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Jaco a genius?

Jaco a genius?

  • Yes

    Votes: 162 65.6%

  • No

    Votes: 47 19.0%

  • Carrots

    Votes: 38 15.4%
  • Total voters
    247
#61
I think jaco may be the best electric bassist ever. Absolutely innovative and incredibly creative. Genius?
That word can't be thrown around lighlty. I wouldn't even consider Beethoven a genius. The only genius musician who ever lived is Mozart and jaco cannot be put on the same level as Mozart.

Not saying the jaco isn't possibly the best bassist who will ever be but probably not a genius. Just my 2 cents
 
#62
winegamd said:
But Mingus never sold out stadiums, and, for the most part, outside of jazz circles, not many bassists have heard of him.
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Actually, as a young (26) electric player, I would say two things

1 mingus is far better and more widely known than gary willis. With electric players, upright players, and non bass musicians alike. I have encountered respect and awe for mingus in all sorts of situations, rock bands, jazz guys, folk musicians, etc, I've never heard of willis outside of BP mag and talkbass. That's no disrespect to gary, just stating my experience.

2 even though we didn't experience it, there are a number of younger players who do appreciate jaco, as well as many other innovators, both on bass and in music in general. Don't forget, there is a large recorded record of it to listen too, with dates attached to all of them. Keep in mind, I doubt any of us on here remember when beethoven was big on the scene, but we can all recognize his impact and innovation.

And oh yeah, jaco=total genius. Why is this even a question?
 
#63
Roy Vogt said:
As a side note, there almost always seems to be a Generational Divide with these discussions. If you are under 40 or came to bass playing post-80s Jaco is ancient history, much like the Old Dead Jazz Guys or Les Paul. There is an assumption that we've always thought about bass guitar and played it this way. The older guys (that would include me) for the most part remember how radically things changed in a few short years because of Jaco's impact. If you always had the internet, personal computers and smartphones you would take for granted the impact of these things in your worldview. Ditto with Musicians that cause a paradigm shift in how we see Music, IMHO.
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The thing that makes Jaco hardest to appreciate is the same thing that makes Paganini hard to appreciate. Once music becomes part of the cannon, and students learn it as a matter of course, the notion that it was once revolutionary disappears. The fact was that while Jaco took years to develop his approach, a good student can learn most of songs in days or weeks with the benefit of recordings, sheet music, videos, and teachers.
 
#64
This is very true, but also same as it ever was. Young musicians want to be hip, cutting edge, fingers on the pulse of the day. I was that way. But serious musicians develop an appreciation for innovators of the past, who they may have snickered at in their youth. It's neither good nor bad. It's human nature and it's same as it ever was. But the ones who ignore the history, and the roots of the music they love, rarely develop into actual musicians.
Dr. Cheese said:
The thing that makes Jaco hardest to appreciate is the same thing that makes Paganini hard to appreciate. Once music becomes part of the cannon, and students learn it as a matter of course, the notion that it was once revolutionary disappears. The fact was that while Jaco took years to develop his approach, a good student can learn most of songs in days or weeks with the benefit of recordings, sheet music, videos, and teachers.
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#65
Genius can be so...subjective!

A genius, in part, has the ability to "color outside of the lines", to "think outside the box."

Jaco did that. And changed the the landscape of electric bass playing.

That's revolutionary.

There's a handful of guys each of us would probably say was revolutionary both in terms of big picture (affecting many) and small picture (affecting just us).

Jaco was a big picture deal.

(mini thread divert: big shout out to Abe Laboriel who dropped my jaw numerous times!)
 
#69
pnchad said:
I am waiting (as a confessed geezer) for someone (sic younger) to come up with ANYONE of even close stature currently playing.

There are lots of young guys with amazing chops but I haven't heard anyone who really pushed the envelope switching the trajectory of the instrument since
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I think Pino Palladino has done a lot to change the trajectory of the bass, particularly since the whole 'neo-soul' thing blew up. I can surely hear a huge influence from all sorts of players, such as Jamerson, but that Pino 'thing' that's on D'Angelo's 'Voodoo', Badu's 'Mama's Gun', not to mention his recent gigs with cats like Jose James, Daddy Dave, Glasper etc has been a huge influence on modern urban bass playing.

A cumulative influence of Jaco and Pino can be seen in someone today like Michael League:
 
#72
lidesnowi said:
Jaco was not only a bassist genius, he was a genius composer/arranger as well. No other bassist has even come close to Jaco level as a bass player soloist composer/arranger besides Gary Willis!
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Hum I think John Patitucci could be at his level but he won't revolutionized bass playing but I never heard another bass player compose music as complex as John Patitucci.
 
#73
Mushroo said:
Not sure if he was a musical genius, but definitely a fashion genius. Nobody rocked a pair of white pants like Jaco! And the Cosby sweater on the instructional vid is a classic.
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He was detoxing on that video shoot, I'm sure fashion wasn't at the top of his list. He didn't even own a bass. I wonder how people's perception of Jaco would be if he died in a car accident in 1977, young, like Scott Lafaro.
 
#74
Very good analogy. When I first heard Jaco back in the 70's, I thought of him as the Scott LaFaro of the electric bass.
jerry said:
He was detoxing on that video shoot, I'm sure fashion wasn't at the top of his list. He didn't even own a bass. I wonder how people's perception of Jaco would be if he died in a car accident in 1977, young, like Scott Lafaro.
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#76
Shakin-Slim said:
I think Pino Palladino has done a lot to change the trajectory of the bass, particularly since the whole 'neo-soul' thing blew up. I can surely hear a huge influence from all sorts of players, such as Jamerson, but that Pino 'thing' that's on D'Angelo's 'Voodoo', Badu's 'Mama's Gun', not to mention his recent gigs with cats like Jose James, Daddy Dave, Glasper etc has been a huge influence on modern urban bass playing.

A cumulative influence of Jaco and Pino can be seen in someone today like Michael League:
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Michael League is a genius too. Trust me....
 
#77
Dr. Cheese said:
The thing that makes Jaco hardest to appreciate is the same thing that makes Paganini hard to appreciate. Once music becomes part of the cannon, and students learn it as a matter of course, the notion that it was once revolutionary disappears. The fact was that while Jaco took years to develop his approach, a good student can learn most of songs in days or weeks with the benefit of recordings, sheet music, videos, and teachers.
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Same with math. It took humanity 1000 years to solve the quadratic equation. Now it's taught to school kids.
 
#78
I can't think of or find a definition of genius that excludes Jaco. And the usual definitions describe him perfectly. For example:

OED said:
Definition of genius
noun (plural geniuses)

1 [mass noun] exceptional intellectual or creative power or other natural ability:
she was a teacher of genius

[in singular]:that woman has a genius for organization

2 an exceptionally intelligent person or one with exceptional skill in a particular area of activity:
a mathematical genius
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http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/genius

I'm genuinely curious as to why anybody might think he doesn't fit that description or what alternative definition they might be applying that would exclude him.
 
#79
Well I've studied Jaco for 9 years now and I have to say he is simply a product of absolute dedication to the instrument. I am not here to besmirch Jaco but I do get really sick of people constantly comparing everyone to him. He was an amazing bassist because he spent copious amounts of time in theory and tone discovery besides the time just spent playing the instrument. Jaco would practice techniques to play runs with the least left hand movement and as he says in the above posted "Modern Electric Bass" video, always find a melody, which is the very essence of his style. But, (this is the part where you start to hate me) I honestly believe that Jaco is over sensationalized because he died, and not just that he died but because he was "killed" or taken not from some natural causes. Jaco did not "change the instrument as we know it" no one person did that. I see comments constantly about how he's "the most copied bassist ever" and "no one comes close" to his knowledge and skill level. Which is complete crap and pretty disrespectful to all the amazing bassist BEFORE (yes before) and after him. I love Jaco and his playing style but when people bring up "absolutes" (greatest/worst, first/last, etc.) You can count me out, because it's completely subjective.
 
#80
Roy Vogt said:
Great Scientists and Philosophers but no Artists or Musicians on your list. Interesting....
No Picasso?
No Leonardo da Vinci?
No Mozart?
No Charlie Parker?
No Beethoven?
No Mingus?
No Beatles?
Maybe there is intellectual and artistic genius. Just a thought....
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Absolutely Roy. As Osho would put it "Intellegence and intellect are two different things. Intellectuals are the masters of sensation and facts, and the intelligent ones are the masters of intuition and creativity." Apples and oranges.
 

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