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JAZZ IS FREAKING HARD!!!!

#103
Frenchy-Lefty said:
When I started jazz someone told me "learn the modes" which I did to realize later that, while it nice to know, it is usually useless to play walking basses.

Then I learned that it is (I just make it easy so jazz snobs please shut up for once):
=> Root, fifth, third or seventh on downbeats and passing tones in between. I use three different passing tone approaches, half-step from below or scale note from above (I guess the modes are useful here), fifth of the upcoming note or chromatic approach. I just tried to summerized what it took me 25 years to assimilate. So yes it is hard.
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What is so deceptive is all of that preparation went into a line that sounds mundane and doesn't get much attention. That is, until you flat the third and...
 
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#107
I love jazz. Not only does it cover a huge amount of musical territory, but it can convey every conceivable emotion. There are so many types of jazz that it's sometimes difficult to tell where one ends and the next begins. It isn't the easiest music to learn, and it can be frustrating at times, but it can be one of the most rewarding musical experiences you'll ever know.
 
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#109
ThuzzleFump said:
I'm a bit in the same boat, but I believe that jazz has an accelerating learning curve because it is very systematic and theory based. I'm not there yet, but I can feel the progress and sometimes have brief moments "in the zone."

BTW, Ed Fuqua's book "Walking Bassics" is a really good tutorial: Walking Bassics: The Fundamentals of Jazz Bass Playing by Ed Fuqua | Sher Music Co.

and Ed Friedland's "Building Walking Bass Lines" is very good, too: https://www.amazon.com/Building-Walking-Bass-Lines-Builders/dp/0793542049

Obviously, the secret of learning jazz walking bass is to be named Ed F.
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Which book do you recommend for the Complete Jazz Virgin?
 
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#111
Herrick said:
Which book do you recommend for the Complete Jazz Virgin?
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I like both. I started with "Walking Bassics" although I found it a bit challenging at first. The important thing for me was to really read and understand the intro section (Section 1) and start from the beginning. Both books require you to read music, i.e. there is no tab, but that's something I've been working on, too, so that's part of the reward. If you don't read yet, it's really important and even basic reading ability will give you access and growth opportunities that are really rewarding. Ed Friedland has a lot on standard chord changes in the "Building Walking Bass Lines" book and I am looking forward to digging into those as well.
 
#112
ThuzzleFump said:
I like both. I started with "Walking Bassics" although I found it a bit challenging at first. The important thing for me was to really read and understand the intro section (Section 1) and start from the beginning. Both books require you to read music, i.e. there is no tab, but that's something I've been working on, too, so that's part of the reward. If you don't read yet, it's really important and even basic reading ability will give you access and growth opportunities that are really rewarding. Ed Friedland has a lot on standard chord changes in the "Building Walking Bass Lines" book and I am looking forward to digging into those as well.
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Thanks ThuzzleFump. I have Friedland's Bass Method so I think I'll go with his Walking Book. I learned to read treble clef long ago so it wasn't too bad reading bass clef in Friedland's other book.
 
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#113
Clef_de_fa said:
Believe it or not, jazz was the pop music a long time ago ... It got too extrem for some and rock was born ... then blues played by jazz player became blues rock which is way way easier and since it got really easy.
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This is what I always wonder when "jazz" is held up as the shining beacon on the hill of musical endeavours. Is it hard or just different. At some point, pre Rock'n'Roll, I assume there wasn't Jazz Music & Easy Music, there was just Pop music. (Gershwin, Glen Miller etc) and to be considered a musician, that's what you played.

Did academia elevate Jazz to being seen as something so complex that the "everyday" musician found it too complex? Or did the advent of simple rock-based tunes mean the everyday musician could follow a path of less resistance and now the relative amount of work required to master the pop tunes of first half of the 1900s is considered "hard" when 100 years ago it was considered normal?

I don't play Jazz, but do consider the ability to comfortably walk a basic line for a jazz blues/rhythm changes to be a requirement of a well-rounded bass player. Its something that I actually need to practice, other things I can just learn and know. Walking basslines is something I have to put effort into. Too hard.
 
#115
How to get good enough to land a jazz gig:

1. Buy "The Real Book" (chord charts for jazz standards)
2. Learn how to read the chord symbols and the notes each contain
3. Listen, listen, and listen more to walking jazz bass lines by the masters
4. Learn how to walk over the common chord progressions, like 2-5-1
5. Swing like a gate
Regarding number 5...you can't really learn this...you either have it or you don't. And it is critical. So that's why jazz is not for everyone.
 
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#116
Bassheart365 said:
How to get good enough to land a jazz gig:

1. Buy "The Real Book" (chord charts for jazz standards)
2. Learn how to read the chord symbols and the notes each contain
3. Listen, listen, and listen more to walking jazz bass lines by the masters
4. Learn how to walk over the common chord progressions, like 2-5-1
5. Swing like a gate
Regarding number 5...you can't really learn this...you either have it or you don't. And it is critical. So that's why jazz is not for everyone.
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Agreed 100%. I'll add LEARN YOUR CHORD TONES!!! The 1-3-5-7 of every chord.

I'm training myself to, for example, if the chart says Bb-7, find all four chord tones all over the neck in the blink of an eye.
 
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#119
Fabio_MIJ said:
I do not agree, imho, if you learn a bit of jazz, you will look at rock tunes from another perspective. You will create more effective lines and enjoy the performance.
A lot of great rock players have also a strong jazz background (see for example TOTO).
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Slightly from far left field - but Willie Nelson is a pretty good jazz guitarist. I know it's hard to imagine (for some) but watch some of his up and down the neck moves in those 'simple CW' songs some time.
 

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