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Jad Freer Sisma Mega Thread.

Not to stir the pot, since I have never tried the amp in question.

But some of the components of it remind me of the amp I got a while ago, my Mesa WD 800. The baxandall tone stack, the semi-parametric mids the WD have 3, tube front end. Then the other goodies that the WD brought to the table made me a believer in it. I'm sure the Sisma is a nice amp as well.

:)
 
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Congrats on the new amp and thank you for the review! Anything new you might add from your previous post/review?

After almost a year since I bought it, I confirm all the qualities of Sisma.

I wrote the first review before taking it to rehearsal and gigs, so I was only testing at low level or silent recording. Since that first review, I took it to almost all my rehearsals (once a week) and gigs (only 5). So when using Sisma loud, it has the same tonal qualities, except it's much more rewarding - it gives me the "smile on my face". I don't like superlatives, sometimes when I read my previous posts I'm a bit ashamed of my over-enthusiasm, so I'll try to be brief: it sounds really great, it's versatile and the settings are intuitive and efficient. Some would say it "slams", even if I know it means nothing…

Defaults are:
  • Once you get used to rehearse with this kind of high-end gear, it's hard to come back to the usual amps provided by my rehearsal studio (Fender and Markbass combos mainly) - if I ever forget Sisma at home.
  • Together with a good cab (I have a Barefaced Super Compact and a GR Bass NF210), the sound is so detailed and articulate that I hear much better than before all my mistakes, poor playing technique and so on. Good for making progress, but bad for the ego.
  • It is too loud for my needs. After almost a year, I never had to push the master volume above 10 o'clock (maybe nine). Now I know, I would prefer a 350 W "piccolo Sisma". It's ok, nothing bad about keeping the master volume under 10 o'clock, but I think I will never need to be louder, so I would prefer a smaller/lighter 350W amp.
Other comments:
  • The more I use Sisma, the more I like it.
  • Most of the time, I leave the EQ flat and it sounds great like this. I use the EQ either to compensate for bad room accoustics, or if I want to improve my sound, for example if a play with a pick it's nice to work precisely with the mids.
  • Before buying Sisma, I thought I would use the tube preamp for my OD needs. I finally bought Capo for flexibility, and I prefer Capo's dirt. I usually set Sisma's gain clean, just before it starts to distort when I dig in. But I'm not disappointed, because I prefer Capo before the Sisma tube preamp than directly into a Class D amp or mixer. This makes Capo's distortion even prettier. So I use both and it's perfect for my needs, they're very complementary.
 
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Moderator translation just to hopefully calm everyone down a bit:

"I'm not particularly aggressive, I'm trying to understand. In my last question, I wanted to know what makes a B15 preamp special and what a Class G amp is like in general compared to other amp technology.

Having spoken to other amp manufacturers here, I don't think this person is the most respected on the forum, because apart from calculations and theory he didn't particularly enlighten me on what I already knew.

Now having heard a 300W tube compared to a 300W class D with the same bass in the same cabinet, even if there are differences in "colors" and dynamics, etc... I don't see how one could send heavy and the other barely vibrate a can of soda when "1W is 1W period".

Especially since the people who demoped the two amps also make amps, know what they're talking about and explained to me that there was a big/huge difference between a Class D and an all-tube amp, even if they are of the same power, compared to the fact that one can move much more air than the other.
"

This post has been reported, and moderators don't at this point see it as nefarious as the reporters do. Time will tell, but given the foreign language nature of the post, the consensus at this point is to do nothing and hope that cooler heads prevail.
I guess the part that has some of us up in arns is this statement here:

"Having spoken to other amp manufacturers here, I don't think this person is the most respected on the forum, because apart from calculations and theory he didn't particularly enlighten me on what I already knew."

Maybe a translation error, maybe not, but as it stands, it appears to be an attack on someone's character that is a solid contributor to TalkBass. If y'all are cool with that, I guess things have changed here and that's cool as well. I just wish I could have gotten that kinda love in the past for my missteps, talking about inanimate objects.

:)
 
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About the Sisma, I don't know if there is a tone difference if you change the Tube inside of it ?
Can a tube swap make the amp sound "better or worse" ?
Can it change the way it overdrive too ? :/

Yes, sound and drive breakup or colour changes when you change the preamp tube. Better or worse it's hard to say, we choose the JJ after some blind test DI recordings for two reasons: 1) overall sound is kind of hifi and balanced, 2) they were more consistent between each other.

It's not easy to do this kind of tests without fooling yourself. We use a switching system to instantly go back and forth between different amps (or cabs) and lots of recordings with the same bass/music loops that we match in level and compare without knowing who's who.

I suggest not to become crazy in tube swapping...its some kind of bad addition ;)
 
Note that there is nothing in the commercial user policy that says you can’t comment favorably about other products, and to do so is not biased or inappropriate. I often recommend other manufacturer’s products when I feel that they are a better fit.

If you are an endorsing artist for Mesa and Ibanez, you might want to add that to your commercial profile too.

nothing to get upset about, the discussion provided valuable technical information to other players (and will continue to do so as members read this thread in the future) while dispelling myths that are factually incorrect (like class G is more efficient than class D).

Yes I know it's not against the policy, it's just my personal feeling about it.
I'm no more involved with Mesa. I'll add my list of current endorsement to my profile.
I personally appreciate having a qualified tech view to clear up the players perspective, incorrect use of terms and debunk common myths.
 
Yes, sound and drive breakup or colour changes when you change the preamp tube. Better or worse it's hard to say, we choose the JJ after some blind test DI recordings for two reasons: 1) overall sound is kind of hifi and balanced, 2) they were more consistent between each other.

It's not easy to do this kind of tests without fooling yourself. We use a switching system to instantly go back and forth between different amps (or cabs) and lots of recordings with the same bass/music loops that we match in level and compare without knowing who's who.

I suggest not to become crazy in tube swapping...its some kind of bad addition ;)
Yup getting into that tube rolling can be addictive. Some of us with Mesa amps got into that. Most ended up putting the original tube back in.

:)
 
Yes, sound and drive breakup or colour changes when you change the preamp tube. Better or worse it's hard to say, we choose the JJ after some blind test DI recordings for two reasons: 1) overall sound is kind of hifi and balanced, 2) they were more consistent between each other.

It's not easy to do this kind of tests without fooling yourself. We use a switching system to instantly go back and forth between different amps (or cabs) and lots of recordings with the same bass/music loops that we match in level and compare without knowing who's who.

I suggest not to become crazy in tube swapping...its some kind of bad addition ;)

I haven't tried to change to preamp tube in Sisma, but I did some tube-swapping with a Sushibox pedal.
  • It made no difference to my ears when I tried to replace the default 12AX7 by a more expensive 12AX7 tube.
  • Replacing a 12AX7 by a 12AT7 or 12AU7 can be useful if the preamp breaks up too early and too quickly for your taste: 12AT7 and 12AU7 break up later, you've got more clean control on the gain knob before saturation.
  • However, I didn't need or want to try the same kind of tube swapping on Sisma, because the behaviour of the gain control is good as is.
 
Perhaps there are serious translation errors that are getting in the way of the communication, I was unaware that English was not your native language. Google translate is far from perfect for sure.

Like, without using a translator but just using the words I know, I haven't use we
I guess the part that has some of us up in arns is this statement here:

"Having spoken to other amp manufacturers here, I don't think this person is the most respected on the forum, because apart from calculations and theory he didn't particularly enlighten me on what I already knew."

Maybe a translation error, maybe not, but as it stands, it appears to be an attack on someone's character that is a solid contributor to TalkBass. If y'all are cool with that, I guess things have changed here and that's cool as well. I just wish I could have gotten that kinda love in the past for my missteps, talking about inanimate objects.

:)

Like he is respected by people who know that he know what he is talking about but I have seen some topic I don't remember the name of with tube amp purist that hate class D and I think they have talked badly on aged horse knowledge. I didn't wanted to say that I don't respect him but there are others who don't :/

I talk in private and know understand more what he was talking about, I just don't have the basic knowledge to understand directly what he was referring before. All fine know let's make this place nice. (this topic is particularly interesting imo)
 
Yes, sound and drive breakup or colour changes when you change the preamp tube. Better or worse it's hard to say, we choose the JJ after some blind test DI recordings for two reasons: 1) overall sound is kind of hifi and balanced, 2) they were more consistent between each other.

It's not easy to do this kind of tests without fooling yourself. We use a switching system to instantly go back and forth between different amps (or cabs) and lots of recordings with the same bass/music loops that we match in level and compare without knowing who's who.

I suggest not to become crazy in tube swapping...its some kind of bad addition ;)

Okay ! Nice to know. You have used the Jad Freer studio rack or something that is available on the website maybe ?
 
I haven't tried to change to preamp tube in Sisma, but I did some tube-swapping with a Sushibox pedal.
  • It made no difference to my ears when I tried to replace the default 12AX7 by a more expensive 12AX7 tube.
  • Replacing a 12AX7 by a 12AT7 or 12AU7 can be useful if the preamp breaks up too early and too quickly for your taste: 12AT7 and 12AU7 break up later, you've got more clean control on the gain knob before saturation.
  • However, I didn't need or want to try the same kind of tube swapping on Sisma, because the behaviour of the gain control is good as is.

Have you try the Sisma with an active bass too ? Does it breakup earlier ?
 
Have you try the Sisma with an active bass too ? Does it breakup earlier ?

We test every unit with real basses, from low output single coils (like lipsticks pickups) to high output pick ups (like Di Marzio humbuckers). We use both active and passive instruments, with different strings arrangements and tunings. We also test critical situations like pushing the input with booster pedals.

The higher the input the earlier the breakup but there is a lot of headroom for clean.
 
We test every unit with real basses, from low output single coils (like lipsticks pickups) to high output pick ups (like Di Marzio humbuckers). We use both active and passive instruments, with different strings arrangements and tunings. We also test critical situations like pushing the input with booster pedals.

The higher the input the earlier the breakup but there is a lot of headroom for clean.

Super nice to know !

I don't know much about amp switcher but I know other brands make those things too.

I wonder how is it possible to know if the amp breakup or not if I use a distortion in front of it ?

If I want the amp to be clean (because my drive keep the low end clean), how can I know if the tube in it breakup or not ? Because it can be really subtle I think and there is no OD/OL LED on the front panel of the Sisma.
It is from those thing I like at the moment on my bergantino amp, OL, Clip and protect LED make it easier for me to know what is wrong.
 
Like, without using a translator but just using the words I know, I haven't use we


Like he is respected by people who know that he know what he is talking about but I have seen some topic I don't remember the name of with tube amp purist that hate class D and I think they have talked badly on aged horse knowledge. I didn't wanted to say that I don't respect him but there are others who don't :/

I talk in private and know understand more what he was talking about, I just don't have the basic knowledge to understand directly what he was referring before. All fine know let's make this place nice. (this topic is particularly interesting imo)
If you were translating yourself, you were doing a pretty darn good job though.

Let me clarify the opinion versus fact thing, it might help in general with the overall understanding of why there are people who have respect issues.

When somebody who has a belief about a technology that goes against the basic science and math of what is going on, yet argue that their conclusions are right without understanding that they are just arguing about a feeling or perception, their blind faith can lead to disrespect.

This happens all the time in the automotive world, for example. The simple argument about how electric vehicles can’t accelerate as fast, or reach as high speeds as internal combustion engines started out as true but quickly changed as the technology evolved. There are still folks who will argue otherwise and become disrespectful even though the numbers clearly show otherwise. It’s due to perception and bias, something we all have but sone manage better than others.

As another data point in our industry, the arguments over amp modeling in DSP not able to accurately model a tube amp. This was true if you go back a generation or two in DSP modeling algorithms and hardware, but the gap has closed to the point that I have seen double-blind tests where the player couldn’t correctly identify the technology they were playing. That doesn’t mean they might not prefer the tube amp, but not for the reason they put forward since the couldn’t tell when they couldn’t see what they were playing.

Technology evolves, changes, advanced and also becomes more reliable. This doesn’t mean that the newer technology is automatically worse. It evolves in ways that appeal to most players most of the time. The market insures that this is the case because companies that don’t evolve shrink and eventually disappear. How many steam powered car manufacturers are left? Yes, there are a few folks that still reminisce about the good ‘ol days of steam power and how it was so much better…
 
Ok, as a professional bass player, that is my job a bass player. I really don't care about technical stuff, because I don't understand it.

But, I understand how I feel about amps. For past 10-20 years since the dawn of these D-class amps... they all were the same, just a different EQ, different volume to gain ratio, it was great because now we can fit small amp into our pocket and go for gig.
I was into digital amps, I loved it. But in time I realised they are all the same, ICE or Pascal module, some kind of EQ, a DI, basically nothing changed.

But have to say when I heard Sisma, that thing blow me away... I don't care if it's D class, G class, is someone is right or wrong about something... This amp is the first amp in 20 yours that you can play with input gain to at that Ampeg growl, non of other amps have that.
I have a friend that never got into digital amps because le love his tube amps, and he tried them.... But after he got Sisma, he retired his tube amps, that is how great they sound.

So, no one here can't talk about experience based on technical sheet, because you haven't tried it. I have tried it and I'm telling you it's a different kind of amp, what ever you say.

I don't endorse anyone, I have nothing to do with Jad Freer, I'm just happy that someone pushed the boundaries and changed something.
Same what Alex from Barefaced did, we are lucky to have those guys.

And I hate when they end like Merlin Amp, or EA amps... good product is a good product, but sometimes not for masses.
 
I think that people who are interested in talking about technologies and amp topologies should open a separate thread. Since this thread is about a specific product let me clarify: nobody in JF is afraid of new technologies. We used to have several cabs with neo woofers, a 112, a 210 and three way 212. We use a switching power supply. We had designed amps with Class D power amps too. Our current production models shows what we think is, in our limited abilities and taste, the best way to do it. We are making musical instruments and the final goal is to be inspired and make art out of it.
 
Not to stir the pot, since I have never tried the amp in question.
But some of the components of it remind me of the amp I got a while ago, my Mesa WD 800. The baxandall tone stack, the semi-parametric mids the WD have 3, tube front end. Then the other goodies that the WD brought to the table made me a believer in it. I'm sure the Sisma is a nice amp as well.
:)

I have gigged Mesa M-pulse series for more than 10 years and they have been some of my favourite amps (and my fav of the Mesa family), while the Sisma has a different tone character I can say that it was surely an inspiration in mixing passive and active eq.
 
If you were translating yourself, you were doing a pretty darn good job though.

Let me clarify the opinion versus fact thing, it might help in general with the overall understanding of why there are people who have respect issues.

When somebody who has a belief about a technology that goes against the basic science and math of what is going on, yet argue that their conclusions are right without understanding that they are just arguing about a feeling or perception, their blind faith can lead to disrespect.

This happens all the time in the automotive world, for example. The simple argument about how electric vehicles can’t accelerate as fast, or reach as high speeds as internal combustion engines started out as true but quickly changed as the technology evolved. There are still folks who will argue otherwise and become disrespectful even though the numbers clearly show otherwise. It’s due to perception and bias, something we all have but sone manage better than others.

As another data point in our industry, the arguments over amp modeling in DSP not able to accurately model a tube amp. This was true if you go back a generation or two in DSP modeling algorithms and hardware, but the gap has closed to the point that I have seen double-blind tests where the player couldn’t correctly identify the technology they were playing. That doesn’t mean they might not prefer the tube amp, but not for the reason they put forward since the couldn’t tell when they couldn’t see what they were playing.

Technology evolves, changes, advanced and also becomes more reliable. This doesn’t mean that the newer technology is automatically worse. It evolves in ways that appeal to most players most of the time. The market insures that this is the case because companies that don’t evolve shrink and eventually disappear. How many steam powered car manufacturers are left? Yes, there are a few folks that still reminisce about the good ‘ol days of steam power and how it was so much better…

I talk to a guitarist that told me that actual DSP sound close/like the real thing sometimes but it is more about the "feeling" and the dynamic it has. Now, I don't know if it is because they haven't done a blind test or if it is correct. I don't use plugin.

Is it possible to compare Tube amp and Class D to old computer and actual one ? In the way that. The first, old ones were super big and didn't have such power and storage on them and actual one, with the technology that has evolved, are super small and much better, more powerfull, more storage etc ?
(Because the technology evolve so we can do smaller thing that work better?).
 
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I think that people who are interested in talking about technologies and amp topologies should open a separate thread. Since this thread is about a specific product let me clarify: nobody in JF is afraid of new technologies. We used to have several cabs with neo woofers, a 112, a 210 and three way 212. We use a switching power supply. We had designed amps with Class D power amps too. Our current production models shows what we think is, in our limited abilities and taste, the best way to do it. We are making musical instruments and the final goal is to be inspired and make art out of it.

Did you choose the Class G over D because it can sound different and achieve the tone you wanted to get with the Sisma so ?
I don't know if it is possible to "voice" a power amp actually ?
 
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