Kwesi said:
Masturbation. Really? : ( I mean, I know that we can't all get laid, but jacking off? Smoking kills and masturbation is considered healthy, but you can always find some one that is willing to screw you if you look long and hard enough.
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Is there such a thing as a considerate smoker?
- Thread starter Marlat
- Start date
Masturbation. Really? : ( I mean, I know that we can't all get laid, but jacking off? Smoking kills and masturbation is considered healthy, but you can always find some one that is willing to screw you if you look long and hard enough.
Nah! They're trying to stir people's emotions with a broad, sweeping statement, or overgeneralization about smokers. One size does not fit all...
I was one of the considerate smokers, and now I'm a very tolerant ex-smoker. Some of the least tolerant people were once smokers themselves.
That 'least' group should be ashamed of themselves.
+!
I used to smoke, but I quite just over 4 years ago. I used to "police" my cigarette butts and throw them in the trash. If you don't know what "policing your cigarette butts" means, look it up. I also didn't light up next to non-smokers in public. In fact, I would check to make sure that the wind was blowing away from any non-smokers and be at least 30 feet away. Some of the most obnoxious and inconsiderate people that walk this planet are non-smokers who happen to be antismokers as well. They'll make any excuse to treat their fellow human beings like second class citizens or less. Absolutely pathetic and disgraceful behavior. BTW: Most of the people I've come across in the past were generally considerate. There are a small number of inconsiderate (usually self absorb types) everywhere you go and they consist of smokers and non-smokers equally.
The anti-tobacco movement in the US and Canada conditions people to think badly towards smokers. Many World War II vets, Korean War vets, Vietnam vets, and Desert Storm vets were smokers. As a former smoker and a veteran (USAF), I would find it very offensive for any anti-smoker to bad mouth a veteran who happens to be a smoker, just because they smoke. Again, most smokers are considerate, just as most non-smokers are tolerant people. There are a few bad apples from each group who happen to get most of the attention. They must be attention wh@res I guess.
+!
I used to smoke, but I quite just over 4 years ago. I used to "police" my cigarette butts and throw them in the trash. If you don't know what "policing your cigarette butts" means, look it up. I also didn't light up next to non-smokers in public. In fact, I would check to make sure that the wind was blowing away from any non-smokers and be at least 30 feet away. Some of the most obnoxious and inconsiderate people that walk this planet are non-smokers who happen to be antismokers as well. They'll make any excuse to treat their fellow human beings like second class citizens or less. Absolutely pathetic and disgraceful behavior. BTW: Most of the people I've come across in the past were generally considerate. There are a small number of inconsiderate (usually self absorb types) everywhere you go and they consist of smokers and non-smokers equally.
The anti-tobacco movement in the US and Canada conditions people to think badly towards smokers. Many World War II vets, Korean War vets, Vietnam vets, and Desert Storm vets were smokers. As a former smoker and a veteran (USAF), I would find it very offensive for any anti-smoker to bad mouth a veteran who happens to be a smoker, just because they smoke. Again, most smokers are considerate, just as most non-smokers are tolerant people. There are a few bad apples from each group who happen to get most of the attention. They must be attention wh@res I guess.
Glad to hear that you are/were one of the considerate ones.
However, just because a vet smokes, or didn't smoke, doesn't make them considerate/non-considerate at all. That's a whole nother can of worms that can be opened
.One thing that you don't address, and a lot of smokers I've known don't as well is the fact that you, as an individual are having a measurable, negative impact on a community/population. Again, I'll gladly defend your right to do whatever it is that you want to do to yourself as long as it doesn't negatively impact me / the greater good / the general population or surrounding people.
Glad to hear that you are/were one of the considerate ones.
However, just because a vet smokes, or didn't smoke, doesn't make them considerate/non-considerate at all. That's a whole nother can of worms that can be opened
One thing that you don't address, and a lot of smokers I've known don't as well is the fact that you, as an individual are having a measurable, negative impact on a community/population. Again, I'll gladly defend your right to do whatever it is that you want to do to yourself as long as it doesn't negatively impact me / the greater good / the general population or surrounding people.
The greater good!
Glad to hear that you are/were one of the considerate ones.
However, just because a vet smokes, or didn't smoke, doesn't make them considerate/non-considerate at all. That's a whole nother can of worms that can be opened
One thing that you don't address, and a lot of smokers I've known don't as well is the fact that you, as an individual are having a measurable, negative impact on a community/population. Again, I'll gladly defend your right to do whatever it is that you want to do to yourself as long as it doesn't negatively impact me / the greater good / the general population or surrounding people.
Based on your logic, most humans should be put down (as in put down like a horse). We ALL cost society, each and everyone of us, for many reasons. Your logic could be applied to breathing. "Your breathing our precious clean air cost money, stop breathing already." You are caught up in the "blame game" that too many people play these days. "It's their fault!" "They cost us too much money." "They are like us, so they must be bad." There have been a few very bad actors over the past decade that cost the USA dearly and it may take another decade or more to undo that damage. Talk about inconsiderate. (Yes, I let that last couple of statement general on purpose.)
Eh, I never claimed to have the best of logic
. I don't see how breathing is costing anyone money, or having a negative impact on the people around me, though. Nor did I say that you cost "too much money"; I merely pointed out the income from tobacco and the healthcare cost, and have said that there's no way to find direct cause of smoking; and additionally never said that it's "too much" regardless. Nor did I really say anything was "your fault", either, as I don't know what the overall impact of smokers (or non-smokers) is.For me, I don't smoke. I don't like it, the smell of it, the hazyness it fills places with and all the other things about it. I have tried it, and it's not for me at all. Luckily, I only have one smoking friend and it isn't really an issue. I don't ask him to put them out or anything, as if it ends up bothering me at all, I move myself out of the situation (something more non-smokers should do, I think, when possible).
Eh, I never claimed to have the best of logic
For me, I don't smoke. I don't like it, the smell of it, the hazyness it fills places with and all the other things about it. I have tried it, and it's not for me at all. Luckily, I only have one smoking friend and it isn't really an issue. I don't ask him to put them out or anything, as if it ends up bothering me at all, I move myself out of the situation (something more smokers should do, I think, when possible).
My post was offered as a general observation of society as a whole, not directed at you in particular. It's the formation of a National attitude that tends to be negative and intolerant. That was the line of thinking that I wanted to get across.
As far as cost, we all impose a cost on society just by existing. Every member of society has needs that must be met and many of those needs (energy, safety, security, healthcare, education, etc.) cost society time, money and energy.
As to the healthcare costs, much of healthcare cost is directly related to the number of elderly people that we have in this country. The longer we live, the more cronic diseases we get (smoker and non-smoker), which is a normal consequence of the aging process. Cronic diseases are much more costly overall than acute illnesses.
We also operate under a "for profit healthcare system"
:scowl: that ads significantly to its cost.
We also operate under a "for profit healthcare system"
Easily another topic for another thread, but when the govt. gets ahold of healthcare, we'll see how expensive things get. The crux is that we don't want to pay more taxes and want to be seen quickly.
I was unaware of doctors and nurses having to wear military style uniforms and hospitals becoming government installations as part of the single payer option of health care delivery. As far as expensive, most individuals cannot afford to buy health insurance under the current system through private insurance companies. Insurance companies ad more to the cost of healthcare than your average smoker. Talk about inconsiderate people.
I would rather trust my government to handle the healthcare payment system than private insurance companies. I am unaware of a third alternative, or I might choose it instead of the first two choices.
Though I dont agree with your take on smoking, I do agree about the health care issues.I was unaware of doctors and nurses having to wear military style uniforms and hospitals becoming government installations as part of the single payer option of health care delivery. As far as expensive, most individuals cannot afford to buy health insurance under the current system through private insurance companies. Insurance companies ad more to the cost of healthcare than your average smoker. Talk about inconsiderate people.
Thanks.
BTW:For the record, I am not pro smoking. Smoking is unhealthy and can have very serious health consequences. My mom died from lung cancer and emphysema. I am against anyone being treated as a second class citizen or dehumanized, demonized, etc.
What if they bad mouthed a vet because they beat their wife, just because they beat their wife? What about if the vet was racist, would it be okay to bad mouth them just because they are racist? I really don't see the correlation between being a vet a smoking that means one can't criticise one particular aspect of their life without still respecting the other. If, for argument's sake, a nobel peace prize winner starts blowing smoke in the face of your kid, would you refrain from bad mouthing the practice because they were a nobel prize winner?
There is such a thing as considerate smoker. A considerate smoker asks those around him/her if it's ok to light up. If someone around says it bothers them then the considerate smoker doesn't get angry, but instead excuses him/herself to an area less offensive. A considerate smoker also takes care to not blow their smoke towards others, and when they are done they pick up their butts and dispose of them properly.
Incorrect analogy. The vet who beat his wife caused direct harm to another person. The vet who is a smoker may not have imposed his smoking on others (he/she may be a considerate smoker, like I was). Simply being a smoker is different than simply being a wife beater. If someone thinks the two are the same, then they have a real cognition problem.
Again, my comment is directed toward intolerance and negative treatment of people simply because they are smokers, regardless any particular transgression against non-smokers.Mark, you either are not a veteran or unaware of the vast number of war vets that smoked cigarettes, cigars or pipes during the campaigns that I mentioned. In fact military rations used to come with a pack of Lucky Strike cigarettes in them for soldiers in the field. War veterans were treated with respect for risking their lives to defend others. This was intended as an example that can be applied to any group of people.
The attitude toward smoking has shifted over the years due to the links between cigarette smoking and health issues. Unfortunately, attitudes toward people (smokers) has mirrored that attitude shift toward the activity (smoking). I am fine with saying the activity (smoking) is bad and should be avoided. I am not fine with applying that attitude toward people (smokers).
Inconsiderate people exist (smoker and non-smoker alike) and should be dealt with appropriately in a way that does not demonize entire groups carte blanch. IMO
