Even Hendrix said he felt trapped within his style due to limited theory knowledge
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Is music theory important?
- Thread starter Dbt25677
- Start date
Even Hendrix said he felt trapped within his style due to limited theory knowledge
On the other hand I was at an Ikea recently and they had a three piece jazz band playing near the check out registers. I was watching the bass player who obviously knew his stuff, in fact, he was amazing. I couldn't help thinking about all the effort that went into becoming as accomplished as he was, all the years and expense of lessons and time woodshedding. He was playing a 1973 Precision Bass fretless with no fretlines through a small, but wonderful Epifani rig. So add all the expense of high end equipment on top of the years of study...all to be ignored by Ikea shoppers. It was depressing.
I'm sure we can all come up with other even more depressing examples, and have been a part of gigs we swore when we were younger we'd never play. Some of the best musicians around play music they hate in wedding bands and Top 40 cover bands just to get a gig, any gig. All that time and study and expense to play stuff that makes you cringe. Like I said, depressing.
I'm sure we can all come up with other even more depressing examples, and have been a part of gigs we swore when we were younger we'd never play. Some of the best musicians around play music they hate in wedding bands and Top 40 cover bands just to get a gig, any gig. All that time and study and expense to play stuff that makes you cringe. Like I said, depressing.
Music theory is not important unless you aspire to be a musician. Successful golfers rarely use it.
Yes, we must not think too much. That is what has always made the greatest strides in human art, music, architecture, medicine, science, politics - in fact, all of existence: acting on gut impulse and avoiding thinking too much.
My years of studying and learning theory have basically allowed me to play without hardly thinking at all. I play improvisational music and 95% of the time, it just comes out, which is how I like it to be.
Now, certainly there are musicians who run scales and yes, more often than not, these musicians know a fair bit of theory. But don't knock theory because some musicians play academically and these musicians happen to know theory. The flaw there is in the execution, not the design.
If your guitar solo sounds like scales instead of music, then you aren't applying music theory. If you think music theory is a bunch of scales then you don't know what music theory is.
Try walking without knowing some theory. I mean really come up with interesting imaginitive walking bass lines requires that you know what you're doing. The more theory you know the more imaginative you can be. I know you can do basic walking without really knowing what you're doing and maybe even some more advanced stuff if you immerse yourself in the style. But how much more at ease you are when you just put in the effort to learn why the notes make sense than trying to remember patterns and hope you're playing in key. I must admit, most of the theory I learned was in the effort not to embarrass myself around real musicians.
The point many here have repeatedly tried (in vain apparently) to make is that theory like any language, including math, which music is based on, becomes ingrained. Automatic, if you will. Does your brain file through every English (or whatever your native tounge is) class / lesson you've ever had when conversing with someone?
No? Why not? Haven't all those language lessons hindered your ability to creatively allign words to express your thoughts and ideas?!? No? Again, why not? Isn't that the argument being made here against educating yourselves in the language of music?
It's like saying you want to be a mechanic, but you have no interest in how an engine works. You want to be able to speak enough of the language to get by, perhaps learn some slang and some colorful metaphors.
But learn to read and write? Learn context and how to speak with intelligence and depth? Nah! We'll pass on that. Really?!? To each their own. Expanding knowledge and by doing so, ability is not something I've ever seen as a negative.
Perhaps it's just me.
At least they're still out there playing and making a living doing what they love instead of being trapped in a job they hate. Don't learn that stuff and you don't even have that option once your rock-star sell-by date expires. Then you're trapped in bars on the weekends playing the music nobody wanted to hear you play even when you were young
It makes me think about a quote attributed to Wynton Marsalis, "The problem with popular music is that it isn't made by musicians."
There's nothing wrong with playing bars on weekends if that's all you want to do. It's like my example of the carpenter vs the the guy who has weekend woodworking projects in his basement. Not everyone is a craftsman, some prefer to remain hobbyists. My point was that at any level the enjoyment of playing music is enhanced when you have a clue as to how it's properly done. Even the weekend birdhouse maker probably took shop class in school.
There's nothing wrong with playing bars on weekends if that's all you want to do. It's like my example of the carpenter vs the the guy who has weekend woodworking projects in his basement. Not everyone is a craftsman, some prefer to remain hobbyists. My point was that at any level the enjoyment of playing music is enhanced when you have a clue as to how it's properly done. Even the weekend birdhouse maker probably took shop class in school.
Well, how is that really different from other professions if you think sbout it ... I spent years studying and then working my way up in my day job, and I don't get to do fun projects every day either.
I think I was misunderstood; therefore, I'll start from the beginning and dissect the original posting.
HYPOTHETICALLY
a. (of a proposition) highly conjectural; not well supported by available evidence.
b. (of a proposition or syllogism) conditional.
Synonyms
1. suppositional, theoretical, speculative.
=====================================
In simple words, just something to talk about - a goofy improvisation without any seriousness. Blah blah blah....
Let's say, I decided to post the following question:
"I want to be a professional bass guitar player. Should I learn to play the bass guitar?"
Next.
My unequivocal - clear and unambiguous - answer is NO.
Don't spend any time/money learning music!
Just go and get a job as a big ROCKSTAR and
1. laugh at us who are trying to learn music theory, harmony, etc..., and
2. laugh all the way to the bank
The sooner your get that job, the better for you.
My answer is also, NO, it's not important.
I heard that in the world of "big spunky rockstar" there are 17 beats a quaver.
Just go and get a job as a big ROCKSTAR
Does music theory have something to do with "playing something that sounds good"?
Don't say it. Stop right there.
I don't know, but
should I learn to play the bass if I want to be a very good bass player?
HYPOTHETICALLY
a. (of a proposition) highly conjectural; not well supported by available evidence.
b. (of a proposition or syllogism) conditional.
Synonyms
1. suppositional, theoretical, speculative.
=====================================
In simple words, just something to talk about - a goofy improvisation without any seriousness. Blah blah blah....
Let's say, I decided to post the following question:
"I want to be a professional bass guitar player. Should I learn to play the bass guitar?"
Next.
My unequivocal - clear and unambiguous - answer is NO.
Don't spend any time/money learning music!
Just go and get a job as a big ROCKSTAR and
1. laugh at us who are trying to learn music theory, harmony, etc..., and
2. laugh all the way to the bank
The sooner your get that job, the better for you.
My answer is also, NO, it's not important.
I heard that in the world of "big spunky rockstar" there are 17 beats a quaver.
Just go and get a job as a big ROCKSTAR
Does music theory have something to do with "playing something that sounds good"?
Don't say it. Stop right there.
I don't know, but
should I learn to play the bass if I want to be a very good bass player?
I always hear this question and with similar attitude. I like to compare music to a language (though it sounds cliche).
You can express your feelings so much more thoroughly with a good understanding of language. You can also express thoughts/feelings musically with an understanding of theory. (The grammar of music)
I like what Anthony Wellington says about "Four Levels of Awareness", as it relates to this discussion:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rhvxy0r2Do
I've had a few moments of "unconscious knowing" and agree with Anthony that this is the room I want to be in. It takes work to get past the less blissful states, and I think that is where some people get hung up in thinking that theory can get in the way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rhvxy0r2Do
I've had a few moments of "unconscious knowing" and agree with Anthony that this is the room I want to be in. It takes work to get past the less blissful states, and I think that is where some people get hung up in thinking that theory can get in the way.
I had no such expectation! I was writing creative music before I knew what scales were. The reason I learned theory was so that I could improvise without hitting wrong notes, creativity had nothing to do with it.
Im in an originals band right now and I didnt use theory to write most of my parts. I just played what felt right and people seem to like it.
My opinion is that if someone is creative enough to write great music they can do it with or without theory. There will of course be exceptions but in general I dont think great song writers NEED theory. In my very limited experience, with my own playing and playing with other musicians, theory has no effect on song writing ability.
Music theory allows you to store much more information effectively. When others see a Dm G or Am d or Em A you can compress all these and more into a ii V.
Just one example
Just one example
I think a lot of new players have some confusion as to what music theory really is or how its used. Thus we get the individuals who reject music theory as a bad thing, or that it somehow squelches your creativity. This could not be farther from the case.
Music theory is simply a common conceptualization of music. Describing music to one another, and even to yourself can be a difficult task. This is where music theory comes in. It is putting musical concepts into words so that people can communicate musical ideas to each more easily and quickly. No more no less.
Theory does NOT dictate what you play or in any way limit your abilities to be creative, that is unless you let it. All it does is help you conceptualize and organize those creative ideas to document them or communicate them to others.
Music theory is simply a common conceptualization of music. Describing music to one another, and even to yourself can be a difficult task. This is where music theory comes in. It is putting musical concepts into words so that people can communicate musical ideas to each more easily and quickly. No more no less.
Theory does NOT dictate what you play or in any way limit your abilities to be creative, that is unless you let it. All it does is help you conceptualize and organize those creative ideas to document them or communicate them to others.
Someone else brought this same idea to me awhile ago and it help me break the idea of being hard-headed; taking theory courses this season primarily because just a few steps above bass playing, I really like communicating. Theory will make it easier to combine the two
Someone else brought this same idea to me awhile ago and it help me break the idea of being hard-headed; taking theory courses this season primarily because just a few steps above bass playing, I really like communicating. Theory will make it easier to combine the two
Agreed. I recommend any musician of any sort learns theory if for no other reason than that it makes collaboration so much easier and efficient. And collaboration is one of my favorite things about music.
