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Just Got an Ampeg SVT-DI to try out

#81
logdrum said:
DI's to sound like mic'ed cabs will need to go to a Cab Sim or IR when recording or like a 2 Notes torpedo. I have never seen them used for bass.
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I do it with high and low pass filters, maybe a little light overdrive when applicable. For a couple years, I insisted on micing my cab with no DI, but some sound techs rebelled against it, and I just came to the conclusion it's a DI world for bass and it will never change. So I spent years trying to make my DI sound like a mic'ed tube amp, and a tube DI with a sizable output transformer or a tube amp being run speaker level to the board with high and low pass filters to emulate a tweeterless cab became the ticket for me.
 
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#82
Son of Wobble said:
My thought also. seems ready to drop into the session, and any additional compression could be covered in mastering.
Also seemed to have a slight compression that softened the transients heard in the other versions.
If this is an inherent quality of the DI and not just a happy occurrence of this particular recording, I would roll with the DI, especially when trying to, say, do a whole session of basic tracking for an album in just a few days.

What is the circuit on these like, Jimmy? Anything to watch out for when buying an old used unit (the only kind now existent) , or is it as simple as, "Sounds good, is good?" I have watched the Ampeg tube DI occasionally float past at decent prices on CL Los Angeles for a few years now. Your test suggests it might rate some "lost classic" status now. And as @somebrains observes above, maybe it was a bit ahead/out of its time when released.
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q3o6sjt-png.png


Found this pic with a Google search. It's a tube DI with output transformer, seems fairly straightforward to me. I think the "sounds good is good" approach is as good a way to choose one as any. And yes, I would definitely rate it as a "lost classic," although apparently it was intended as a vanity project for Obeid Khan and SLM never intended to market it to a wide audience. And then the REDDI came along and exploded the high end tube DI scene. Personally, I think things would be different now if Yamaha decided to do it again or something similar, but I'd like to talk to them about a couple tweaks I'd suggest first :D
 
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#83
JimmyM said:
I do it with high and low pass filters, maybe a little light overdrive when applicable. For a couple years, I insisted on micing my cab with no DI, but some sound techs rebelled against it, and I just came to the conclusion it's a DI world for bass and it will never change. So I spent years trying to make my DI sound like a mic'ed tube amp, and a tube DI with a sizable output transformer or a tube amp being run speaker level to the board with high and low pass filters to emulate a tweeterless cab became the ticket for me.
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Great to know. Even before HPF became a buzz word, a good FOH guy would use the HPF or low/rumble cut on the board and an experienced bass player would maybe even cut the bass on his bass amp EQ, defeat the low switch and on his/her bass go less than the detents on the EQ.

But sometime a disemboweling murky low end is needed for the piece and we should gladly oblige.
 
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#84
JimmyM said:
I do it with high and low pass filters, maybe a little light overdrive when applicable. For a couple years, I insisted on micing my cab with no DI, but some sound techs rebelled against it, and I just came to the conclusion it's a DI world for bass and it will never change. So I spent years trying to make my DI sound like a mic'ed tube amp, and a tube DI with a sizable output transformer or a tube amp being run speaker level to the board with high and low pass filters to emulate a tweeterless cab became the ticket for me.
Click to expand...

Do you remember what a slow crawl to this point was?
I mean cab sims were not something cheap that was onboard pedals for a long time.
The Jenga stack of mixing wet and dry signal to get final output that was "live like" made the studio guys I knew in California go nuts.

You really got the feeling that bass wasn't something they cared or thought too much about. The attitude was have the guy plug in and play, then go away so they can record the important parts. Maybe you'd get an engineer that would want to spend time on a big name act that was bass forward or bass notable but it seemed rare.
 
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#85
somebrains said:
Do you remember what a slow crawl to this point was?
I mean cab sims were not something cheap that was onboard pedals for a long time.
The Jenga stack of mixing wet and dry signal to get final output that was "live like" made the studio guys I knew in California go nuts.

You really got the feeling that bass wasn't something they cared or thought too much about. The attitude was have the guy plug in and play, then go away so they can record the important parts. Maybe you'd get an engineer that would want to spend time on a big name act that was bass forward or bass notable but it seemed rare.
Click to expand...
Oh man, I totally lived through it all since the 70's! It's still that way for many, although it's gotten a lot better since the 2000's when big fat tube amp tones came back into fashion.
 
#86
JimmyM said:
Oh man, I totally lived through it all since the 70's! It's still that way for many, although it's gotten a lot better since the 2000's when big fat tube amp tones came back into fashion.
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When you were a kid did you guys trade stuff to see shows?

I had buddies whose uncles owned a carniceria in San Francisco that would trade meat, tacos, and burritos to dudes that worked the door of dives and clubs. Basically they fed these guys and I'm not sure they pay for anything to this day.

My grandfather owned a bunch of liquor stores, so cartons of cigarettes and bottles paid my way.

We had a hunger for music, it was one of the few things that kept us out of hanging in a parking lot valeting cars as a cover to commit crime.

For us if we wanted to visit my friends mom as an excuse to see who was recording at the Record Plant we'd bring them food, smokes, and booze.
 
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#87
somebrains said:
When you were a kid did you guys trade stuff to see shows?

I had buddies whose uncles owned a carniceria in San Francisco that would trade meat, tacos, and burritos to dudes that worked the door of dives and clubs. Basically they fed these guys and I'm not sure they pay for anything to this day.

My grandfather owned a bunch of liquor stores, so cartons of cigarettes and bottles paid my way.

We had a hunger for music, it was one of the few things that kept us out of hanging in a parking lot valeting cars as a cover to commit crime.

For us if we wanted to visit my friends mom as an excuse to see who was recording at the Record Plant we'd bring them food, smokes, and booze.
Click to expand...
Nah, cover charges were cheap enough back in the 70's and most of the 80's that I didn't need to go broke to see the biggest acts of the day.
 
#91
So for a guy who not long ago hated DI's, I sure have been enjoying playing with all these high end DI's. Makes a real difference in my opinion of DI's when they sound like tube amps. Almost makes me want to start a high end tube DI collection and go back and snag some others that I might have missed. And then I price them and realize that I am perfectly happy with "only" my REDDI and PF-50T. However, I am always willing to take your high-end DI's I don't have as donations to the cause :D

So here's a little summing up of my thoughts on the REDDI and SVT-DI and how they compare and contrast for those who don't want to read the whole thread:

REDDI:

It's the industry standard tube DI for a reason. It's got a near-flat response frequency response combined with true tube amp tone, and while its overall vibe is certainly based on Ampeg tube amps, a lot of fans of other gear like it, too, even many players who dig solid state. And the biggest complaint that people have about it, the thru jack not having the REDDI sound, is something that I consider a good thing, as passing the sound into SS amps isn't going to magically turn them into tube amps, although I do notice an improvement in tone when I've run the REDDI XLR into the front end of my SS amps. But I'd rather have it bypassed out of my amp than have it do something I may not like to the house sound or my amp. It's bigger and heavier than the SVT-DI, but it's not unmanageable. It's been a longtime favorite of mine and this bout of experimentation did nothing to change my mind.

SVT-DI:

Its frequency response is less trebly than the REDDI and its feel is slightly warmer and gooier, but its overall sound quality is Ampeg tubey and as good as anything on the market. Doesn't have a volume knob, but its output is on par with most DI's without a volume knob, and can be cut by -6db if you need it. It's a little more versatile than the REDDI in that you can turn the tube sound on and off in both the XLR and amp separately, and the tube switch for the 1/4" thru jack affects the XLR out, giving you two different sounds and output levels, with the hotter sound a bit more trebly than the other but still pretty similar. I favor the hotter sound, but to get it, you have to turn the tube sound on in the thru jack, and while it does add some nice tube warmth to a solid state amp, it has the undesirable effect of grossly boosting the mids at 800hz into your amp. On the bright side, though I prefer the brighter XLR tone, the sound of the XLR with the thru jack's tube sound off is still magnificent and just as usable.

If I had to pick a desert island standalone DI, I'd be very torn between these two and would probably just throw myself off the island instead. What's not to love about either? They're different but more similar than different. Both are built like tanks. Both sound like Ampeg. Both would be welcome in any studio or live venue in the world. All a moot point anyway...I have to send the SVT-DI back eventually so the decision's already been made for me. I think I can somehow muddle through so no need to send sympathy cards, but much respect to the designers of all this great gear!
 
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#92
JimmyM said:
So for a guy who not long ago hated DI's, I sure have been enjoying playing with all these high end DI's. Makes a real difference in my opinion of DI's when they sound like tube amps. Almost makes me want to start a high end tube DI collection and go back and snag some others that I might have missed. And then I price them and realize that I am perfectly happy with "only" my REDDI and PF-50T. However, I am always willing to take your high-end DI's I don't have as donations to the cause :D

So here's a little summing up of my thoughts on the REDDI and SVT-DI and how they compare and contrast for those who don't want to read the whole thread:

REDDI:

It's the industry standard tube DI for a reason. It's got a near-flat response frequency response combined with true tube amp tone, and while its overall vibe is certainly based on Ampeg tube amps, a lot of fans of other gear like it, too, even many players who dig solid state. And the biggest complaint that people have about it, the thru jack not having the REDDI sound, is something that I consider a good thing, as passing the sound into SS amps isn't going to magically turn them into tube amps, although I do notice an improvement in tone when I've run the REDDI XLR into the front end of my SS amps. But I'd rather have it bypassed out of my amp than have it do something I may not like to the house sound or my amp. It's bigger and heavier than the SVT-DI, but it's not unmanageable. It's been a longtime favorite of mine and this bout of experimentation did nothing to change my mind.

SVT-DI:

Its frequency response is less trebly than the REDDI and its feel is slightly warmer and gooier, but its overall sound quality is Ampeg tubey and as good as anything on the market. Doesn't have a volume knob, but its output is on par with most DI's without a volume knob, and can be cut by -6db if you need it. It's a little more versatile than the REDDI in that you can turn the tube sound on and off in both the XLR and amp separately, and the tube switch for the 1/4" thru jack affects the XLR out, giving you two different sounds and output levels, with the hotter sound a bit more trebly than the other but still pretty similar. I favor the hotter sound, but to get it, you have to turn the tube sound on in the thru jack, and while it does add some nice tube warmth to a solid state amp, it has the undesirable effect of grossly boosting the mids at 800hz into your amp. On the bright side, though I prefer the brighter XLR tone, the sound of the XLR with the thru jack's tube sound off is still magnificent and just as usable.

If I had to pick a desert island standalone DI, I'd be very torn between these two and would probably just throw myself off the island instead. What's not to love about either? They're different but more similar than different. Both are built like tanks. Both sound like Ampeg. Both would be welcome in any studio or live venue in the world. All a moot point anyway...I have to send the SVT-DI back eventually so the decision's already been made for me. I think I can somehow muddle through so no need to send sympathy cards, but much respect to the designers of all this great gear!
Click to expand...

Don't despair too much @JimmyM there's an SVT-DI for sale in TB classifieds as we speak. :cool:
 
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#96
I was really surprised by how good the SVT-DI sounded.

I ran it through a Bass Rider plugin (Waves). It automatically adjusts the fader level.

The audio file produces an error here, I find that I have to click on the text on my mac and download it to listen to it. A common issue with audio files on TB.
 

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#97
Ok, i need some enlightenment here. Whenever i play, the soundman plugs into my amps DI, whatever that may be. Currently its an SVT2 pro. Occasionally ill get a mike on my 810 as well.

That being said, why would i want this and how would i use it? Is this just a matter of a better sounding signal sent to FOH? Ive never had a prob or complaint using my amps di and ive used GK 800rb, 700rb, 1001rb, 2001rb, ampeg svt4, svt classic, svp pro and so on.
 
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#99
wolfkeller said:
Ok, i need some enlightenment here. Whenever i play, the soundman plugs into my amps DI, whatever that may be. Currently its an SVT2 pro. Occasionally ill get a mike on my 810 as well.

That being said, why would i want this and how would i use it? Is this just a matter of a better sounding signal sent to FOH? Ive never had a prob or complaint using my amps di and ive used GK 800rb, 700rb, 1001rb, 2001rb, ampeg svt4, svt classic, svp pro and so on.
Click to expand...

I'd say that many of those amps you listed have good DIs, and some of them can even be colored quite nicely when run "post".

Whether it's from the tubes, the transformers, or some other baked in magic (circuit frequency response?), the DIs that are being discussed here have a slight sweetening effect on tone. Some users will care about it more than others.

Personally, as much as I appreciate the subtle tonal enhancements, I also tend to feel that they're subtle enough to get lost in any mix I'd typically find myself in. I could totally think of musical styles where it would make more of a difference though. Just my 2c; YMMV. :)
 
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#100
I used to think the differences were too subtle to tell on a gig, too, until I started speaker DI'ing tube amps or using the REDDI. They sure don't seem subtle to me. That said, if anyone uses even the whirlwind Imp 2 and sounds bad, I'm only partially blaming the Imp 2.
 
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