize sets? I had some add-in for excel at one time where I had a few hundred of my one band's songs inputted and could randomize three sets of 11 songs each. Was a lot of fun to give the guys random sets, seems we usually have a handful that we always do similar times of the night and this changed it up.
 
#107
PDGood said:
Still trying to get the big picture here.
So, is it accurate to say that both audio and midi can be recorded, manipulated and exported on an iPad (with additional hardware connectors and software programs)? And that the biggest differences between an iPad and a computer are that the iPad can't use sound cards and some of its popular programs such as Audiobus are currently limited in what they support although they intend to expand?

A friend of mine said that the biggest danger in buying technological gear is that you don't know what you're not getting. Salesmen tell you all the things it will do, but not what it won't do. That's what I'm trying to get learn.

Does anyone have experience with both computer and iPad and can say what an experienced computer user will find missing? For example, what about AU support, latency issues, connectivity with existing hardware I/O units, and compatibility issues? There's lots of info on what iPad will do. I'm trying to figure out what it won't do.

Excuse my inserting questions not specifically asked by the OP, but it does seem to fit with what he's wanting to know as well.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you're most interested in recording, not the bass apps that most people are chiming in about. I'm a PC user, have done all my recordings with Cubase, and now I just got myself an iPad. Because I don't want to mislead you, I advise you to take a careful look at what Auria has and doesn't have according to your needs. As far as my limited experience goes with the iPad, this is what I've found.

There's nothing I can't do with Auria, that I was doing with Cubase. Cubase is still a little easier for me to use still, because I've been using it for years.

If you're going to go with an iPad, you will be able to transport any work you do to your PC. You might have to jump through a few hoops to do it though. Pretty sure most things export to dropbox though, and it isn't terribly difficult.

The bad news is that you can't take any of your PC toys or purchases into the ipad. Forget about any plugins or PC based programs that you use. While you may find an app version, there aren't many. The good news is, you can find the equivalent to pretty much anything you want - and it'll only cost you between $0. and $20. What cost me around $1000 on my PC, I've gotten for around $100 on the iPad.

I haven't gotten too much into midi yet, but I got a keyboard controller for xmas, and got the sampletank app for $20. It's a sampler sequence program that covers a whole lot of ground. As far as editing midi goes, I haven't dabbled in much of that aside from programming some drum beats. I haven't seen any editors that look like the cubase editors yet, but I'm sure they're out there, and what I have used was pretty straight forward.

As for audio interfaces, a lot of them work, though I haven't tried any of the 3 or 4 I have yet. You need to however buy a usb camera kit in order to get usb to work with the iPad (one of my peeves w apple), and you'll need a powered hub as the ipad does't have enough power to drive anything. Both together only cost me around $50. There are lots of other ways to connect too, but that's what ya gotta do if you want to use what you already have.

Again, the best way I think you could answer your questions is to dive into this and see what it has and what it doesn't. If this don't do it (regarding recording and mixing) then I don't think anything else out there will either. They also have a list on their site of compatible interfaces. http://auriaapp.com/Products/auria
 
#109
Thanks, Joe. I'm interested in all of it, I just know more about the recording end so that's where I have a better idea what to look for.

I checked out Auria and it looks very impressive. Lots of editing and automation capabilities and appears to do what most of the "big" programs do.

What I didn't see is any mention of midi or AU support. Also, it appears that all apps have to be bought through Apple's ap store which means limited compatibility. And I didn't see any of the bigger names in plug-in builders on their list. PSP being the most familiar, but not one I think of as high end. The other thing you never know until you begin is how much drain do the plug-ins put on the processor. I've had songs come to a complete stop if I added one too many compressors before.

But all in all, it looks like Apple has decided to make their version of Cubase/Digital Performer etc. complete with working relationships with enough companies to include one each of the most basic things you'd need. It's particularly impressive that they have convolution reverb although it doesn't say if that's compatible with the impulse responses made by Altiverb - the big player in that category.

The absence of midi would be a deal breaker for many who are serious about recording capabilities. But for audio recording and editing, it's hard to beat the price and convenience of all this has to offer. At least that's my 2 cents based on what I've learned so far.
 
#110
PDGood said:
...I checked out Auria and it looks very impressive. Lots of editing and automation capabilities and appears to do what most of the "big" programs do.

What I didn't see is any mention of midi or AU support. Also, it appears that all apps have to be bought through Apple's ap store which means limited compatibility. And I didn't see any of the bigger names in plug-in builders on their list. PSP being the most familiar, but not one I think of as high end. The other thing you never know until you begin is how much drain do the plug-ins put on the processor. I've had songs come to a complete stop if I added one too many compressors before.

...The absence of midi would be a deal breaker for many who are serious about recording capabilities. But for audio recording and editing, it's hard to beat the price and convenience of all this has to offer. At least that's my 2 cents based on what I've learned so far.
Click to expand...

Other than as an intellectual exercise, I see no reason why anyone would choose to make a serious recording only in IOS.

Give the prevalence of PC's and Macs loaded with processing power and expensive plugins just about everywhere, why not move back and forth according to the situation?

Auria has an impressive promotional video, where a big-name producer talks about Auria. He talks about it being an attractive way to do serious work, but he never goes so far as to suggest that he would limit himself to the one platform. There's another vid, where an indie band uses Auria to rehearse and then to record an album on location, tracking through a variety of interfaces.

That's how I see Auria and the other products that we talk about on these pages. They're a great way, not just for hobbyists, but for musicians of all kinds, to move back and forth between the ease and simplicity of IOS and the power of other environments.
 
#111
steve_rolfeca said:
Other than as an intellectual exercise, I see no reason why anyone would choose to make a serious recording only in IOS.

Give the prevalence of PC's and Macs loaded with processing power and expensive plugins just about everywhere, why not move back and forth according to the situation?

Auria has an impressive promotional video, where a big-name producer talks about Auria. He talks about it being an attractive way to do serious work, but he never goes so far as to suggest that he would limit himself to the one platform. There's another vid, where an indie band uses Auria to rehearse and then to record an album on location, tracking through a variety of interfaces.

That's how I see Auria and the other products that we talk about on these pages. They're a great way, not just for hobbyists, but for musicians of all kinds, to move back and forth between the ease and simplicity of IOS and the power of other environments.
Click to expand...

Steve, I always enjoy your posts. In this case, the reason I'm interested is because I can't afford both environments. My computer is outdated and the cost of updating all the music software is overwhelming. It's a long story why it can't be left as is - "an closed environment". In looking for a new, relatively inexpensive solution I was considering the mac mini when I found this thread which brought me to consider the iPad as another option. I'm no longer doing full scale production as I did for many years, so a smaller system is adequate (if not preferred). All the talk about enhancing live performance is another factor that makes the iPad enticing. That would not be the case so much with a computer. Hence I'm asking questions and weighing options.
 
#112
steve_rolfeca said:
That's how I see Auria and the other products that we talk about on these pages. They're a great way, not just for hobbyists, but for musicians of all kinds, to move back and forth between the ease and simplicity of IOS and the power of other environments.
Click to expand...

Me too. I wound up throwing everything I did on the iPad into Cubase. I'm most comfortable there. I was able to edit bass tracks throughout the day though because I wasn't handcuffed to my computer. There's something super great too about being able to just pull the iPad out of my bag and instantly be able to work. I had a laptop, but I'd have to take it out of it's case, open it up, wait 5 minutes for everything to boot, deal with constant crashing and frozen screens. The work on the iPad is surprisingly seemless.

It's also the most cost effective way for someone to do this stuff if they're just getting into the game. People are still buying standalone recorders (I think :) ), and with what you can do now with an iPad, I think you'd have to be out of your mind to drop money on one of those.
 
#113
PDGood said:
I don't really have a clear picture of what the iPad will and will not do in relation to music.

...Maybe it would be simpler to ask, what can you not do on an iPad that you can do on a computer as far as music goes?
Click to expand...

The biggest difference, is choice.

For example, there's an ocean of amazing, high-end interfaces for Mac and PC. At the moment, in IOS your only option in terms of truly high-end interfaces, is via the new RME UCX. It's directly compatible with devices like the Micstasy, that sell up into the $10K bracket.

Ditto for recording formats. You can use just about any sample rate and resolution you want on a computer. But all you've got at the moment on IOS, is 24-bit at up to 48KHz. Even there, support is limited. Ditto for choice in plugins, etc.

I realize this sounds a bit esoteric if you're just experimenting at home, but if you have any professional aspirations, it really isn't. I know lots of indie artists who don't even dream of buying high-end gear. But they routinely rent it for a few hours. When it's going to put food on your table for years to come, spending a few hundred bucks to sweeten a few key tracks on your next project is an excellent investment.
 
#114
Joe Nerve said:
It's also the most cost effective way for someone to do this stuff if they're just getting into the game. People are still buying standalone recorders (I think :) ), and with what you can do now with an iPad, I think you'd have to be out of your mind to drop money on one of those.
Click to expand...

This.

Heck, if you already have an iPhone, you can outfit it with good audio in and MIDI for under $300 total, including some amp modelling and effects, looping and a DAW.

Tascam DP-008? Zoom H4 or R8? Pod XT Live? They seem a bit archaic now...
 
#115
A note on battery life and live performance:

At my New Years gig this year, my iPhone 5 was running QMix, and did double-duty as a Peterson tuner for a few minutes. My iPad 2 was running OnSong and Musicnotes.

Sound check and run-through started at 5pm, and we finished at 1am. I had two breaks of about 30 minutes where I could have shut down my iDevices down or plugged them in for charging, however I didn't.

That's about as long a gig as I'm likely to do. Through a lack of preparation on my part, the iPhone crapped out towards the end of the night. My iPad finished the gig with battery to spare.

If I was processing audio on either one, I would have needed a charging solution. A point in favour of the Alesis or Griffin docks, or the Blue Mikey Digital?
 
#116
I think I'm using IOS a bit differently than most. I may record or process bass later, but for now, I'm triggering samples and maybe synths with IAC at my gig, for sound effects and song connections.

What I want is a piece of hardware that gives me good output quality (ie not the headphone out), and preferably 1/4 or better outputs. I'm on an iPad 2. I also want it to be solid and gig-worthy, as opposed to a few strung together adaptors hanging off the headphone jack.

I've been looking at the Alesis io dock. Is that the best thing? I don't want dangly bits, and the docking seems nice. But I've heard it doesn't fit iPad 2 all that well. Any opinions?
 
#118
steve_rolfeca said:
A note on battery life and live performance:

At my New Years gig this year, my iPhone 5 was running QMix, and did double-duty as a Peterson tuner for a few minutes. My iPad 2 was running OnSong and Musicnotes.

Sound check and run-through started at 5pm, and we finished at 1am. I had two breaks of about 30 minutes where I could have shut down my iDevices down or plugged them in for charging, however I didn't.

That's about as long a gig as I'm likely to do. Through a lack of preparation on my part, the iPhone crapped out towards the end of the night. My iPad finished the gig with battery to spare.

If I was processing audio on either one, I would have needed a charging solution. A point in favour of the Alesis or Griffin docks, or the Blue Mikey Digital?
Click to expand...

While Steve's situation is pretty extreme and doesn't give him any downtime to charge during the show, most of us can simply "top off" the charge between sets.
I used my iPhone 4S last night, through a PA, for about two hours straight, and didn't really drain the battery much at all. Much less than I would've drained it while sitting on the couch playing Angry Birds!!
 
#119
smeet said:
I think I'm using IOS a bit differently than most. I may record or process bass later, but for now, I'm triggering samples and maybe synths with IAC at my gig, for sound effects and song connections.

What I want is a piece of hardware that gives me good output quality (ie not the headphone out), and preferably 1/4 or better outputs. I'm on an iPad 2. I also want it to be solid and gig-worthy, as opposed to a few strung together adaptors hanging off the headphone jack.

I've been looking at the Alesis io dock. Is that the best thing? I don't want dangly bits, and the docking seems nice. But I've heard it doesn't fit iPad 2 all that well. Any opinions?
Click to expand...

This is on my "Wish List" from the hardware companies as well.

Think about it. The Apogee Jam right now is the flagship iOS interface (for iPhone, anyway), and it ONLY handles input.
We need Apogee to step it up a little, and add OUTPUT to the Jam.

What good is a pristine digital input when the signal coming back out of the iPhone/iPad is coming through the headphone jack?!?

There needs to be some focus on this.
 

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